good evening to y'all. i set up a thread last night and would like to thank everyone for all of their help. i'm still investigating. scheduled to be baptized on the 19th. already postponed once(feb. 26) and considering strongly on postponing once more. again tks. much. (been presbyterian, all of my life)

Just don't let any of them pressure you into doing something you're not ready to do.

I actually put them off for a year and a half before I was baptized. It went through 5 sets of missionaries before they finally got me dunked.

But I didn't have access to all the information which is out there today. If I did, I wouldn't have done it at all.

You could be happy there, but you will need to keep any contrary knowledge to yourself. You will need to profess to believe that Joseph actually saw the official version of 1820, and you will need to profess to believe that that Peter James and John really did appear to him and Oliver, even though they both told contradictory accounts four or five years after it was to have happened.

In order to be found worthy to go to the temple you must declare that you believe those and also that despite zero evidence of any kind, the Book of Mormon is true.

Other than that, if you are the kind of person who likes strong organization, opportunities to teach the gospel and minister to others, have ready made friends and family no matter where you go, then by all means you could be very content.

But be aware that when they are teaching you LDS specific theology, you should remember that many teachings of yesterday are no longer allowed, and teachings of today are not eternal.

By the way, here is a comparison of the 1997 Gospel Principles manual and the 2010 Gospel Principle manual.

http://mrm.org/gospel-principles

When I was growing up, and when I was in the Bishopric the things that have been crossed out and deleted from the new manual were eternal and essential gospel truths that everyone needed to understand in order to make their way back to the Father.

This manual is being used in Relief Society andf Priesthood as well as Sunday School. By the end of 2012, those plain and precious truths will not be taught to new members, or to our children.

If/when i postpone(which nothing is under contract) i wonder if they'll be able to respect or will they keep wanting me to become baptized. I just spoke w/my mom and she stated she was happy but felt as if i was jumping in it too quickly and to take my time. I'll have to let s'one know in the next couple of days, i assume b/c it's scheduled for 19th. (Been doing some research, as well)

If you were joining the RLDS church it would be several months before you could ask to be baptized, and then you would need to show that you had an adequate understanding and commitment by attending for all that time.

If you were to become Catholic it would take about a year of teaching before you could be considered ready.

Why are the LDS missionaries in such a rush that they would ask a person to commit in the second or third discussion, when you haven't even proven yourself to be a committed follower?

Does making a commitment to baptism that early make you feel as if you were breaking your word if you back down, and so you must go forward?

maybe silly ? know what lds is but what is rlds??

Reorganized Church of Jesus Christ of LatterDay Saints.

Now called Community of Christ

http://cofchrist.org/

Here is their Doctrine and Covenants section 163 from 2007:
http://www.cofchrist.org/D&C163/section163.asp

Sure they'll respect it - as far as they won't put a gun to your head. But they will NEVER give up. They need the stats. They have to report how many times they visited an investigator each week. You are providing wonderful stats for them in that regard. They are highly pressured to teach and baptize. If not this set of mishes, then the next guys.

If you told them to forget it forever, you would not be able to stop sets of mishes from ringing your doorbell at least twice a year to see if you've changed your mind yet. Just TRY to get rid of them. You can't do it.

You can postpone this for a LONG time and try to figure out what you want. But once you get in, it will be very difficult to get out. You will quickly find that it takes on a whole different feeling once you're a member. Once you're dunked the mishes will vanish - no need for them anymore - they're chasing their next hot prospect. And then it's time for you to show the church what you can do for it. This isn't the kind of religion that serves its members. It's a religion that expects its members to serve it - frequently and to the exclusion of all else.

They want your money and your time and your talents. They want you to give rides to all the people who don't have cars. They want you to attend meetings for hours and hours each week. They do not want you involved in anything that takes time away from church. If you have any talents or interests that they can't use, then you will not be encouraged to continue them.

Yeah I used to be an investigator too. Then I jumped in the water too fast. I kept trying and trying to find what I thought the mishes had taught me about. I kept thinking I wasn't trying hard enough. I kept working right up to becoming a full time mish myself. I went to South America and learned what a mission is really all about - numbers and pressure to baptize as many people as possible - regardless of whether they really want it or not.

I gave 7 years of my life to that church - 18 months of it full time - leaving my friends and family and spending $7,000 of my own money. Were they grateful for any of it? No. When I got home my bishop wanted to know why I didn't have any more tithing paid than I did. All I had was the tithe on my birthday and Christmas presents. I hadn't worked for money for over 2 years because I was working for them at my own expense and they still felt that I should have given more.

I can't tell you how little respect I have for that organization.

yes, they are calling and/ or stopping by @ least 5 times a week. More than they began w/3-1/2 months ago.

duffy said: "This isn't the kind of religion that serves its members. It's a religion that expects its members to serve it - frequently and to the exclusion of all else."

Oh, such true words there.

Do not do this. There is a lot they do not tell you in the "investigative" stage. This so called religion will use you for your money and service to THEM- a cult. You will not have a say. You will not know what they do with the tithing they collect because they never tell anyone. It is all about tithing. The Bible says GOD loves a cheerful giver. Will you be cheerful or just afraid because they make you afraid??? I would also like to add that your family is freaking out most likely. Allow them to ask you questions....take their advice and do research. You will not be sorry. My daughter converted too and would not research or read anything I asked her to read. She was Methodist all her life. They really brainwashed her. She is not like most Mormons. She goes to movies and shops on Sun. She simply was not informed enough about Mormonism and she let them put the pressure on - it took 6 yrs. but it happened.

I am her mom and still devistated about it but know she must figure this out on her own. You should figure it out NOW!!!I feel badly that she joined a cult when I tried so hard to keep her from being hurt by them. She was given a calling and I guess she does it due to it be required. My one hope in this world is that she finds the courage to get out.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/12/2011 12:23AM by honestone.

I dunno. Some people want to get dunked no matter what. I had a black investigaor who I told the whole curse of cain myth to along with the 1978 "revelation" along with the churchs prior polocies regarding blacks (excepting SWKs interacial marriage stance). He got baptized.

One lady we taught still got baptized after my comp and I read her the King Follet discourse from begining to end.

Some people, strangely enough, want to be mormon. Even with all the stupid BS.

Start drinking or smoking. Either is better for you than mormonism.

lol

and info given you about the LDS Church and it's history?
What kind of information would convince you to join, and what kind of information would convince you not to join?
What do you need?

Susie Q, i've been researching through internet(good ole' internet) as well as going to local book store. have been reading "mormonism for dummies" it's fairly informative, as well. it is so much different than presbyterian. That's another reason why i believe that 5 church visits, as well as SEVERAL mis. teachings/visits/calls is not enough. They started coming by the first part of dec. 2010. I've postponed once. (feb. 26)I'm hearing from the mis. app. 5-6 times a week.

deb 49 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm hearing from the mis. app. 5-6 times a week.

You know, the last time I went car-shopping I didn't hear from car salespeople even half that much. I don't even hear from any family member or friend that much!

Don't the missionaries have someone else to visit? Don't you have something else to do? Why do you keep letting them in?

Of course you are hearing from them so much. You are indicating a strong desire to know more.Lovebombing is what they do best. If you are wealthy they really like you. But the mishies are limited in what THEY can tell you. Please be wise and don't allow them to skip important matters like JS was a pedophile who married a 14 yr. old and other mens wives. Would God condone that???? The mormons claim all other religions are an abomination. Just ask the mishies those two things and see what they say....it's pathetic that they can't be honest with investigators.

I live surrounded by mormon families, the guy next door is in the bishopric, but I have not even gotten a hello from any of them - because they know I an not a prospective mormon. We rarely see my husband's kids or siblings because they are so busy in the church and have to avoid him. There are currently seven grandchildren that he rarely gets to see; six live within two miles of us. They see their grandmother (his first wife) several times a week - she lives five blocks away from us. This was difficult for me to understand the first year we lived here.
This board helped me to put some perspective on the situation as I had not ever been so shunned; to some degree it is a relief. We see his parents when they are not at the temple helping convert dead people into the church, rushing missionaries to different cities, doing their home teachings or being visited by their home teachers. His mother prepares for her turn to talk once each month and calls her apostate son as a resource! That is why we still have some contact with them.
Family friendly they are not; supportive and generous they are not. Jesus taught love, unconditional love, but I see conditions on all communication with his family. When they thought he was potentially open to coming back to the church, he was telephoned, asked to come over all the time, visited by all of his kids... but that stopped abruptly when they knew he was not interested in rejoining the mormon church.

I wish you peace in your decision making, take all the time YOU need.

Well said exmowife. I too lived among the Mormons for over 4 yrs. in Utah. The shunning of my family was unbelievable. It showed intolerance, unfriendliness to the max. No way would I want to be associated with a group like that. And as for your hubbies kids and grandkids....He knows how the "church" works, so although it is hurtful,it is not going to change until the kids wise up. And often some want to but have this extended family that will make them an outcast so they just go along with it. Enjoy each other is what I say. The people who choose to judge others will surely be the one's judged the harshest. But that's right....they dont' know Jesus too well, do they???

I was a Presbyterian married to a Mormon in my church. LDS is no way like your church. Meetings are three long, boring hours...with people giving testamonies....you get callings...like when the God Father makes you an offer you can't refuse...

Now if you want them to tell how much money to give...worry about which level of heaven you will end up in...believe you will become a God if you do everything right and populate your own world with your eternal wife...well full speed ahead..

But if any of that bothers you...don't get baptized...the mishies baptize and forget you...then you find out all the stuff they hid from you.

It sounds so good and looks so good...but it isn't...it's time consuming tedious and false. Take time to study this...

Oh and be prepared not to hear about your Saviour Jesus Christ...nope...it will be Jospeh Smith instead with all his wives....

Read under the Banner of Heaven....and the 19th wife...

It will make you cringe...think...

stormy

deb 49, when I joined the Army at age 19, I rode a bus to Fort Bliss, El Paso TX. When the bus pulled up to the Basic training facility, a bunch of Army trainees lined up by a fence and yelled: "You'll be Sorry!"

If you join Mormonism, I will yell the same message to you.

Deb
I am your age. I was a convert in my 20s and even served a mission. The church is not true. What you see them doing to you now, the visits and smiles are all to get you hooked. Joe Smith was a con artist and pedophile and not a prophet. Brig ham Young had dissenters killed. 23 inactive years later and I still have nightmares of the church. It's your decision. We want to spare you the psychological distress we've suffered.

Btw - you can still believe that God will reunite you with your husband without joining a cult.

I wish you peace.

Presbyterian churches have done many good things. I cannot understand why you would leave them.

There is a very important thing you have to realize about the LDS teachings.

Look at the Book of Mormon preface.

"The Book of Mormon ... Written to the Lamanites, who are a remnant of the house of Israel ... to come forth in due time by way of the Gentile ... to show unto the remnant of the House of Israel what great things the Lord hath done for their fathers; and that they may know the covenants of the Lord, that they are not cast off forever ..."

The LDS have taught from the very beginning in 1830 that this means it is for the indigenous people of America. The Book of Mormon is supposed to be a history of America's Indians. It is supposed to be for them so that "they are not cast off forever".

Now take a look at the Presbyterian. They make no claims of having an ancient scripture. They make no claims of the Native Americans being a remnant of the House of Israel. But your church, the Presbyterians do good.

Look at what is on the Pine Ridge in South Dakota:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5H6IMRPkkg

The Presbyterians do many humanitarian projects to help some of the poorest counties in the United States.

What did the LDS do in the same year that youtube video was posted? The LDS church closed its only meeting house on Pine Ridge, while building a $3 million chapel built in Rapid City. This made it impossible for LDS Lakota women to even attend church.

http://www.rapidcityjournal.com/news/local/article_7a4343d3-eca4-5031-bcc9-79579a21aa22.html

"They literally locked the door. We have no place to worship,"

"My parents embraced the church and accepted its teachings," she said. Now that she can no longer worship in the chapel where she was baptized, she wonders why Mormon missionaries came to her community at all. "Why did you send the missionaries in the first place? We'd have been better off if you'd left us alone," she said.

Deb 49, the LDS claim that the Book of Mormon is the most important book in their religion. They claim it came from an ancient record written by the ancestors of the Native Americans. It is supposed to help them.

Your church, the Presbyterians care about America's indigenous people. The LDS care about themselves.

Since you have the info and seem hell bent on continuing to investigate, you deserve what you get. Still, we will be here when you come to your senses.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/12/2011 07:57AM by MJ.

Why would anyone want to join a bunch of liars for social reasons?

Deb 49, how are you doing financially?

Go to the bank and take out of your checking account 10% of your GROSS income for the month. Take it home and spread it out on your kitchen table. Take a good hard look at it. Can you get by without it? You will be expected to give "the church" that much money every month for the REST OF YOUR LIFE. Now pick up all that money and put it in a pile in your fire place and burn it, or better yet, give it to a real charity like the Red Cross. Because after you give it to "the church", it will be gone, FOREVER.

If you lose your job, don't expect any help from "the church". If you have a very generous bishop, he may give you some food but don't expect any cash to pay your mortgage, car payment, or utility bills.

In the mormon "church" you need a temple recommend in order to go to the temple to get the knowledge needed to get to the highest level of heaven, the "Celestial Kingdom". In order to have a temple recommend, you have to be a full tithe payer. If you stop paying tithing, no matter the reason, they will take your temple recommend away from you. So it seems to me that "the church" is selling salvation. As far as I know, the mormon "church" is the only church which does that.

Good luck to you.

hi there!! to your ?. Been laid off 13 months. going to have to relocate from MS to TX in order to go to work. live o.k. though.but need/want to work.

RED Flag...they found you when you were vulnerable. That is what they do. They will fix all your problems, don't ya know?

Whether you join or not,,wish you luck and happy times. Please keep us posted.

Are you really "investigating" or are you simply weighing opinions?

Why the hurry to baptize? They want your money. Or have they not told that, in order to be a member in good standing, you must give them 10% of your gross (not net) income?

So let's see:

God removes the true gospel from the earth when the last of Christ's disciples dies, waits eighteen-hundred years, then decides to restore said gospel via an uneducated fourteen-year-old as if there's no one more qualified to take-on the task.

Through his new charge, God commands his chosen people to practice communal economics (that would be communism) in a land infatuated with capitalism. God's "plan" fails time and again which eventually causes his chosen people to choose capitalism.

God commands his chosen people to practice polygamy (see Doctrine & Covenants Section 132). The federal gov't says the Utah territory will not be granted statehood until said practice stops. Oddly enough, the practice stops, after two official manifestos to that effect, and the mormon cult then condemns "plural wifery" even though god's commandment in that regard still remains on the books.

God reveals that blacks are direct descendants of Cain, bear the world's first murderer's "mark" (flat nose and dark skin according to Brigham Young) and subsequent curse, and cannot hold the priesthood because they sat on the fence during the war in heaven. A century and some change later, God "miraculously" changes his mind due to extreme public and political pressures, the most notable of which being real institutions of higher education refusing to compete against cult owned BYU in athletics.

In the mormon god's eyes, women are nothing more than mindless baby factories. In the days of polygamy, one cult leader said he thought no more of taking another wife than he did taking another cow. Mormonism is a racist, sexist and homophobic institution. Look it up. Indeed, it is "different" than most religions, but not by much in that each, in its own unique way, promotes fairy tales as facts in order to pick the pockets of the gullible.

Forty-nine, you say? ... No offense, deb 49, but your wisdom is obviously not beyond your years.

This is the Gospel according to Timothy ... Its my experience that there's more than one born every day.

Timothy

Good points to ponder for her Timothy.

always test someone before you marry him. Find an area of disagreement between the two of you and strongly voice your opinion. Do something he disapproves of. See how he reacts.

With strength and conviction, tell the missionaries to stop pressuring you with so many visits and allow you time and space to investigate information about the church from all sources. See if they respect and honor your right to make a choice (not just the choice they want you to make). If they push, they're salesmen, plain and simple.

Also, please be aware that anyone not paying a full tithe is not allowed in the temple where Mormon "forever" weddings take place. These weddings are not a celebration of love and union. They are cultish, Draconian, sterile and weird. In other words, non-Mormons or "unworthy(non-tithed)" loved ones and family can't attend marriage ceremonies.

i have actually test the missionaries and let them know that the baptism would not take place on the 19th. (2nd time i've postponed) tks. so very much for the tips/info that you have given. I'm happy w/the fact that i've been "researching" further into this. (i've let them know this several times, as well) I understand that the miss. will eventually move on b/c you do not "commit" so, maybe so. They don't even get paychecks, can't fathom that they can be persistant when they get nothing in rtn. I'm going to be visiting different churches(including pres,)(going to a southern baptist church in 2 weeks. (out of town, though)(love to visit other churches)btw, they told me that was o.k. but, that i'd still be a member of lds, only. again thanks much for the input.

i meant "text"

tks. much for the kind words.

I watch a lot of health videos and this guy was just talking about his way of healthy eating. But what he said reminded me so much of Mormonism.

It's so important for the Mormons to be right. So important for them to be the one and only true way to God.

To paraphrase what this guy just said in his video:

"The Ego loves to be right. I don’t want to be right, because there is no right or wrong. What a burden that would be for me to feel like the way I live my life is the one right way. That would be a huge burden to carry around with me. I’m a man of freedom and peace. My way to live is just one way."

How peaceful that is compared with the rigid rules of Mormonism.

The morg will want 10% of your unemployment checks, also from Social Security income.

I'd say a 49 year old woman can spend her money without some "church" telling her what to do or how to live her life.

Mormons have NO authority from God. The Book of Mormon is fiction - snake oil from the 1800s.

We know this because the American Indians do not have Hebrew DNA.
Their DNA shows that they came to America from Asia.

Mormonism is based on falsehoods.

Stay in your own church if you know what's good for you.

Deb...being Presb, obviously you believe in God. But you must know that the Mormon God is a different one! Their "Heavenly Father" is merely an exalted man, he is NOT the God you are accustomed to. The LDS God has a body of flesh & bones, has wives, parents, grandparents, literal children, etc. Ask the missionaries about "eternal progression". This is vital, basic stuff Deb. You are being wooed toward a system, a cult, that embraces a DIFFERENT God and a DIFFERENT Jesus. Caution, its NOT what you apparently think it is! Best of luck to you, Deb, and keep learning....

That's a good point about vulnerability. If you poll those of us who were converts, I think a common theme of "was searching," or "needed something," would emerge.

People who are feeling strong in their lives, or are perfectly happy with their current faiths usually won't give Mormonism the time of day.