believe the mormon church is "true".

There is just too much evidence that shows that it is all based on a hoax that got out of control.

As an adult believer, I wasn't informed, I was young and dumb and that is my excuse. I am sticking to it.

When the internet arrived, I learned about all of the church approved and other sources I could read and... Shazam - I was informed.

Do all of the seemingly intelligent adults that surround me on a daily basis choose to remain uninformed.

If they become informed, how in the world do they maintain the facade?

Are some people just better at justification than I am?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2014 01:08PM by michaelff.

Well, that's just it. They know that by becoming informed, it will be difficult to continue on in the same manner. They may need to stay in for any number of reasons. So they keep their head buried in the sand and go along to get along.

I remember one of the things I told myself was that regardless of what I found when I decided to research the truth was that I would no longer ignore what I found.

That is such a hard thing to do. For many TBM's giving up their life's work and beliefs to quit the lie is just too hard.

I mean - if I thought the church was absolutely true..and that belief was based on a testimony that the book of mormon was actually translated from a set of golden plates written by Jews writing in reformed egyptian...

and than I found out that there was a mountain of evidence proving that this was false -

and that mountain caused me to have at least some doubt as to the books "divine" origin;

How could I tell my children that the church was "true" in the same way I originally believed?

Wouldn't I have to at least qualify my statement each time I made that claim?

Or are you saying that most true believing members never get that far.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2014 01:27PM by michaelff.

In my opinion, you would have to at least qualify your statement to remain honest with yourself and your children.

But it is a cult, so "fake till you make it" and avoid less useful truths and "doubt your doubts" trump qualifying your testimony to your children.

It seems like there are three (maybe more) types of behavior in regards to belief in the church.

1). Those who believe the church is true from some visceral level that has nothing to do with evidence and no evidence against it will ever change their mind. It works for them and they're never going to give that up.

2). Those who have had good experiences in the church and it works for them. They have niggling doubts -- or outright doubts, but they're not going to go there, because it works for them. They don't bare their testimony or claim it's truthful to anyone. They don't want to find out the truth because it would call on them to get truly honest about it and they don't want to have that kind of disruption in their (and their families, professional, etc) life.

30. Those who have good experiences in the church and yet they suspect something is amiss. They know they're going to have to get to the bottom of it, but they know that if they do, it could destroy everything they've built their life on. Regardless of that fact, they have to know the truth and they set about trying to find answers no matter what the outcome.

Devoted Exmo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It seems like there are three (maybe more) types
> of behavior in regards to belief in the church.
>
> 1). Those who believe the church is true from some
> visceral level that has nothing to do with
> evidence and no evidence against it will ever
> change their mind. It works for them and they're
> never going to give that up.
>
> 2). Those who have had good experiences in the
> church and it works for them. They have niggling
> doubts -- or outright doubts, but they're not
> going to go there, because it works for them.
> They don't bare their testimony or claim it's
> truthful to anyone. They don't want to find out
> the truth because it would call on them to get
> truly honest about it and they don't want to have
> that kind of disruption in their (and their
> families, professional, etc) life.
>
> 30. Those who have good experiences in the church
> and yet they suspect something is amiss. They
> know they're going to have to get to the bottom of
> it, but they know that if they do, it could
> destroy everything they've built their life on.
> Regardless of that fact, they have to know the
> truth and they set about trying to find answers no
> matter what the outcome.

I think these are very insightful answers. For me, #3 describes me perfectly. I grew up in the church and never thought to question it. It's just what we did. How could my parents, leaders, and friends be wrong? It wasn't until about 5 years ago that I really started to think about some of the teachings and how they simply didn't make any sense, not to mention how bizarre half of it was. Church was something to be endured. Finally, one day, I decided I needed to figure out what the heck I was doing. That's the day I finally realized it was all man made doctrine and cover ups.

It was really really hard to go through, as some people have said, like a bad breakup or a death in the family. I cried at times, literally cried tears of pain and sorrow, for all I endured and was led to believe at the hands of the church. I can see why some people would rather not pull their heads out of the sand. It's been a process for me. I've gotten over the hurt for the most part, but still have a lot of anger.

I can't understand how those that know it's not true keep going. Since I've found out it's all a sham, I haven't set foot inside church again, the thought makes me claustrophobic.

that any supposed God would care if you are hetero or gay?

Oh, yeah, it's in that book written by Bronze Age nomadic shepherds. Yeah, THAT'S more credible than the Book of Mormon... <SMDH>

Jesus is likely just Hercules in Jewish form.

It is hypocritical to claim that the Bible is factual, that Jesus is the example Christian, and than to claim per the Old Testament, that non-hetero humans will go to hell.

Maybe what you are trying to say in relation to the question posed is that humans are capable of stretching their minds around anything that helps them deal with their current "reality" no matter the amount of evidence to the contrary.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2014 02:02PM by michaelff.

deal with current reality, and more about many humans simply needing to be told what to believe and how to act. And that despite the "independence" so many people claim.

Heck, shepherds at that time doubtless couldn't read or write at all. The various scriptures were written by anonymous scribes, men of learning for their times, who wrote down what were essentially folk tales largely borrowed from other nearby cultures. Doesnt make it any more or less holy, godly or true, but shepherds? No way. Barbaric, violent, ghastly, improbable still at best? You betcha.

hard, by letting others tell them how to live and think - much easier that way.

Maybe we all do it to some extent but in the LDS church and many other Christian churches I find that it is taken to a another level.

I get the sense that many take their Children to Church in hopes that the Church will raise them. Takes the pressure off. Just show up, pay a fee and do/think what you are told.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/05/2014 02:07PM by michaelff.

Take your pick...it's either self-inflicted ignorance or willful ignorance to remain oblivious to the truth that's available.

The fear of embarrassment of having to admit to your spouse, your kids and extended family that you are an ignorant ass and that you made a mistake about the veracity of the church is stronger than just play-acting for the rest of your life.

That is the reason seemingly intelligent adults wish to remain uninformed and or never act on the truth.

Honest, intelligent and critical-thinking adults believe that Faith is what you use until better information comes along.

Mormons don't see it that way...they use Faith as a blanket to simply cover up the uncomfortable truths and information that they are presented with...until that blanket simply gets too heavy for their shelf.

Or so it seems to me...

the whole "Emperor has no clothes" thing.

Certain people see the naked Emperor, smile and wave back.

Certain people see the naked Emperor look around and say WTF is going on.

I just don't understand the first group and I have to resort to a belief that they just don't see the nudity.

Either that or the Emperor isn't as naked as I think he is OR

people are really just dishonest with themselves and everyone else on a regular basis.

Then there's the type who says, "I don't care if it's true, or not. It's still the best place to be."