So me and the TBM husband had a long discussion and he even watched this documentary together :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcyzkd_m6KE

By the end he said he believes because of past experiences and feelings. We discussed the possibility it was a lie and what would change if we weren't mormon. He went on to say that even if it were a lie worse case is he dies a goody two shoes.

Where do I go from here?? I think the fact he watched the documentary and imagined a life not being mormon is a beginning. I can't push it because he gets very defensive and last time it wasn't pretty.

I also told him off for being so cold to me because of differing beliefs. He admitted he was feeling resentful towards me for always "bashing" the church. But now what?! I need ideas on how to help him realize his past feelings were just a result of being raised in the lds church etc etc.

Perhaps it is time to set aside the religious issues and concentrate on where you go from (under the assumption that he will not be changing).

SusieQ made it work with a still-believing husband.

Someone on the boards mentioned spousal exchange program as a possible solution for couples who are "one in and one out".

The more I think about the concept, the more it makes sense.

Maybe a parallel program could be set up that had exchanges for couples that have mismatched sexual appetites...

Interested couples could arrange swaps, either temporary or permanent...

It could work!

It was me (always thinking of something new as a web developer ;)). I've been thinking about this, a little bit tongue-in-cheek, while reading this board. I recall an earlier conversation at some point where someone was asking about meeting other exmos to date. Someone else replied something to the effect of: "Why limit yourself to exmos only?" In some ways that is true, but in others exmos have a shared history, and even when left TSCC, it tends to leave a mark on people – how could it not after so deep conditioning in many cases. So while world at large is big, there are some aspects of exmos that nonmos will have hard time understanding, almost like understanding someone's different cultural background.

I've also considered the fact that many exmos are in a bizarre limbo state in their relationship, often for years, where leaving for whatever reason is not a reasonable option, usually because of children (no matter what people say). For many it might make the life easier to bear if they they had closer (I don't mean intimate :D) friends who shared the experience. At least the expectation and understanding would be very different from the world at large.

So, perhaps such a service would be useful, and would fill a need for some people in TSCC pinchers.

I'm sure it could be implemented.

I've just wondered what it would lead to if a 'safe' venue was offered to people who've been rejected by their spouses, sometimes for years...

[moved]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/27/2014 04:42PM by Facing Tao.

Need to add this idea to my stack of ideas to develop! It has been always so that the most meaningful web-projects have been such that have somehow made a positive impact in people's lives. This could be such.

I totally agree about RfM! And I also agree that there's a risk involved even here for those who are married. A more intimate venue (venue, I said! :) would in some ways be safer as the messages would not be public. But even here posts would be sufficient to do many people's marriages in if they were to be discovered.

I can tell you what I've done, but it is only my experience and might not be worth a hill of beans to your husband.

For me it wasn't the people, the leaders (past and present), the history, or the verifiable fraud in the BOM and BOA. It was that it stopped making sense. I realized that LDS inc was untrue when I stopped accepting illogical doctrine.

However, if your husband is bound and determined to be Mormon you can't stop him, and it would be unfair to try. You have to communicate to him that his beliefs get to be his own. It is a quid pro quo though (hehe), he can't (or shouldn't) dismiss you if you aren't dismissing him.

It was not the fact that the church is a lie that made me leave. It is the fact that the church does tremendous harm in the world. It wasn't the business model that collects money from people who don't know any better, it was the fact that the church lies and the result of these lies is actual harm. I had to identify and understand the harm that in order to toss out all of my childhood indoctrination and actually leave.

There is a lot of harm.

The word of wisdom is a bad health law.
Gay people commit suicide because of the church.
Foster kids miss out on having 2 parent households if their foster parents happen to be gay, because of the church.
Women don't reach their full potential because of the church.
Blacks were victims of church discrimination
People were murdered in mountain meadows
Blood atonement

Boys are regularly damaged by being told that masturbation (a natural act) is a sin

Normal sexual behavior is repressed, resulting in mental, emotional and sometimes physical harm.

There are more examples, but every dollar paid to TSCC and every hour spent serving TSCC is a donation to "harm."

Maybe ask him if he wants to participate in that type of evil.

Then, it isn't only, "If I'm right, I go to heaven, and if I'm wrong, there is no consequence." The reality is that there is a huge consequence for being wrong, why? Truth ACTUALLY matters.

The greatest harm by TSCC is done to the families: marriages, and parent-child relationships. That alone is irrefutable proof of Morg's rotten roots.

bob...not registered Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It was not the fact that the church is a lie that
> made me leave. It is the fact that the church does
> tremendous harm in the world. It wasn't the
> business model that collects money from people who
> don't know any better, it was the fact that the
> church lies and the result of these lies is actual
> harm. I had to identify and understand the harm
> that in order to toss out all of my childhood
> indoctrination and actually leave.
>
> There is a lot of harm.
>
> The word of wisdom is a bad health law.
> Gay people commit suicide because of the church.
> Foster kids miss out on having 2 parent households
> if their foster parents happen to be gay, because
> of the church.
> Women don't reach their full potential because of
> the church.
> Blacks were victims of church discrimination
> People were murdered in mountain meadows
> Blood atonement
>
> Boys are regularly damaged by being told that
> masturbation (a natural act) is a sin
>
> Normal sexual behavior is repressed, resulting in
> mental, emotional and sometimes physical harm.
>
> There are more examples, but every dollar paid to
> TSCC and every hour spent serving TSCC is a
> donation to "harm."
>
> Maybe ask him if he wants to participate in that
> type of evil.
>
> Then, it isn't only, "If I'm right, I go to
> heaven, and if I'm wrong, there is no
> consequence." The reality is that there is a huge
> consequence for being wrong, why? Truth ACTUALLY
> matters.


very well said, agreed 10000% Truth matters.

The trouble is, to the true believer, they need it to be true and have to make it true because it works for them. You can't get people to see anything wrong because they already know all the things wrong with it, but they NEED it to be true because it works for them. Round and round it goes.

The best thing is to either work out a truce wherein you are both respected for each other's point of view, or you need to stick around until a day comes when he no longer needs it to be true, or you need to decide you can't live that way.

If he's a good man and a good husband, I'd try to figure out a way to make it work. Good peeps are hard to come by. If not, well . .

Best of luck to you in this difficult situation!

In my situation it was good for me to take a break from attempting to deconvert my wife. I kept trying to offer more information and she kept getting more defensive and closing off more and more.

It wasn't until I made an environment where she was safe to share her doubts that we started to make some progress. She is still TBM, but I have seen much larger changes by backing off and letting her come to me than I ever would have made trying to push information on her.

»He admitted he was feeling resentful towards me for always "bashing" the church.»

I hear this often, too. I say that I would "just like to have a conversation", but apparently a conversation can only be had if its contents are approved by the church, otherwise it is "bashing" and "disrespectful of her faith". It is very frustrating!

"always "bashing" the church." - bashing the church?
I would like to BOMB the CULT off the earth. PA-LEEZE

I've only recently discovered this forum and its been a great relief to find people like myself managing the aftermath of a plundered life. Really liked this thread. I've been living with my TBM DH for 10 years and it has been very difficult. Our kids have flown the nest and I lost sense of purpose. I cope as best I can but had a complete breakdown in 2011 couldn't hold it together anymore. Tried to take my own life in Feb 2013. Was diagnosed with delayed PTSD.

I have some good nevermo friends now but no one really understands what it is like to leave the 'corporation' or to feel isolated, excluded and distrusted by people who apparently used to rely on, like and respect me. This forum is another sanity saver. It is particularly good to share with people who know how hard it is to live in a sort of 'limbo' with a TBM other half.

New Order Mormon support forums are great for that kind of personal, discussion

Make sure to have a look at that.

We're with you Sis. Always can feel positive!

Is the BoA the only issue you have been able to expose him to? Is he willing to read or watch anything else? For many believers it takes more than one issue to make the testimony shelf to collapse.

The fact that he was willing to watch the video is impressive in and of itself. Many Mormons refuse to look at the evidence.

I would be careful to not push him too hard. You need to take baby steps with him and not expect him to immediately stop believing and quit the church cold turkey. Be careful not to come across as trying to PROVE him wrong or to expect him to say you are right and the church is bunk. Make him know that you respect his beliefs but that you only would like him to study the evidence. whatever he does with the evidence is his own business. He doesn't have to admit anything. Don't make him. It makes Mormons uncomfortable if they feel they have to defend the church. Just feed him the information but let it him digest it on his own.

It was the emotional and feeling part of the church that was the first crack for me. I found out that Islam and other religions claim a "burning in the bosom" type feeling about their religions and answers to prayers. Once I knew that feeling the "spirit" wasn't a truth test, when I read about the church issues, I just couldn't pray myself out of it anymore and my shelf collapsed.

Have DH read this and tell you if maybe he was manipulated to feel things

http://www.bonneville.com/?nid=32

Also, did god tell him "I am" or "I am a Mormon"?

HeartSell (TM). Deconverting people since 1961

In my experience, and take it with a grain of salt if you'd like, you cannot deconvert another person. A person will let go of a belief system only when they have convinced themselves, and are ready to do so.

My DW is semi-TBM, and it has been a long, long road to get to this point. I'm expecting it to be another goodly distance before she is ready to finally let it go. I think this is fairly typical too.

I recommend you don't "bash" TSCC when your DH is around. In my experience, nothing good comes from it. If he is BIC, you've got to recognize how deep the manipulation/brainwashing is. Defense mechanisms automatically deploy when their holy church is slandered.

Finally, there is a lot of pride and passion that has to be sorted through in ones mind before they can admit that they were wrong about it. You can't do it for him. Only he can.

Patience (if he's worth it), and good luck to you!