I grew up with an emotionally abusive father and extremely controlling mother, in a crazy-controlling church. So, now, being out of the church, I'm suddenly noticing how critical my husband can be. Maybe I'm too sensitive, maybe his criticism is warranted. He mostly complains about the house or my child not being clean enough or me not making money. We moved a year ago. Before we moved I had a great job. We moved for his job and I haven't been able to find anything here yet. Most days he says he's glad that I'm home with our child, but then he'll hold it over my head that I don't make any money.The biggest thing is I feel like the house is never clean enough. I'm definitely not a clean freak, but I try really hard to keep the house clean because I know he cares. He compares our house to his friend's houses (who don't have any toddlers).

He complained this morning that none of the shirts that he likes for work were hanging in his closet, (they were clean in the laundry room). Yesterday I cleaned for three hours while my child was asleep. He said thanks a few times throughout the day, but then last night he said that I have too much shit on my side of the sink in the bathroom. I told him I cleaned the whole bathroom and he pointed to a spot on the counter and said it wasn't clean. Also, while I was cleaning yesterday, he came home for lunch. I was cleaning out and organizing the pantry and he says, "Wow, someone must be coming over"

He gives me back handed compliments all the time, that are more like an insult. He says something like, you've really gotten better at cleaning lately or something to that affect.

I'm on an antidepressant and have been pretty emotional the past few months, so he may be overwhelmed with that. He usually says rude things in a semi-joking way and then says that he was just messing with me. I've told him over and over and over that I don't like him doing that.

Since leaving the church I've also had some health problems and been depressed, so I gained about 20 pounds. I'm usually a very healthy person, but I honestly turned to food and couldn't exercise. So, he's been complaining about my weight a lot. He yelled at me one night while we were arguing saying, "why the fu** do you eat pizza and icecream every night?!" (which is not even close to the truth)

Anyway, I am tired of it. I am exhausted emotionally. What should I do?! Am I being too sensitive or does this sound legitimately critical?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2014 09:13AM by yesnomaybe.

Do you talk to him that way? If not, why? Because it would be too mean and/or disrespectful?

Would you talk to a stranger that way?

Then why do you even consider that it might be okay for him to talk to you that way?

This isn't about you. It's about him. Some insecurity within himself is causing him to take it out on you.

My husband does that too. I work full time but from my home. This encourages neighbors to send their children to my home after school which causes messes, and encourages my husband to think of me as a housewife having lots of time to cook and do chores. Truth is, my company requires a lot of me, and the job is very stressful.

He notices what isn't done, not what I've done.
Somehow I quit taking it personally. I try and keep it nice but don't respond negatively if he notices something out of place.

I noticed he is unhappy if things are not organized. If I fail at meeting that expectation I shrug it off. I know I can only do what I can do, and if he doesn't like the way it is, he can lend a hand. His arms are not broken.

Sounds abusive to me. Abuse doesn't have to physical or screaming rages. It can be little "jokes" aimed at humiliating you, it can be repeated unreasonable criticism of things that are actually normal or that are not your fault, but somehow you are still held "responsible" for fixing. It can be the crazy-making criticism where no matter what you do, it is always wrong.

If the way he speaks to you is making you feel depressed, inferior, incompetent or worthless, then it is a problem. And it's your problem too (not just his) because you are on the receiving end.

Would marriage counselling help, so you can discuss the issues? Or some sort of agreement where he contributes to the housework as well eg ironing, cleaning or looking after his own child, instead of you doing it all. Can you explain to him how much his constant belittling and criticism is hurting you?

Caring for a toddler is 24/7 work. What is he working? 8/5? He needs to pull his weight too, not just expect you to maintain the house, care for your child (his child too) AND earn $ to support the family.

I have heard of novel solutions for problems like this: iron your own damn shirt, you big baby. If the dirt bothers you that much, grab a vacuum. Household appliances are safe for use by men too, these days.

Recommended reading: "The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Dr. Patricia Evans.

icedtea Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Recommended reading: "The Verbally Abusive
> Relationship" by Dr. Patricia Evans.


I also recommend reading her book. We tend to think that a relationship is not abusive if there is no physical violence, but verbal abuse is damaging and you need to put a stop to it now.

and surprisingly, it has nothing to do with how much sh!t you have on the bathroom counter.

You are defending yourself when he attacks. You're even defending yourself to us here on this forum and all we're doing is listening. Reread what you wrote if you don't believe me.

Since when do you have to answer to him? Who made him the judge of how clean the house is or what a deadbeat you are because you won't go out and get a job and he has to pay for everything, for Christ's sake? Apparently, you think there's something wrong with you not working despite the fact that you gave up your good job so he could get a better job.

I can't tell you how to not feel defensive around him. He doesn't make you feel defensive. He's just taking advantage of it. But I do think a key component of the solution here is you not feeling like you need to answer to him and that begins with you valuing what you're doing as highly as you're valuing what he's doing. If you can't do that, maybe you should go out and get any job so you can pay a housekeeper and she can take his complaints.

Yes, yes on counseling and all that too.

The antidepressant could be forcing you to see the criticism more. That's what happened to me. Best I can explain it is I think it just took away the worry about all the little things in life, so when he started in on the bad behavior, I recognized it more easily. Mine was much the same way. He was abusive. I started calling him on it. That didn't go over well. Hopefully your husband is not emotionally abusive and can make some changes, and you too, if you're being a bit overly sensitive. There's no reason he can't help out around the house.

Your husband's demeanor is not about your household skills. He is passive-aggressive. He doesn't confront you directly but is continually chipping away at your mental/emotional state indirectly. Is it your leaving the church? His anger at himself? It's something and I would advise you to ask him what it is directly or through counseling. Don't tolerate it too much longer. Please! I can feel your misery and you deserve a better life than you are getting.

I'm not diagnosing this as anything other than just plain old disrespect.

I have never understood why (Well, I get why, but deep down...) some men seem to think they should not be responsible for taking care of their investments and their belongings. Housecleaning is one of those things that adults do. It protects your investment and allows you a clean, safe and healthy environment in which to live.

And there are men all over the world who live alone and they seem to be perfectly capable of cleaning their homes and cooking their own food and getting stuff done like a boss.

I sort of get the argument that, while you are not working outside the home, then the work inside the home is your "job."

Short of couples therapy to work on mutual respect and communication, I would ask him to put his cleanliness standards in writing. How can you ever meet them if he's constantly moving the goal posts? Talk to him about how his criticism makes you feel. If his response is anything other than "ooh, you're right, let's work on this problem together," then yeah. I'd start leaning away from "just disrespect" and closer toward "maybe a tad abusive."

I know he isn't perfect, but I loved this one. When he asked a woman why her husband treated her this way, she thought for a few moments and said, "Because I let him.'

Your job isn't necessarily to keep the house clean. Your job right now is taking care of your child.

I used to say about my husband, 'He sucks the joy out of life on a daily basis.' I read it in an Ann Landers column years ago.

You live there, too. It seems to me that MANY husbands do this. My friend--while on a mission with her husband--told me something like your comments about the bathroom counter. He shoved all her stuff into the sink on her side.

TRY to stand up to him.

This is one reason why I don't live with my boyfriend. I don't stand up for myself. If I'm over there too much, he starts snapping at me for stupid little things. I don't have kids with him, so why put myself through that. I have pointed out to him WHY I won't live there. Maybe if I were a stronger individual (I was taught well to defer to men growing up Mormon) I could live with him.

I have to add that I worked with a woman who had been married for a long time. Her husband was sent to Desert Storm (back in the early 1990s). She was amazed how peaceful her house was while he was gone. When he came back, one night she answered the door and could hear him in the kitchen cussing about how she had loaded the dishwasher. She kicked him out that day and never went back.

Your husband NEVER KNOWS when that last straw will come for you.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2014 10:15AM by cl2.

"Maybe I'm too sensitive".

You feel the way you feel. If what he says makes you feel bad, then what's the best solution? For you to stop feeling, or for him to stop being critical? Let's pretend for a moment that you actually ARE a super sensitive person. If that's the case, then he picked you. He's got to learn to be more kind and considerate, rather than blaming you for feeling too much.

You can't really stop your feelings, without creating a whole new set of problems, one of which includes depression, or maybe losing your ability to feel much of ANYTHING. Would you really WANT to do that? But he could stop picking at everything you do. That's a reasonable concession for him to make if he cares about you.

It's been a long time, but I remember the days when I had babies and toddlers. It's virtually impossible to keep the place clean, when you've got a built-in mess maker walking behind you, dumping out toy bins and emptying the kitchen drawers. I remember getting really frustrated about it, and I didn't have my husband criticizing me for it.

But the difficulty of keeping the house clean isn't the point. The point is that your husband thinks it's okay to put you down, and that he gets to decide if you are meeting his cleaning expectations. Tell him to clean it himself. I would read up on emotional abuse (Patricia Evans is a good recommendation), maybe get some counseling, and confront him if you feel it's safe.

It's not okay for him to put you down, even if he says it's a "joke". If it hurts, it's a bad joke. BTW, that's the oldest excuse in the book that abusers use when you call them on saying something awful.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2014 10:22AM by imaworkinonit.

Woohoo!!! Same here; I am so DONE with my soon-to-be ex's critism, negativity, and lack of appreciation. I finally took a stand for myself- I no longer do his laundry/ironing, make his meals, or bust my butt helping him with his projects.
I work full-time, and no one does these things for me.
Thing is...I LOVE doting and care-giving, but not when I am criticized or when what I do is not appreciated.

With all the stories of bad, abusive husbands, you would think women would stay away from them. Why do women keep getting married? Sperm donors are available.

I have warned my daughters for years to stay away from boys and men, because they will end up disappointed and angry.

They don't listen to me.

The fantasy about marriage is just like the fantasy about the church.

Lewis CK has a great stand-up routine about this very topic. He can't understand how any man ever gets laid because the most dangerous threat to women, in general, is men.

Check it, too funny:
http://www.cleanvideosearch.com/media/action/yt/watch?v=y4LkrQCyIz8

Sounds like my ex. He would come home from work and do a house check. He'd look in every room and comment on what needed to be done, or find something wrong with what I did do.

If i'd spent the day painting a room, he'd complain because it wasn't finished, or he didn't like the color, or the way I did it. It got to the point he didn't have to be around. I could hear his every criticism before he walked in the door.

After 8 years of this, I became suicidal, depressed, anxious, and so withdrawn I could hardly speak to people. I was sure everyone was criticizing me in their minds.

Then he did me a big favor. He started drinking the grocery money. He had a couple of girlfriends. We lived 3000 miles from home. I had no friends for support. I had to find some, and fast. I went to al-anon. Within a year I was no longer suicidal,depressed, or anxious. I had a good support system. I found a good attorney.

I divorced him. It was the best thing I ever did. It was also the best thing i've done for my kids.

This thread hits uncomfortably close to home. I once behaved much as yesnomaybe's DH.

I was brought up by a very strict TBM father for whom perfection was the only option. With that as my role model, I tended to treat my wife and children similarly. It caused my wife and kids a lot of emotional pain.

It wasn't until I started questioning TSCC that I realized what I was doing. Now I hate myself for what I did for 13 years of marriage. I really regret the damage I did to my wife and kids and I'm amazed my DW stayed with me. Part of me wants to blame my father and TSCC for the perfection mentality, but on the other hand, there should be no excuse for that stuff.

I'm not sure where I'm going with this, but I guess it's just to say that men can change, if they see the light.

Start a log. Write the time, date, and his exact comment. Don't tell him. It will be invaluable in counseling, but mostly it will help you be objective.

I am so sorry for what you are going through. I can't imagine my husband treating me that way, and if he did, I would've been divorced a long time ago. What do you gain from this relationship? It sounds very abusive and unhealthy. You deserve to be treated with respect. A marriage is a partnership. His contribution doesn't end with an 8-5 day job. It's time for a serious discussion about what you both expect and want out of each other. And if I were you, I would be bringing some ultimatums to the table.

Thank you all for the insight, advice and support, I really need it. I just found out that my husband is going out of town all of next week for work and I'm ecstatic...that's probably not a good sign. He just came home for lunch and we talked about it. He said he was sorry. It's confusing. I've told him quite a few times that I wanted marriage counseling. I also told him I was thinking about us separating for a while. That was a few months ago. Thank you all for letting me vent.

You should absolutely read Evans book next week while he is gone. One of the things she wrote that hit home for me is 'do you dread your spouse coming home?' I realized how much happier I was when he was gone on business or working late. How my stomach churned when I heard the garage door open to signal he was home because I didn't know what kind of 'mood' he was in - would he he find something to complain about or just ignore me?

Couldn't hurt to just get counseling on your own, without him. You may gain some insight and perspective and may or may not want him to join you. Maybe you'll just DTMFA. Maybe you'll get him into counseling with you and you'll work it out together.

No telling until you get help.

personally I'd sit down and talk about it with him. As fun as this forum is, you need to talk to him. Sometimes people are dense. Explain it very clearly. I've been amazed at the things my wife and I didn't realize because we didn't actually tell the other person.

Why can't he help do laundry or whatever? Ask it nicely and get a real answer.
Why does stuff on the counter matter? Where would he rather have it?

It's his house too so he should be willing to help take care of it. And the same for your kids, once they are old enough, I'm sure you will be expecting them to do their share.

As for the weight thing. Well... that's the society we live in. If you can exercise and lose weight (not sure what you're health issues are) than you should. Exercise and health eating helps you feel better, look better, etc. He shouldn't be a jerk about it, but if you both know it's a problem, make a plan.

Kind of on the same lines as what some of the others have said, but I remember a quote from Harmon Killebrew (I think), who was playing baseball with his sons on the grass. His wife scolded them for ruining the yard with their rough play, and he told her that it was their priorities to raise boys, not grass.


My point is that your priority should be to raise good, respectful kids. There's no grade for having a clean house, as long as it's not like one of those you see on those hoarding shows.

I don't think your problem is that unusual. A lot of men simply don't understand that caring for a toddler is a full time job and that the house is not going to look perfect as a result.

I agree with those who say that he should be pointed in the direction of a sponge or vacuum. Stand up for yourself. I would also start scheduling some weekends away. Tell him that you expect to come back on Sunday night to a perfectly clean home, folded laundry, ironed clothes, etc. since he has nothing better to do on the weekend.

There is the "let's switch jobs for a day" game that, I suppose, could be eye-opening.

Thing is, men don't always pressure themselves to do everything just so and perfectly all the time. I was thinking of that Micheal Keaton movie, Mr. Mom, where he got laid off and she went to work. He somehow managed to pull off all the "mom" things his wife had previously done, but it was way more sloppy and not on a tight schedule or anything. The difference is, usually wives don't come home and berate the husband for not getting his chores done properly. Those who do are called "nags."

So you could try turnabout is fair play, but be prepared to have that not really work out like you planned.

I think it would be more effective to use I statements. "When you criticize the housework, that makes me feel as though you don't respect me or appreciate what I do all day. Can we talk about that?" Maybe he thinks she doesn't appreciate him and they could both take a lesson on gratitude.

I'm not saying I know they're both taking one another for granted, just that that is as much a possibility as anything else.

In my opinion what you are going through is more dangerous that if you had black and blue marks attesting to the fact that you have been beaten. I say this from personal experience and from counseling and literature. Verbal abuse is damaging, belittling, and ugly. and it makes the person on the receiving end doubt that they have the right to be alive.

You DO NOT deserve this. You have the right to be treated with dignity and respect and you are not being treated in this manner. Please read the book that has been suggested, and I would also so encourage you to seek professional counseling. I care about you, and wish you the happiness and joy that you deserve to have. Please keep us posted.

When some of my older generation relatives died, one of the things I inherited (because I was the only one who cared) was their personal "libraries" (books...magazines...articles they had cut out over the decades).

There were a considerable number of LADIES HOME JOURNAL magazines from the mid-1950s through mid-1970s, and one of the features in the earlier magazines were monthly stories about married couples who had faced problems, "solved" their problems (at least, according to the magazine), and were now "happy." I put these words in quotation marks because it didn't seem to me AT ALL that most of these problems had been "solved," nor that these couples were "happy" (except, perhaps, in a Stepford-like kind of way). But these were supposed to be heartwarming success stories of couples who dealt with real life problems and then lived blissful lives together forevermore.

One story has stuck in my head FOREVER: A Lutheran couple (I remember, because my Camp Fire Girls leader was Lutheran, and thus I was exposed to a great deal of Lutheran "life" along the way when I was growing up--though I, personally, was never, ever Lutheran or anything even remotely close to it ;) ).

Although both were devoted to their church, there was an imbalance in their commitment and belief. The wife (and mother of their several children) was far more dedicated in her belief than was her also-believing husband, and she wanted him to be quite a bit MORE dedicated than SHE was. It was a considerable problem to them for several years and caused many arguments. According to the article, he sincerely prayed for guidance for a very long time (at least two or three years) and finally, one day, he had THE answer: He would become a Lutheran pastor.

His wife was considerably taken aback by this turn of events: he was going from being less-zealous than she was to contemplating become "the" religious authority in the future communities they would live in. On the one hand, her own prayers had been answered. On the other hand, she was very, very scared as to what this might do to their marriage and his commitment and time to HER, and to their growing children. If he did this, he faced a number of years (I forget how many) going through Lutheran seminary (graduate school university level), and they would have very little money to live on (and to raise their children). He would have to spend virtually all of his time going to classes, studying until all hours of the early morning, and interning in various Lutheran churches and facilities (retirement/assisted living homes...orphanages...Lutheran centers of various kinds--food, childcare, medical care, clothing supply centers, etc.--in areas of great poverty).

But she had faith in God that God was leading her and her husband to where they "ought" to be (she was simultaneously aware that her "prayers had been answered," and also scared out of her wits that this had actually HAPPENED...and here were the natural consequences of her prayers being answered!).

He applied for, and was accepted into, the ministerial training program at some Lutheran-sponsored university. It took several years, but he DID become a Lutheran minister (somewhere about the time that their kids started leaving home), and now--as this article was written--he had been a Lutheran minister in a number of communities/states since he had been ordained.

That's the "surface" story, the feel good story for LADIES HOME JOURNAL readers. First, marital "darkness"...and then...marital SUCCESS!!! Yay!!!!!!!

Underneath, however, there was a much darker story being told (that the writer of the article seemed totally oblivious of). This husband was a stereotypical man of the 1950s, and he would not--of course!--do a single thing about the house or regarding childcare (even the obvious, simple stuff like changing diapers for the succeeding, newborn, children they had--even when she was so sick she could not get out of bed). Instead, he would chastise her for being "weak" and not fulfilling her obligations as a "proper wife" (under God). HIS job, as he saw it, for all those years was to go to school and study...everything else was HER responsibility...even if one of the kids broke their leg or came down with the measles while she was trying to take care of a newborn baby. (If you're wondering how they lived financially, both families--his and hers--each contributed half of the couple's monthly financial requirements, so that he could become a minister, but the couple was always on an EXTREMELY tight budget because he "had no time" to work, and she--of course--was basically "forbidden" to work, even if she had been able to take the time to do it.)

One anecdote has always stuck with me: He was continually unhappy that their house was not always picture-perfect...even though they had (five, seven...I don't remember) kids at various ages from newborn to adolescent. When he would get home from his classes, or the library, or his minister-in-training intern responsibilities, he would habitually FIRST walk around the house, with her beside him, and would tell her what was wrong. (Like a military inspection of living quarters.) She would be ashamed, always, that she had--once gain--"let him (and God!) down," and she would always immediately correct whatever was wrong and tell him she would never allow that situation to happen again.

The article cited the time when she had spent HOURS getting the house as perfect as it could possibly be. When she arrived home, and they took "their" inspection tour, everything was (for the very first time!) "in order" (he had nothing to criticize), until they went into the kitchen. He looked at the refrigerator door and pointed: "What is THAT???" It was a child's fingerprint that had not been removed from the door. She said in the article that it was one of the biggest let-downs in her life...that she had tried SO HARD to be what he (and God!) wanted her to be, and she thought that--finally!!!--she had "passed."

But that single fingerprint showed that she had failed him, and failed God, once again...and she said that it was THAT moment that she realized the totality of "the gospel" and how "destined" even the most faithful of God's followers are to "missing the mark." She said it was one of the most important spiritual lessons of her life, and she was so grateful to her husband for showing her that--although she had to keep TRYING to meet the required standard--she also would always fail...because this was God's way and the way of human nature (to fail...no matter HOW much we try to meet the requirements God asks of us).

And now, with that lesson learned, she could finally relax and finally fully "love" her husband in the way that God intended. Her husband was "God" in her life, and her real "job" was to always fail, regardless of how hard she tried.

I have NEVER forgotten that story.

And I feel sorry for that woman (who undoubtedly died sometime back) for this very moment. Every time I think of this story I get sad...even now...even right at this moment.

Abusive husband??? Oh...yeah.

But that's not what they called it in the 1950s in LADIES HOME JOURNAL. Back then, this behavior was proof of "love." :(



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 03/04/2014 02:58PM by tevai.