http://now.msn.com/i-am-adam-lanzas-mother-says-mom-of-mentally-ill-son



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/17/2012 09:13PM by saviorself.

I read that too. My heart goes out to that mother. We must address the lack of affordable, available and effective mental health care in this country.

One of my family members was schizophrenic and finally committed suicide. Unless you have lived in this situation, you have no idea how helpless and hopeless everyone, including the mentally ill person, feels.

We, as a society, have to confront this challenge. It is way too big for any family to deal with.

I sent the link to my red state obamahater family members in Tejas.

I think this person hit the nail on the head.

This is NOT about guns. It's about mental illness. Every time something like this happens people start talking about guns. Seldom do you hear anything about mental illness.

This is about mental illness. Just why is it people don't want to talk about that? Why do they refuse to talk about the root of the problem?


There are millions of rapists in the world. Do we talk about removing the penis from every male? No. We know the problem isn't their penis, it's their mind. We have no idea how to fix their mind. We try, but I don't think we're very successful. So far, incarceration has been our only way to protect society from rapists. Taking their penis's isn't the solution.

Same with guns. If someone is mentally ill, and wants to kill people, they will. If they don't have a gun, there are plenty of other ways. They've thrown kids off cliffs, slashed them with knives, suffocated, poisoned, strangled, and beat them to death.

Mental illness has been ignored in this country. We are paying the price. As long as we ignore it, we will continue to pay.

They have had quit a bit of success cutting their balls off. Or, to continue your thought, leaving the gun but taking the ammo.

Wasn't it Ronald Reagan who put all those mentally ill people on the street rather than continuing to give them government assistance ?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/17/2012 10:14PM by Dave the Atheist.

YES!

Andrea Yates killed 5 children. If there would have been more kids, she would have killed them too. She is mentally ill.
All of the people around her knew it. They still left her alone with children.

Until people take mental illness serious, the horror stories will keep coming.

Pretty darn sure it was, right time frame.
At the state mental institution, Agnew in Ca, they basically just opened the doors

Ironically Ca is still years ahead in providing continuing care than Wa state.

saved the state butt-loads of money.

of course we had to deal with people taking dumps b/w parked cars as we walked past pushing our kiddie strollers,

but it saved us butt-loads of money.

I remember when it happened. There was an explosion in homeless people in Manhattan. I passed a number of them each day on my way to work, and this was on the upper east side. For a long time, you couldn't get a seat to sit in at Grand Central Station, because every seat was taken by a homeless person.

This was during the boom times of the 1980's. People were just turned out of the mental institutions that had been caring for them.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/17/2012 10:55PM by summer.

There definitely needed to be some type of gradual release, not being out on the streets overnight! If it had to be done.

The same thing happened in Canada in the 80s. It was no doubt hugely distressing to many who had relied on their institutions for support.

But is institutionalization the answer? Unless the individual wants to and voluntarily asks for institutionalization, it could backfire?

How about in home supports, counseling for the individuals and their families, better medication controls? Anti bullying support for the bullied in every school and finding more healthy ways to empower teens and youth when they are young and giving them positive activities instead of many of them playing video games over and over again? Schools seem to be a breeding ground for upset teens. Can't the schools be more of a positive place, a place where kids want to go, instead of want to leave?

And of course, if all of these fail, then institutionalization?

It's both a gun issue and a mental health issue. Adam Lanza's mother owned an AR-15 (the civilian version of the military M-16 assault rifle). She took her son to the shooting range regularly for target practice. I guess that didn't work out so well for her and the students who died. She should have kept her guns locked up and away from her mentally disabled son.

Not sure that it is relevant in any way, but Liza Long, the author of the "I am Adam Lanza's mother" post, calls herself a "post but not-anti Mormon":

http://anarchistsoccermom.blogspot.com/2011/11/book-of-broadway.html

I have a disabled son with mental health issues and he has read her blogposts and says she is a horrible, violent mother "who shouldn't be a parent."

Why? He feels she has a lot of rage towards her kid. I would say that as much as I feel her pain with frustration with trying to care for her child, she doesn't seem to understand that there are some things you don't do with kids with mental illness. You can't parent them the "typical way" - you have to modify your parenting. Sounds to me like she keeps trying to expect him to behave typically - but he probably can't. Also, she has never gotten him an accurate diagnosis. Why not? There is a special assessment required by a team of professionals who could help arrive at a fairly accurate assessment and with that, could then select appropriate treatment.

I don't know if her angry posts, and angry comments made to her son, were made before or after her leaving Mormonism - but while she was still a Mormon, she certainly had depression. She wrote:

"On the 12-hour drive back to Idaho, I did some thinking. And this is what I thought: I am 35 years old. I have accomplished every goal I set for myself. I married the handsome magna cum laude law student in the temple. I bore him four beautiful, brilliant children. I earned a fluffy masters degree that makes me look like I’m smart. I am miserable, and I want to die."

CW is absolutely right. It is both a mental health issue and a gun issue. Without the assault weapons, big capacity clips and "cop killer" bullets, people might have at least a chance against a gunman.

With better mental health care as well as some mechanism to confine mentally ill people who pose a danger to themselves and others until they are well enough to be out on the streets, the other part of the problem might be addressed.

Mindlight is correct about then Governor Reagan deserving the "credit" for shutting down the mental health hospitals in California. Ironically, he was later the target of a mentally ill shooter. Hinckly is schizophrenic; but some shooters may be just terribly depressed and act to hurt themselves and their loved ones.

Incidentally, if anyone wants to get a glimmer of understanding of what schizophrenia is like in action, I recommend the film "A Beautiful Mind." It is based on a true story with some of the ugly reality downplayed. However, it does give a good depiction of the delusions that are part of the disease.

The problem is complex, but we can't wait to do something. We have to start now with some control of guns. Then we need to go to work on the mental health system. We can't just throw up our hands and say that it is too hard. Those 20 little children, the 6 adults who tried to protect them, the mother who couldn't save her son from what he became, all the lives wrecked in the space of 10 minutes time--they all deserve for us to stand up for them.

but it should have been more obvious to her that having practically an arsenal, even locked, wasn't the safest practice. I won't fault a single woman for having a carefully locked and hidden handgun for protection, but anything else on the premises in a home wherein resides an unstable offspring is potential trouble.

I think the thing most everyone is forgetting is if Adam had wanted to kill someone he would have found a way regardless. It's not like he would have woken up and thought I want to kill a bunch of people but there are no guns so oh well, I guess I'll go ice skating instead! He would have found a way. All he needed to do was grab some fertelizer and gasoline like Timothy McVey did. Yes it suck that his mother has assault rifles, I'm not clear as to why they were not locked up as they should have been but he could have done just as much damage with a hunting rifle or some common household goods.

No, he couldn't have done as much damage with a hunting rifle. You have to stop and reload. You can't shoot off 30 rounds at a whack. People have a chance. That is the difference. He could have set off a bomb, but there are more chances for things to go wrong. You just can't get around the absolute absurdity of allowing weapons like this to be sold.

Building a bomb requires knowledge--easily found, granted--then the initiative to track down all the parts, then the patience to assemble it all, then the skill not to blow yourself up while doing it. A disturbed mind might not have the follow-through to go through all those steps.

But if the idea pops into your head and, voila, many powerful guns are within a few steps of where you are . . .

I'll take my chances on the bomb builder.

Live by the gun, die by the gun
By her own hand she found her end, she trained and raised him to see guns as a solution. He was comfortable with weapons not designed to shoot a buck for food.

cold?

If this" I am Adam Lanza's mother" has not sought a proper diagnosis and help for HER too, she is playing with a loaded weapon, her son

A response to her article:

I Refuse to be Adam Lanza’s Mother - http://www.thebalancedmind.org/connect/blog/2012/12/i-refuse-to-be-adam-lanza%E2%80%99s-mother



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/18/2012 12:49PM by swiper.

from the article- "In fact, people with mental illness are far more likely to be victims of crime than to commit crimes themselves."


I have seen this to be true myself. (Thinking about the mentally ill people who have to live on the streets and deal with trying to survive on a daily basis without much or no help)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/18/2012 12:52PM by Tupperwhere.

I have lived in California, Washington, Oregon and Utah with a mentally ill son from age 23 to the present age 44. He has schizophrenia and bipolar illness.

California is NOT better than Washington. I got my son released from a California mental hospital where he had been so heavily sedated on Thorazine (old drug!) that he was drooling and I was the only person he recognized.

Arriving in Washington, they would not accept him into the mental hospital until he "did something." So sure enough, it was property damage and he went to jail, THEN to a mental hospital (even though he had a full-blown diagnosis and several suicide attempts).

Those mental patients released by Reagan are NOT saving you money--the majority of them are now in prison. The money moved from one column to another because of a politics. Reagan's idea was well, now we have better drugs so everybody clear out. Clearly not a well-supervised action dedicated to the best care for the mentally ill, now was it?

Once my son was in the state hospital, he went through the whole system, moving from the criminally insane ward all the way through the PALS program and eventual release after 2 years. When setbacks occurred, which they do, he was taken into St Peter's Hospital in Olympia for 90 days, where they fine-tuned his drugs.

Meanwhile back in California, a deaf mute and six other patients of the state mental hospital died from abuse whereas during the same time period NO patients died. In California, my son had gone for a short period to one mental hospital and was released with a guitar and all his belongings, clock radio, etc., and told he was "done." They didn't even bother to call me to pick him up! That was in Richmond, CA. In Bakersfield, the Kern County Hospital released him before he was detoxed from a suicide attempt by overdose and he was found wandering around the streets in 105 degree weather babbling. He had my phone number in his wallet, thank goodness.

I would take Oregon, Utah or Washington mental health programs any time compared with California. He is here now and has been "helped" with supported job services for going on four years with the result of one job for six weeks at the food bank. Compare that with Utah, who found him a job with a team of people like himself, cleaning a dental office in Holladay for two hours a day five days a week. He won an attendance award at their company holiday party! In Utah, he was able to get financial help and live in his own apartment. In California, he lives in a roach-infested hotel at market rate with no money available for a disabled person for housing assistance.

I have been through horrifying experiences which I will not bother to describe-- I have posted about these before. I have been chased in a parking lot, I have screamed over the roof of a car in the middle of the street, I have redialed the phone and caught my son dialing a gun store, I have had him show me a self-inflicted knife wound in his chest on the way to Christmas dinner.

My other son told me flat out he wanted to kill people with a rifle--strangers. I gasped and asked why. He said "so I can make them stop laughing at me." He told me he wanted "the respect" a killer gets (he had been in prison for drug sales). I called the police and you know what they told me --this was in Sunnyvale, CA-- they said, "Call us if he does anything, he has to commit a crime."

Later he fractured the skull of his best friend with one blow. I called the police and both he and the friend denied it was him. They said they had been attacked by "some black guys" cruising around Cupertino looking for a fight.

He wanted to go back to prison because he was "someone" there and he felt he had no place in regular society. He ended up going with a buddy in Utah going from bar to bar picking fights so he could beat people up, which he enjoyed. I got him to go to a psychiatrist in Utah who told him, "Come back when you have stopped drinking and we'll see what psychiatric problems you might have."

We have to have a mental health policy that ACCEPTS a warning call from a citizen to report a danger to society BEFORE the person commits a crime like mass murder.

Ironically, later (in Orem) I called the police because he told me he was thinking of killing his sisters in their beds. The police came right out and took him into custody where he was transferred to a facility for a psychiatric evaluation.

You almost get the feeling it depends on who answers the phone whether your report is taken seriously.


Anagrammy

If the guns & ammo had been locked, Adam probably would've used a baseball bat on his mom and all those kids would be safe.

People who don't follow firearm safety procedures can expect bad things to happen, so yeah, I kinda blame mom. But I blame dad too. Where is he?

Anagrammy, I have often been struck by the wisdom of your posts. I understand now how hard-won your wisdom is.

The schizophrenic in my life was my mom. My dad was the rock that kept her as safe as it was possible for her to be and me and my siblings in a somewhat normal family life. I have often thought how different our lives would have been without my dad to protect her and us.

I suspect you were that person for your family.

Thank you for being the person you are.

Thanks for the kind words.

My mother was the crazy person in my childhood. My sister and I lived in fear of her. We never knew what to expect, the uncertainty was unnerving.

Thinking back on my childhood helps me to accept my faults. I have a picture of myself in second grade on my bookshelf to remind myself how young I was when certain things happened and how they affected my life.

For example (regarding religion), when I was six years old my mother told me I was not pious enough. I still remember blinking back tears, not even knowing what the word meant. My mother was very jealous of me and treated me badly "to make up" for how much attention I got from other people (meaning my father).

I am grateful to my father for being at least one sane parent. I only recently realized that he must have been the one to make her stop beating us with his belts when we were in preschool. He never said anything critical about her in front of us, but one day the beatings stopped.

I would be curious to know how you felt, but I knew that my mother did not like children. I thought she loved me as an exception. My kindergarten teacher was the first adult I got close to that loved children. Her name was Mrs. Matts--can't believe I still remember that. I cried when I was promoted to first grade.

I'll bet there are lots of children like us. I dreaded whenever the school said to bring candy or have your mother volunteer for something. It would throw my mother into a rage.

How are you doing now? Are you still dealing with family of origin issues or have you had therapy?


Anagrammy

Mental health is just part of the equation. In my case, my son was violent and I had him arrested and put him in mental health facilities more than once. Each time, when the insurance ran out (usually five days), they'd call me to come pick him up without ever properly diagnosing him, follow up care or anything. Back then (the 90's) they put every teenager with problems in rehab hospitals and diagnosed them with bipolar instead of finding out what the real problem was so we could get him help. Unless he committed a serious crime, help was not available. He never did, but threatened to kill me and my daughters on numerous occasions and once threatened to kill his stepdad. By then he was an adult and there was absolutely nothing we could do.

I have sympathy for this mom. OTH, I also knew my son was a danger and kept any and all things that could be used as a weapon under lock and key for my family's safety.

Agree

Wa state provides no mental health care for persons just on Medicare. at all

ALL the states need to get it together

There is no one size fits all solution to mental illness. There is no need to institutionalize the great majority of people who are mentally ill, but it should be easier to force a mentally ill adult to get help. I know a number of mentally ill people who do quite well when they are given the proper attention and medication. They shouldn't all be institutionalized just because an infinitesimally small minority acts violently.