I walked in on my TBM wife laying a major heavy harsh verbal lashing on my 13.5 year-old son because he told her he had seen some porn on his computer.

He is going to have his phone and iPad taken away, and is have to go to the bishop to confess and will absolutely get raked over the coals for this by my wife for YEARS.

I'm not exaggerating. She will never let him rest until he is out of our house because the same thing happened to our other son. She watched him like a hawk and quizzed him almost every day and checked his browser all the time and spied on his activities and cried and accused me of being soft on sin, etc.

I need to tell her that I disagree with the harshness of the punishment, and with the general hysteria around it, but has anyone out there in exmo land found a way to handle these kinds of parenting differences in a way that does not lead to horrible arguments and accusations?

Any help greatly appreciated.

I don't have a wife or a child but when I looked at porn I was curious. It's not wrong to look at porn in my opinion but it's a bit extreme to punish a kid that is curious. I began looking at porn when my friend and I found a porn magazine in his parents room and I was amazed of what a woman looks like when their naked. Not sure if this helps anything but I was 13 at the time i looked at porn.

The main thing this will do is teach the boy to be isolated and secretive.

Defend your son. It is YOUR job.

+++Agrees, it is YOUR job to protect your son from abuse+++

You can tell your wife "I am not pleased he looked at Porn, however, YOU are unjustly punishing him for looking at something that is NATURAL to be curious about. How about WE give him examples of HEALTHY sexuality, instead of making him freaked out by you every day?"

That is not being SOFT on "Sin" that is taking a stand on not allowing your son (or even yourself!) from being badgered about sexual maturity.

When my son was caught looking at Porn, I was shocked and sat down with him and said..."So, today gets to be THAT day for a really awkward conversation!"

I did not belittle him, but explained it was normal to be curious to know how sex worked in all its varieties. I talked with him and how Porn was a lot like Pro Wrestling. It looked exciting, but most of it is VERY staged by professional sex workers who make it look like women are always available for anything. Porn does not focus on relationships at all. I explained to him that most bodies do not look that way in RL and Porn can distort what a normal, sexual relationship can become with a real companion, commitment and love.

I let him know I was not happy he was looking at Porn, but I was not going to condemn him for it either. I would rather he channeled his energy into something else, but who am *I* to stop the hormonal surges of a teenage boy? LOL!!

Your wife could do far more damage to your son with her shaming him! He could develop shame over sexual encounters, when it *IS* something wonderful! Granted, a LOT of people in ChurchInc. have some distorted versions of sexuality. I decided long ago to be very open with my kids about sex, their bodies, and even birth control and STD's! My ex TBM spouse flipped and said I was giving permission to them to have sex. Guess what? Studies show that the MORE information you give to adequately prepare young adults for sex, the more likely they will put it OFF until ready instead of feeling pressured!

Most of all, I wanted my kids to avoid getting married A' La Mormon to "legally" have sex. I did that. It sucked.

Now, I "try before I buy". lol!

RMM

If it's not very good, I'd tell her something to the effect that treating Son #2 as she treated Son #1 might cause the same rift.

It's hard to say. My father learned a lot from how I reacted to his treatment, because when I saw him doing the same thing to my brothers (12 and 15 years younger than me), I asked him if he wanted a repeat or a do over. He went for the repeat. Now two of us are as far away from him as possible.

Brother, I'm so sorry you are in this situation.
We have a filter called k-9 on our pcs. This is an easy way to keep must of that stuff out. Porn can't be a sin, since much of religion is bogus anyway. However, it is inappropriate for children, much like bad language, violence, alcohol, etc.
Can't do much to help with your wife because it is her belief.
Could you try to talk to the bishop and convince him to 'go light' on your son? Maybe this will help your wife agree with your level of approach.
Above all things, get a lot of personal time with your sons, and reassure them that they should not feel guilty or devastated, while not condoning that's it's ok to indulge in it either. The most effective way is to empower the children to understand what's right and wrong, and have themselves do the right thing themselves.
Best wishes, and we hope for the best.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/27/2014 01:03AM by mostcorrectedbook.

I don't live in a bubble.

I was the asshole kid that told everyone that Santa Claus isn't real. In kindergarten.

My 14-year-old son did not wake up one day knowing foreign words that mean "porn." He and his friends talked. They go to school and they talk. They walk around and they talk. They go to McDonalds and they talk. They're a friggin' adolescent cabal.

If a kid is determined enough, they will find a way to do *anything*, and you won't have a clue because they are not miniclones of us. Don't want them to watch porn? Keep a desktop computer in the living room with the screen facing the couch. No laptops and no smartphones. And be near the computer every second your kid is home. Not feasible, right?

W/r/t cursing. Once a kid works up the nerve to say ish in front of their friends, they might not curse around you, but they're going to curse, and the world will not end.

I got lucky in the booze department because my son and his friends were a bunch of nerds. The kids came to my house to play video games. I played with them, I talked with them, and one of them came out to me as gay - it was a trial run to see how an adult would react. It was an honor to have his trust.

I write all this to say that they respected me because I respected *them*. I told my son that if he's ever impaired or can't get home because his ride is impaired, CALL ME! I will pick him up, no questions asked until the next day. I told him that there isn't anything that he will do that I haven't done or that someone I know hasn't done, and part of my job is getting him out of a fix. That doesn't mean that there won't be consequences, but tell me what's going on before it gets out of hand so we can deal with it.

Sometimes I received TMI that lead to me saying, "Why did you think that xxxxxxxxx behind the library by a girl you kind of like but your best friend *really* likes was a good idea?" Throw in her best friend liking my son, and I was like, "Dude. Of *course* everyone is angry with you. And I'd rather you not get arrested behind the damn library!" But that was the deal we had. The situation was spiraling; we worked it out.

His behavior was completely out of my control. If a kid is cool with the punishment, they'll do whatever they want from the time they learn how to lie. Luckily, my kid thought I could read his mind, so he told on himself. All I could do was tell my son why I thought something was a bad idea, what will likely happen if he did it, and what I'd likely do when I found out.

We talked about porn a lot. I mean blue in the face a lot. [Insert testicles joke HERE] You know what I realized? There is nothing I could do about it except tell him why I didn't want him to see it. I told him about some of the horrific things he might find, and that I was afraid he'd find them, and those images would never leave his mind. I told him what was completely off limits and worthy of me trashing his computer. We talked about people involved in sex trade and that he must keep in mind that those are human beings he's watching. We talked about how it's natural to be interested and curious about sex and all things verboten and adult, but that he had to be careful. And then he told me he was watching cartoons for Pete's sake.

We didn't talk about right and wrong. He had a firm grip on that. We talked about reality. He learned from me, and I learned from him. We're still learning, and he's 24.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/27/2014 02:01AM by Beth.

natural sexual feelings are inappropriate? I'm glad I don't live in your world.

Talk to the biship, if his views are more in line with yours you might be able to see him together. You could tell her you think you guys need some help knowing how best to deal with the situation. If the info comes from the bishop she might be more willing to listen and you wouldn't have to fight.

The question is, why are you putting up with this kind of behavior from her? It isn't normal. Put a filtering program on the computer, a short punishment of time off of the computer, and be done with it. You can't control everything, and that is what I would tell her. I would also take charge of this situation. Tell her that it's a father-son thing and you will deal with it. If you can't do that without a blowup, have the blowup. For heaven's sake, please stop letting your wife ruin your family life and your relationship with your son.

ETA -- Fenwick's idea about taking this to your bishop (if he is a reasonable type) might work. If you want to try this, I would have a private talk with the bishop ahead of your visit to him as a couple.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/27/2014 01:54AM by summer.

Agree with summer. I realise you are asking for help with doing what he's suggesting, but it's very important that you handle it so as to pull way back on the hysteria.

Can you be present with your son if there is a discussion with the bishop? Make it a guy thing?

Can you discuss the effects of this with your older son to get some perspective?

So much harm is done by shaming. It's one of the sickest aspects of the cult.

My dad had two wives, my mother and my stepmother. I see the difference in the two families, and it has to do with the differences in the mothers. My father didn't intervene with either of his wives in an effective way, so the personality disorders of the wives drove the agenda. I wish he had known how and when to keep their craziness from driving the agenda.

I'd be very surprised if there was a 13-14 yr old boy who was NOT curious about viewing porn.

It sounds to me like this is actually less about porn and more about abuse. Once your wife has made her point to your son, everything else is just an ongoing mantra of "Ÿou're no good."Ï hate you"Ÿou're a horrible person."etc.

It really doesn't matter what your wife actually says, that is the message that your son is hearing.

From what you described about your wife's treatment of your older son, she is abusive. Your real choice no is to go along with the abuse or step in a protect your child. You already know how this is going to play out if you do nothing. If you have any doubts ask your older son.

Yup. The real issue isn't the porn, it's the daily abuse. It needs to stop.

"but has anyone out there in exmo land found a way to handle these kinds of parenting differences in a way that does not lead to horrible arguments and accusations?"
D-I-V-O-R-C-E as the famous country song says. And you fight for custody. She is a SHE DEVIL!

What person in their right mind would let another adult, who is not the parent, have a one on one conversation about sex/porn with their child?

Protect your child and stand up to your wife, you are just as much the problem for not standing up for your child. To me that is just as abusive.

I got caught viewing pornography multiple times in my youth.

My mother flipped out, became verbally abusive and very aggressive.
My Father was more level headed, put passwords and locks on the computers..

Still both of them were quite shocked. I was the kid that gave them no issues, straight A achiever, Eagle Scout, compliments from every teacher, good friends... the whole nine yards. Yet both of them have caught me watching gay porn multiple times.

It's probably gonna happen with your son again.

Your wife needs to understand first that she is hurting her son. Black and white thinking is not an option here. I am on good terms with my mother over all, but there is a sad distance between us... a bond that was once there isn't. I can't say it was all because of the porn use and the following verbal abuse, but things could definitely have been different... Shaming your child repeatedly may cause them to act the way you want for a time, but one day shame will yield to resentment.

Your wife and your son will both come to mourn the loss of the mother-son bond, even if they never realize it is missing.

I don't have enough life experience to give solid advice on how to proceed from here, just enough to point out that you are wise for believing something needs to be done.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/27/2014 03:04AM by nonsequiter.

Talk to the bishop (?). Are you people insane? That is the last idiot you need. Be a man and tell your wife to back off. A real man protects his children even from their mother.

When you say "porn" are we talking about pictures of naked women or actually watching sexual intercourse? Talk to your son to find out. After all, mormons seem to think bare shoulders are "porn". Tell your wife that shaming your son will only make him secretive and may make looking at porn even more attractive because it is something forbidden. And keep the bishop and church out of this. Since there's no such thing as confidentiality in the mormon church, it's none of their damn business.

No Bishop; that's an incredibly bad idea. Stand your ground and refuse to let this woman abuse your son. Men and women can come and go in our lives, but these are our only children, and we are their only parents, a unique relationship. She needs to grow up herself, and get over something once in a while or you may not see your sons again at some point. I knew a bishop and his wife who were hard a$$es to their children, teaching them to be "righteous" by belittling and bullying. Years down the road, 2 out of their 5 children will speak to them or have anything to do with them.

Don't you have an equal say in his "punishment"? Are you parenting or leaving her to deal with it all? You don't mention how you would deal with the situation if left to address it on your own without her involvement.
Without any background information on your parenting style or history it is impossible to advise.

I think you have been given some good advice here as how to address your son but the differences in the approach taken by you and your wife to parenting are something you two will have to address.

I do know that sometimes women over react to situations where they feel they are not being supported by their spouse. I'm not saying this is the case here, but you haven't mentioned about your involvement except your critique of her approach. If you disagree with her then speak up and stand your ground.

If you have a complete opposite view than your wife about the matter then your job is to sit down with her and come to a compromise that is satisfying to both of you and works toward the best thing for your son.

This seems bordering on abuse to me. Perhaps get a family counselor to help and maybe get your wife to calm down? Tell her that all mormons boys and men do this, even if they keep it secret.

Hopefully you'll have a good Bishop who'll perhaps assure your wife that it's not THAT serious. Bishops vary a lot though, so hopefully you're lucky enough to have a good one.

Your wife DOES realize that by doing this, she is ensuring that your son will never talk with her about anything important ever again, right?

And that he'll be out of the house with her out of his life as soon as he can manage it...

You might consider mentioning this to her if she isn't already aware of this.

Lurker From Beyond Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Your wife DOES realize that by doing this, she is
> ensuring that your son will never talk with her
> about anything important ever again, right?

This is the most important take away from this thread. She has just neutralized any hope of being an active parent to your teen.

In all of this hysteria, is anyone talking to your son about what porn is and what it is not. This kid has to grow up and have normal relationships with real women.

Tell your wife to calm down, don't make the kid talk to the bishop. He confessed that he saw porn, so it must have made him uncomfortable. If you can't have a calm, rational, informative discussion about sex with your son, you need to find a counselor who can. Your wife has already done some damage. If you let this escalate and continue, your son and his future wife are likely to pay the price for his mother's crazy behavior.

I was exposed to a fair amount of porn growing up, and guess what: I have never molested or raped anyone, I don't have twisted, unnatural fantasies, I'm not some sex-crazed addict. As it turns out, I was just a normal, horny kid who just happened to like watching sex!

Wife: trying to control your son. That comes from the LD$ idea of controlling people through guilt about sex. They might tell young kids "Porn leads to masturbation ("self-abuse")."

Ironically, the LD$ church abuses its members, who then abuse their children.

Your son will find porn to look at, probably thru friends. I'd tell him to not let it bother him, but to try to not let it become an addiction, and next time, don't get caught.

Your son is also learning a lesson in how fathers should behave here. Do you really want to model how to be a doormat?

If you can't protect him, at least talk to him about how to talk to the bishop in the inevitable private interviews and how to cover his tracks better.