I realized I need support. I love my Mormon friends here in Provo, but As I no longer believe in the church, I find it hard to connect with them. They would die if they ever found out. Feeling like the loneliest girl in Provo right now....

Hello Latter Day Slave (I feel the same myself), I am a BYU student as well. I regularly lurk, even on BYUs computers. The Danites haven't found me thus far, so I figure I'm safe. I can relate to how you feel. It's tough to live in our circumstances considering our reformed views.

Sorry about my short reply, I needed to switch to my laptop from my iOS for easier typing.

It's tough going, and my mind mirrors your thoughts on "finding it hard to connect with them." We're decent people, and we are able to befriend other Mormons rather easily due to our same backgrounds. However, there is difficulty in truly relating to them due to our widely different viewpoints. You can't look at the Matrix of Mormonism the same after you take the red pill of truth.

I started doubting in high school, and that made the last few months of my Senior year a discomfort. People looked down on me as a liar, one deceived by Satan, etc. The way I was treated and the way I felt betrayed due to the constant spoon feeding of distorted history/doctrine was enough for me to not go on a mission. That was probably the best decision I have ever made.

I believe it to be ironic that I went to BYU after that ordeal. I remember I still felt that, perhaps, my testimony would be restored. My friends and family still had hopes that I would regain my ambition to go on a mission once again. To make a long story short, I became a simple believer in Christ for a very short time and then agnostic. I felt that there are too many mental gymnastics for me to hurdle in order to believe. I don't know about you, but that is how I feel.

Loneliness is a horrible feeling. That demon can drag us down even if we are surrounded by friends. I sincerely hope it gets better for you. It slowly is for me, time heals all wounds.

Thanks for your reply angrydoubter. How much longer do you have at byu? That's funny you've used this site on their computers haha.

I actually didn't start having doubts until I got my mission call. I went through the temple and was soooo weirded out. Then I started researching a little but felt very guilty for doing so. I kept praying my thoughts would go away. I served my 18 month mission and continued to push any doubts away. Shortly after getting home, I too, became strictly Christian for awhile. Then, eventually, agnostic.

I have never felt happier now that I have zero guilt and I finally just do what I want to do! But socially, I don't feel like I can open up to anyone around here. People will judge when they see me with my coffee and tattoo, but it's my fault. I'm the one who gave myself the Mormon label and I wish so badly I could take it away.

Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised. Thanks for the lookout. I definitely won't include anything that might reveal who I am:)

You must be a very strong woman for enduring that mission. Most would break under the militaristic rules, policies, and procedures. I don't think I could last a week in that controlled hell.

I have a couple years left, and I plan on staying until I graduate. I actually like learning here; the professors are engaging to listen to and I feel like this school has a really good program in my major.

Socially, I really have no clue. I consider myself a very solitary person, by humans are very social animals, and my state of loneliness becomes a roller coaster. There are times when I am completely happy with no deep interaction other than the debates I have in my own mind. Other times, I get into an emotional breakdown because I have no immediate "true" friends around here.

I can't even share all my thoughts to the people that matter the most to me: my family. Don't get me wrong, I love my family and they love me. However, they have explicitly told me to not say ANYTHING that puts the church in a negative light. I am discouraged by such synthetic relationship, but it keeps the peace.

I am not an RM, I love coffee, etc. etc. etc. and I will always be a Mormon 2nd class citizen. Too bad I don't consider myself a "Mormon" anymore :) . I just play the part so I can finish school.

Gosh, I wish there was someway we could meet without the Committee to Strengthen the Members/Danites coming to slit our throats. You probably know more about meeting other people like us on campus. I was always told there was an "underground" here that can be found for people like us. Lol, I haven't found it yet.

I think we will be able to. I'm trying to make it work :)

You are not alone. I have suffered through my last two years at BYU since discovering that TSCC is a fraud. I graduate in 3 weeks and I could not be happier; I made the tough decision to stay and get a degree and then get the hell outta Utah.

Luckily, my wife decided to leave with me so I've had a constant support through this; but it's still hard. We wish so badly that we knew other closet doubters at BYU, but it's just too risky; we can't take the chance that somehow information will leak.

I went to a counselor about 7 months ago because I was really getting stressed out about everything, and I told him that I no longer believed in the church, I avoided attending on Sunday, and it was really taking a toll on me. He then told me that students disbelieving in the LDS church is actually one of the biggest issues that they deal with at psychological services.

BYU is a decent school, but the TBM atmosphere can be so suffocating; sometimes I just want to yell at everyone and tell them to wake the fuck up and realize that they idolize a child molester and all-around terrible human being (aka joe smith).

Hang in there and know that there are always people on this board that can offer support! I post on this site pretty regularly under another name, so I'll be around too!

Latterdayslave: you'll survive BYU. Stick it out and get your degree. I did...then I got the Hell out of Provo! You can find anything you want at BYU if you look hard enough. I always stayed clear of the hard core TBMs...I found factions of people that were like me...very liberal, progressive types...I have to admit, the first year in Provo was a huge culture shock...I almost didn't survive :) But I sucked it up and finished my degree there (at the urging of my never-mo dad)...ended up saving a lot of $$$...a BYU degree was infinitely cheaper than my alternatives...no student loan debt was an amazing thing...worth the sacrifice.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/05/2014 11:16AM by zenmaster.

I felt like a misfit at BYU for most of the time I was there and totally sympathize! Too far along to transfer? When I went to visit other campuses in my search for the right grad program I cried bitter tears because I finally realized how much I had given up by going to BYU. The parties and intellectual discussions on the meaning of life just aren't the same at 30 with a kid. And I forever have the name of a villainous, racist murder-mongering scoundrel on my resume. I whipped through in 3 years though and am so glad I obtained a degree; it did have advantages.

I have a couple of suggestions if transferring isn't an option, but they require really looking at your requirements and finding creative ways to fill them.

- in summer, you can take classes at almost any college without applying. Yes, Stanford or UCLA here you come, if you can afford it. If you have family or friends you can go anywhere and try normal life while working towards your degree, if there are classes that will transfer. The U of U charges everyone in-state tuition, even nonresidents. Yes, it's a drive, but you could meet a whole circle of like-minded people and see them on weekends in the fall. Might be able to use institute classes elsewhere with a more normal group of fellow students to fill religion class requirements. (Religion classes were the worst at BYU - I learned to take them first thing in the morning or after working out so I would be too tired to get mad at the stupidity).

- if it fits your program, you could study abroad for a term or two. Classes would likely count toward graduation, and coffee and agnosticism are normal most places. There are a LOT of study abroad scholarships. I know Japan and Sweden have very generous ones, which would allow you to afford the experience. You can often study for a term at another US college and transfer credits back, too. I hate to see others totally miss that experience for the wierd world that is BYU culture.

- BYU offers several special programs. The NY and DC internship programs count towards graduation, get you off the campus and interacting with the real world. At least students from other Utah colleges. If you are smart, apply early and are persistent, some of those internships are paid. Even an internship at a national company in SLC will let usually you hang with nonLDS, nonUtah-bred people for money and academic credit.

- Look at what BYU offers online. And what other colleges do. Maybe you could spend a term living and working in a place you like (Disneyland? Ski resort? Grand Canyon?) and still be getting work done on that degree.

- head down and plow through. Using some loopholes and special permission I took 29 credit hours my final semester. I would not recommend it, I was pretty miserable. But it got me away from there.

The sad thing is that I never realized how VERY unhappy I was or how much better college elsewhere might have been until after graduation. My brother and sister and their spouses love taking their kids around the campus, showing them their freshman dorms, the Cougareat... I swear I have mild PTSD, I feel a wave of misery overwhelm me driving any farther into Provo than the new InNout burger.

Be kind to yourselves, find ways to experience life at this wonderful stage with so many possibilities besides young marriage and instant babies.

From the same institution that claims in being honest:

Cynics do not contribute.
Skeptics do not create.
Doubters do not achieve.

SOURCE:

http://speeches.byu.edu/?act=viewitem&id=1065

I also go to byu and have a year left. You can find me at NOM (http://forum.newordermormon.org/) under the same screen name if you'd like to contact me. My girlfriend and I would be more than happy to have more friends!

Oh wow, this makes me so happy to hear from others who know what I'm going through! Thanks for everyone's input and advice. I would love to meet up with anyone on here in the utah county area.

I have been at this a looong time, 15-16 years. There have been many problems for people at YBU. They can and WILL punish you. Friends and roomies WILL tell on you. They will take email addys you use here and try to ID you SO DON'T POST THEM. Use caution where you post from. Keep your heads down as much as possible and get out as soon as you can.

Super_anon_dude. Did you go to a byu therapist? I feel like I need to talk to someone about my perfectionism and OCD ways ut he church instilled in my brain. Byu services gives free counseling but I would highly prefer a non-member therapist!!

Susan- I understand that we need to be super careful. But does that mean I can't meet up with others for support? I just need friends who I can be myself with and not be judged for my disbelief.

You need to get a new, exmo ONLY, very generic, throw away account. Then if you both want to exchange I am happy to do that for you. But again, be careful. The biggest problems we have had are friends reconverting and ratting out everyone they know.

I can only dream about the trouble I'd have gotten myself into had their been PC's and the internet back in '66-'67 when I was at Ricks. OMG.....I would have gotten turfed out by Homecoming week, I'm sure. Wishing all you lurkers well at BYU in your quest for the real truth.

Ron Burr

Still recall sitting in a pizza joint called "The Rusty Nail" across from campus with TBM friends having recently found out the REAL truth about Mormonism...sure was a lonely feeling. Such a feeling of relief and excitement over finally working my way out of the paper bag of Mormonism combined with loneliness and dread.

Ratting out your fellow man for be-why-you brownie points.

But no, they're not a cult.

Not at all.

Recently I reconnected with my BYU roommate and close friend. We graduated 35 years ago. During these years we both independently realized the church is a scam and both left. Still good friends.

I feel for you. As I read these posts about being scared about being ratted out it makes me shudder. I know the former soviet bloc well. This eerily sounds like the horror stories I have heard about regarding the secret police. It's sickening.

I am from Utah county. I usually post under another name. My wife and I would be happy to talk to you if you are interested. We left a few months ago.

Yes I would love to talk to you and your wife :)

I know exactly how you feel. I went to BYU for 2 years and couldn't handle it. I was already lonely as it was, but after I stopped believing the loneliness only intensified. I had no one to talk to and no one I could really connect with. It ate me up inside and I ended up leaving. I didn't know about this website at the time and I think it would have really helped. Good luck to you and I hope you are able to make some good friends and get a good support system going from the people in this thread.

Thanks Bella10!

My wife and I are BYU alumni in Utah County, both fully out of the church, if anyone's ever interested in talking.

My roommate at the Y is also fully out of the church.

Alpiner, I would love to talk with you guys!!!

I just graduated from BYU last year and moved out of state, bummer that we didn't get the chance to meet while I was still in town. That said, play it safe. If you don't do anything obvious, you can lie your way out of almost anything at BYU. Just don't leave a trail, attend your meetings, and make sure your bishop likes you.

I deconverted for my last year at BYU, and I started disregarding the rules rather wantonly towards the end. Drinking in my apartment, overnights with my girlfriend, etc. I got away with it by never leaving a trail, and being 10x more careful about what would be seen or asked than I thought I needed to be. The problem is that they will put an "honor code violation" hold on your account if you get expelled, and to other schools this says "they cheated". You don't want that to follow you.

Learn the key phrases used at conference for apostates, it sucks, but if you can't fake it 100%, just act lazy, like you have testimony "struggles" and want to repent, etc. Leave hope that you are trying to work it out, and that you want to believe.

It really isn't hard to do, but there is a high cost of failure. It shouldn't be an issue for you, but just be extra careful.

All the best, and good luck. If you want somebody to talk to off-board, feel free to email me, I am always willing to chat (and as a BYU alum, aren't I supposed to support current students ;). I would recommend setting up a separate email (as Susan I/S said) with a fake name and all for when you are doing anything that could out you.

My email is:
Nottrueblueanymore@gmail.com

Also, what helped me best was finding all of the doubters, apostates, and new order Mormons amongst my friends, family, and room mates. It is tricky to do while staying safe, but as long as you don't self incriminate, you'll be fine. And that in person support helps a lot in fighting the likely depression.

Come, join us. :)

http://www.meetup.com/UtahValleyPostmormons/