My parents are in town for a visit, and for the most part we've avoided direct discussions on religion (although they talk about it plenty with my kids). However, somehow tobacco and the word of wisdom came up this afternoon. I recalled reading on a website recently that tobacco was not useful in treating animal bruises as counseled in WoW. I should have checked the sources more carefully before passing on this information, but the opportunity seemed too good to pass up, so I dismissively told my parents that tobacco wasn't any use in treating animal bruises.

After my comment, it took my dad all of about 2 seconds to Google the topic and find several references about tobacco helping animal bruises to heal more quickly. I rarely bring up negative information about the church to my parents, but the timing was too good to pass. It really irks me that I squandered this opportunity and was wrong. However, the salt in the wound was the look in my parents faces as they read the information they had found. It was obviously a spiritual experience for them and increased their testimony of the prophetic powers of js.

Right now, the score is: parents - 1, apostate son - big fat zero.

Does anyone have any information on tobacco, animals, and the word of wisdom that could help me even the score?

You can google the benefits of tobacco for humans and come up with articles for that. You have to read the entire article to see the benefits they are talking about, not get hooked up on the cigarette issue but stick with the tobacco information. There are several articles that tout the benefits of tobacco for humans. Quite the conundrum.

http://health.howstuffworks.com/wellness/drugs-alcohol/nicotine-health-benefits.htm



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/19/2014 08:23PM by cynthia.

Thanks for the article. My daughter has ulcerative colitis - sounds like she needs to take up smoking to control flare-ups.

As an aside, the use of tobacco to bring remission in ulcerative colitis has been known for several decades, at least. I'm not up on the latest news for the issue any more, but last time I looked, they still didn't know for sure what specific thing or combination of things might be the actual effective ingredients. Using nicotine patches had very mixed results. But several gastroenterologists told me that basically, u.c. was a disease of nonsmokers. Smokers very rarely get it. If a smoker who has a predisposition to the disease stops smoking, he/she will very often become ill. If the person starts to smoke again, the disease will go away.

It was relevant because my father had u.c. extremely severely. He had been healthy all his life, and smoked several packs of cigarettes a day from his early teen years. At 46, he quit smoking. Within the first year after that, he was becoming obviously ill. In the second year he was so sick that they could not find a treatment (this was in the early '60's) that was effective and after lengthy hospitalizations, his doctor basically told my parents that he could not be treated any further. He decided that if he was going to die anyway, he might as well start smoking again, as it was the one thing that he enjoyed that he could still do.

In a few months, he was dramatically improved, and was finally able to go back to work until retirement age and enjoy a fairly normal life completely free of u.c. symptoms. By the time that he did die, he had emphysema, and he died of congestive pneumonia, related to his tobacco use, but he had several decades of a decent quality of life while the tobacco (which ultimately killed him) kept him free of the u.c.

Hopefully, someday they will figure out a way to deliver the health benefits without the risks.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/19/2014 09:18PM by peculiargifts.

Thanks for sharing your experience. I'm glad it worked for your dad and gave him some good years.

My daughter pretty much the same (except hers is Crohn's). I don't think her smoking has healed any internal wounds. But she swears the alcohol in beer is good for her. I do know that the doctor told her when she was nursing that beer was fine but not to take any anti-depressants. Don't ask me what nursing Mormon moms with PPD take.

Actually, my GI says it's the opposite with Crohn's, which I have. Cigarette smoking is worse for Crohn's but better for UC, even though they are related diseases. Weird.

These days if you want to self medicate with nicotine there are better methods than out and out smoking: patches, gum, or vaporizers. Most of the negative stuff from smoking comes from inhaling burnt tobacco and paper, not the nicotine itself.

There are better points to argue with regard to the WoW such as:

-Joseph drank alcohol literally until the day he died.

Wheelock later left "on some errand" and was not "suffered to return." The History of the Church states that:

"Sometime after dinner we sent for some wine. It has been reported by some that this was taken as a sacrament. It was no such thing; our spirits were generally dull and heavy, and it was sent for to revive us. I think it was Captain Jones who went after it, but they would not suffer him to return. I believe we all drank of the wine, and gave some to one or two of the prison guards… (7:101).

-Brigham owned a distillery in Utah and also used tobacco regularly.

There are plenty of others but it goes to show that if this was an inspired commandment, you'd think the prophets would have followed it.

Also, tobacco was used to treat bruises and bee stings before Joseph received the "revelation". It was common folk knowledge and there was nothing novel or prophetic about it.

Yep, your points are definitely better than what I came up with. Hopefully another opportunity will come up to use these.

Those are good points but TBM's will dismiss them as anti Mormon.

What were the specific sources your father found? Do we know they weren't created by Mormons? Was there actual scientifically and competently conducted medical research that was cited? I looked on Wikipedia, under the topic of treatment for bruises and, uhhhh, NOTHING about using tobacco:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruise#Treatment


Also, under "Health Effects of Tobacco," nothing about using tobacco to heal bruises (or accomplish anything else positive, for that matter):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_effects_of_tobacco

Unfortunately, they were independent articles. Following is one example. I couldn't find the others off-hand. I could probably poke holes in some of the articles, but I think it would just sound like sour grapes and show my parents how hard hearted I have become


http://www.nytimes.com/1981/04/28/science/science-watch-no-help-for-the-hungry.html

The "research" was conducted by a BYU professor--hardly an objective, disinterested party:

"Healing Effects of Tobacco Juice

"People in the rural South used to swear by the healing properties of tobacco juice applied to, say, a bee or wasp sting, and to some it still may be the home remedy of choice. Now scientists are catching up with folk wisdom. Recent research indicates that bruises treated with tobacco juice heal 20 percent faster than untreated bruises.

"Dr. Rulon S. Francis, a scientist at the Human Performance Research Center at Brigham Young University, began investigating the healing effects of tobacco after a member of the university's athletic department returned from the 1971 Balkan Games in Yugoslavia with stories about trainers spraying a commercially manufactured tobacco spray on basketball players' bruises.

"To evaluate the treatment scientifically, Dr. Francis wounded the thighs of 80 rats to create identical bruises. Commercially distilled tobacco juice was painted on the thighs of 40 rats, with the other 40 receiving applications of distilled water. Dr. Francis reported that there were 20 percent more healing cells (granular white blood cells, among others) in the tobacco-treated tissues, and the size of the bruises decreased 20 percent faster when treated with tobacco.

"Dr. Francis, who is conducting further research, said that no one seems to know what substance in tobacco could account for the phenomenon."

Was the research peer reviewed? Was it duplicated by any other scientists who had no religious stake in the outcome? A healing rate improvement of twenty percent is significant enough that, if it were borne out by further, confirmatory medical investigation, extracts of tobacco juice and/or topical treatments with the active tobacco ingredients would be used in medical treatments today.

I don't expect you to answer these questions ... just food for thought.

: )

Thanks! I am definitely going to bring this up with my parents. You are awesome F.D.

I think one of the big arguments against the WoW is simply the lack of enlightenment on anything not plaguing early nineteenth century Americans. Why is their not counsel about eating healthier foods, staying away from high carb diets? Why not any counsel against Glutens? Any advice about foods to eat to keep your gluclose low.

If it was such a revelation then why wasn't it more useful?

Why is it so bassakwards, it says that beer is ok, but the church ignores that, it says that hot drinks are bad, but you can have hot chocolate but not hot coffee (or cold coffee), why is tea( iced,herbal) bad for you?

Why, if it was a revelation from God treated like it by Joseph and others? Why is it given only as "Word of Wisdom" and not as a commandment but now it is?

The WoW is easy to shoot down.

When disussing the WoW, I wouldn't take on tobacco as outside of treatment for some conditions, it's generally not great for you.

The better argument is coffee. The health benefits have been proven countless times in medical studies. So why is it banned again? Also, most TBMs will pound sodas like crazy. What's up with that?

How do you bruise a cow?

LOL!

Why would you care if you did?

FWIW these kind of discussions/arguments are not likely to be very productive.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2014 12:19AM by gentlestrength.

I think you've won in the big picture. They consulted Google God for information. Now it's fair game. There are lots of either fun church subjects to research using Google. Have fun!

If hot drinks are a revelation for health, one might wonder how many saints would have been spared the cholera and other waterborne diseases if they had been given a revelation to boil their water before drinking it. You know, like you have to when making coffee or tea.

Don't argue over tobacco. It's bad for you whether it's smoked or chewed.

However, the studies on the health benefits of coffee and tea (especially green tea) are well-designed and reliable.

I just received this one on coffee in my email this morning from the Berkeley Wellness Institute at the Univ. of CA at Berkeley.

http://www.berkeleywellness.com/healthy-eating/food/article/coffee-and-your-health

Of course, wine (in moderation) is good for you as well.

I would simply point them to the many excellent studies showing that Jospeh Smith was wrong. End of story.

how about coffee/tea v diet soda? this is a major point of contention between me and my mother, the ONLY one in my family that we've managed to resolve most of our differences. She insists that coffee and tea are evil like a good little mormon. I've shown her article after article that shows her diet soda is literally poison. It causes macular degeneration and a multitude of other health issues, while coffee/tea are actually considered healthy and have scientifically proven benefits. She's diabetic so she believes she has no other option than diet soda. It drives me crazy that she doesn't see her health as the highest price she could pay all because she wants to stay faithful to the church.