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Posted by: olematty ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 02:24AM

Many are Atheist, because they actively don't believe.....I am an Atheist because I know that I can not know.... so I live my life in the present........

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Posted by: blissfulcrush ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 03:16AM

I think that is being agnosttic.

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Posted by: olematty ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 03:20AM

Atheism is admitting you don't and can't know.

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Posted by: Fenwick Montgomery ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 03:43AM

Blissfulcrush is correct. (A)gnosticism is what speaks to one’s knowledge not (A)theism. Theism is the belief there is a god and Atheism is being without that belief. What you’re putting forward is the strongest form of Agnosticism, that even in the face of evidence we cannot know if there is a god.

If you want to talk about Atheism you’re going to be discussing beliefs, not knowledge.

Of course (A)theism and (A)gnosticism are not mutually exclusive.

You can be a…

Gnostic Atheist – You don’t believe in gods and you know they don’t exist
Agnostic Atheist – You don’t believe in gods but are not claiming they certainly don’t exist
Gnostic Theist – You believe in Gods and you know they exist
Agnostic Theist – You believe in Gods but don’t claim certainty

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Posted by: MJ ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 08:17AM

Actually, that is not correct. You can be theist or atheist, (not believe in or believe in a god) and still not know there is a god or not.

You can look up agnostic atheist or agnostic theist on wiki

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Posted by: Greyfort ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 08:11AM

blissfulcrush Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think that is being agnosttic.

No, because atheism deals with what you believe. If you say, "I don't believe in God," then you're an atheist. But you can still say you've no idea whether or not one exists. You just don't believe there is one.

The only requirement for atheism is that you don't believe in a god.

While atheism deals with what you believe, being agnostic deals with what you know. Agnostic means 'without knowledge.' It just means that if you ask someone, "Does God exist," and they say, "I've no idea," then that is an agnostic response.

But they can still say, "But I don't believe there is one," and that makes them atheist in their belief, but agnostic in their knowledge.

Anyway, I'm atheist because I've studied a lot of things over the past few years and that's where my studies have led me. The more I study, the more I learn about the natural world and that's what makes sense to me.

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Posted by: Puli ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 02:24PM

I liked calling myself an agnostic rather than an atheist (and still do) but I came to realize that agnosticism is a form of atheism. Atheism doesn't require a specific belief that God does not exist; it only require that one has no articular belief in God(s). As an agnostic, I have no particular belief in a God or Gods which by the definition I mentioned, I am also an atheist.

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Posted by: greengobbleyguck ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 03:41AM

Born that way. Felt the urges a this in the shell of a believer but stayed in the closet for many moons. When. I was 7 mom dunked in the tub by two teens and was sucking on my mom's titty and got dunked in the process. Wasn't till I moved out of the dungeon in the bottom of the house at 30 when I saw light and started wondering if it was gawd. Nope it was the night drop box at locals banks when local secretaries dropped of tithes of the damned that made me see a just another corporate process for another week at just another church paying off more bank fees.

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Posted by: Greyfort ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 08:53AM

One can be an agnostic atheist.

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Posted by: greenAngels ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 08:56AM

for me, the idea of God fell apart, taking Mormonism with it. I was in my mid-twenties and began thru informal study of religion in general and Christianity, and alot of deep thought: that the story of Jesus Christ just didn't make sense to me. It sounded very much like Mary & Joseph got pregnant out of wedlock and made up a fantastic story. It seemed like the obvious KISS solution to me. I also became more humble, realizing that my very existence is pure luck, that I'm really noone special in the grand scheme of things, either there is some all knowing supreme being or the KISS answer is the that God is something we made up to explain things. Those near-death experiences that people cling to? Just the flashes of the brain burning out while we pump every drug and try everything to restart you. Our very being resides in our brain and when it dies, you cease to exist. There's no evidence of a benevolent supreme being at all. If there is a God, he/she/it is an asshole and certainly not worthy of my time or attention.

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Posted by: jbstyle ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 09:43PM

greenAngels Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> for me, the idea of God fell apart, taking
> Mormonism with it.

For me, Mormonism fell apart, and took God with it. The Mormons base everything on the "witness of the spirit." If I no longer trust the witness of the spirit regarding the Mormon church, why would I believe that same witness about something else, namely God?

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Posted by: greenAngels ( )
Date: September 03, 2014 03:43PM

jbstyle Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> greenAngels Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > for me, the idea of God fell apart, taking
> > Mormonism with it.
>
> For me, Mormonism fell apart, and took God with
> it. The Mormons base everything on the "witness
> of the spirit." If I no longer trust the witness
> of the spirit regarding the Mormon church, why
> would I believe that same witness about something
> else, namely God?


Makes sense to me. :) I find it very interesting to see how each of us comes to their own conclusions.

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Posted by: excatholic ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 09:04AM

I'm an atheist because there is no evidence whatsoever that a god exists. I have really never believed in a god, but faked it for some time.

Should compelling evidence be found, I would be happy to evaluate it and revise my opinion, but until then, no god.

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Posted by: Brother Of Jerry ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 09:24AM

Not another debate on whether atheist is spelled with a "g". Just shoot me.

We don't know anything with absolute 100% certainty. If that is the standard, then the word "know" is essentially useless. I don't know if the sun will be in the sky 5 minutes from now. It may have exploded already, but the light from the explosion hasn't gotten here yet.

I don't know for sure that any of you exist. I know people who claim they post on RfM, but I've never actually seen them writing a post.

I don't know if I won the Powerball lottery Sunday. I don't have a ticket, but someone driving through idaho, returning to Utah, may have bought a ticket for me, and not delivered it yet. That's happened before. So there is a minuscule chance I may end up with the winning ticket. I don't know that to be false with 100% certainty.

You know something when the probability of being wrong is so small that you completely ignore it. I know the sun will be in the sky 5 minutes from now, and that I haven't won the Powerball lottery. Not so sure about your existence.

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Posted by: SuperMinor ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 10:35AM

Brother Of Jerry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> We don't know anything with absolute 100%
> certainty.

I know that I don't know everything with 100% absolute certainty.

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Posted by: blueorchid ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 10:15AM

When I left Mormonism I rewound my religion-o-meter back to zero. I have found no good reason to wind it forward again.

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Posted by: kolobian ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 10:30AM

Was born without a belief in any gods.

Western culture taught me to believe in some, and when I realized there was no good reason to maintain those beliefs, I reverted to atheism...

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Posted by: RPackham ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 10:37AM

I have often been asked to tell the story of how I became an atheist.

The short - and perhaps somewhat flippant - answer would be: I was born that way. And that's the truth.

I am using the word "atheist" to mean someone who does not have a belief in God. And that's exactly the way I was born, as were all of us, I suspect.

But that is not the story that I have been asked to tell, and it would not be the complete story, either, since within days after my birth, my very devout Mormon parents started to make a believer of me, by taking me to church to have me "blessed" by the elders and given a Christian name. From then on, until well into my adulthood, I was trained to be a theist, that is, a believer in God. It was a very thorough and time-consuming process, and very effective. Until I was about 27 years old, I was a devout believer in God, as the Mormons understand God. And then I began to return to the "religion" of my birth.

The story of how I came to leave Mormonism I have told elsewhere, so I won't repeat that story here. But it will be helpful here to say that I only came to realize that Mormonism was not true when I undertook to demonstrate that it WAS true. The more I searched for explanations to the contradictions and problems of Mormon theology and history, the more problems I found, until I realized that Mormonism was a structure of beliefs and a web of false history that could not possibly be of divine origin, but rather had all the earmarks of something terribly human, trying to pass itself off as from God. I certainly was not biased against Mormonism: I wanted very much for it to be true. But it turned out to be glaringly false. As I later stood back from Mormonism and viewed it more from a distance, that falseness became more and more obvious, and I was almost embarrassed at why it took me so long to see it.

My experience with Christianity and with belief in God has been similar.

I examined other religions and religious philosophies. We have since learned the natural explanations for many things that used to be attributed to the whimsy of a deity. We have also exposed the errors of much which used to be accepted as fact on the basis of divine revelation, such as the geocentric universe, and the age of the earth. Even those who still believe in God must admit that the best course in the case of illness is to get the doctor to prescribe the appropriate medicine, not to ask the minister to determine how we have sinned and to perform a ritual sacrifice. So it seems to me that God is rapidly losing his job as an explanation for things we don't understand.

So, I suppose you can say that I became an atheist because I have seen no convincing evidence for the existence of God as claimed by the theists.

I am content to admit that many such questions may have no answer, at least no answer that I would be able to understand (hell, I don't even understand trigonometry!), or that will be found in the foreseeable future, that is, during my lifetime. In the meantime, I think the best policy is to be content with no answer at all to those questions, rather than to risk accepting a phony answer as genuine.

I am also quite willing to admit that our human knowledge of the universe is still limited, and that we may not be (in fact, almost surely are not) the most intelligent and advanced beings in the universe. There are obviously powerful forces at work in the universe, and perhaps intelligences, of which we may be unaware. But those forces and intelligences do not have to be different in basic nature from those forces and intelligences we know. That is, there is no reason to call them "gods" or "God," any more than the fish in my trout pond should consider me to be essentially different from it, simply because I have control over its world and am (hopefully) more intelligent than it is.

I have studied all the so-called proofs of God's existence, mostly as offered by Christians, since they seem to be the self-declared authorities on God. I have worked patiently and carefully through them all. All their proofs have serious logical fallacies. And I have as yet to see a convincing refutation of the numerous arguments by atheists that God (at least as described by Christians) cannot possibly exist.

Why should we abandon the rules of evidence when evaluating religious claims? Why should we accept less evidence, rather than demanding more, when someone wants us to accept as fact the existence of an invisible being of an illogical nature and beyond our comprehension? Why should we fudge on the strict rules of logic in a religious discussion? Why should we allow ourselves, if we insist on such evidence and logic, to be branded as stubborn, evil, rebellious, proud, materialistic (all of these said with a condescending, pitying, pious sneer)? What virtue is there in being gullible? Which absurdity (of the many absurd descriptions of God) is it more virtuous to believe?

I would believe in God if God could arrange for some credible evidence of his existence to come my way. So far, that has not happened. I have to wonder why. The believer, of course, will say that I am stubborn, proud, too "learned." But God - if he exists - knows that is not true of me. Still, God remains silent. I have dialed, but there's no answer and no message on the answering machine. Should I try to have some hallucinatory experience? How would I know that it was not simply a hallucination? Therefore, I see no reason whatsoever to pretend that God exists.

I called myself an agnostic for years, but I really think there is no difference between the atheist saying "I have no belief in any god" and the agnostic saying "I don't know whether any god really exists." They seem to me to be intellectually equivalent. And does it matter? Perhaps I am really an "apatheist" - I really don't care.

Some atheists (sometimes called "positive atheists") say "I believe that god does NOT exist." This seems to me to suffer from the same intellectual arrogance and faith-based thinking as the statement "I believe that God exists." I think very few atheists who have really thought about it take this position - it turns atheism into a religion.

I would not want everyone to be an atheist. The believers are probably correct when they say that it is only a belief in God and man's accountability to God that prevents them from robbing convenience stores, romancing the neighbor's wife, and kicking the dog. I believe them. I am glad that they have a belief in God to keep them in line.

Atheism is not inherently evil, any more than religion is. Both belief and non-belief can be used for either good or evil, and have been. So I tend to get annoyed when believers try to take the moral high ground and ignore the bloody history of religion as it has tried to promote belief in the "true" god. Atheism is a view held by some of the kindest and most loving people in the world, whose greatest fault in the eyes of many is their skepticism, their stubborn refusal to be flummoxed, and whose wholehearted open-mindedness is too often overlooked and not often enough imitated.

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Posted by: imaworkinonit ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 11:38AM

I tried really hard until my early 30s to have a close spiritual relationship with God. But after over 2 decades of unanswered prayers and a persistent lack of testimony, I realized that it just wasn't going to happen: Either God didn't exist at all, or he wasn't going to answer.

Either way, it wasn't in my power to know he existed, and I was done jumping through religious hoops and praying. If He did exist, the ball was in his court, so to speak.

At that point, I didn't believe in God, but I was open to the idea that God might exist, but might be unknowable.

Over time, I gradually came to look at God as a myth, like Zeus or Odin. There is just no reason to believe in a being that defies all experience in the natural world: invisible, all-powerful, reads everyone's mind, can be multiple places at one time, knows the future, created the whole universe, can control the weather, heal the sick, resurrect the dead, and is immortal. (Just to name a few impossibilities). The God our society has created is a magic superhero. With a temper.

I don't care if I'm called an agnostic or an atheist, but I don't believe in God.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/02/2014 11:40AM by imaworkinonit.

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Posted by: LemonYellowSun ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 12:07PM

Why shouldn't I be an atheist?

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Posted by: SusieQ#1 ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 12:29PM

I use the term: Eccentric Eclectic for me.

I'm agnostic (actually we all are as any ultimate reality as a god is unknowable), a bit atheist, (not convinced I need to believe in any of the multitude of deities, (however, willing to accept that the belief is real to the believer),
a bit humanist, (this definition works for me: "Humanism is a philosophical and ethical stance that emphasizes the value and agency of human beings, individually and collectively, and generally prefers critical thinking and evidence (rationalism, empiricism) over established doctrine or faith...).

I like a lot of good ideas from many sources, mainly Universal Truths. Love one another, practice appreciation and gratitude, live with inner peace, The Golden Rule, etc. I find these ideas in all religions as they typically have similar core teachings about how to live a fulfilling life.

Regarding gods: I tend to be apathetic: I don't care if someone believes in a god or savior. That's their business.
I don't need either belief system in my life, at this point.

My position is that there are dozens of belief systems around a deity or deities and a savior. Anyone can believe in any one of them at any time, or change their mind.

I'm willing to accept that there is some kind of energy (?) that continues after our earthly existence.

If religious belief systems of any sort work for you, that's your business, not mine. Go for it!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/02/2014 12:31PM by SusieQ#1.

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Posted by: michaelc1945 ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 01:58PM

I happen to believe in God and like you, SuzieQ#1, I believe this question of the existence or not of God is for each of us to seek an answer to that fulfills our individual needs. So some believe, others do not and that is not my concern. My belief is for me and only for me.

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Posted by: perky ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 02:06PM

Why does evil exist if there is an omnipotent, loving God? They tried to answer this question in the Book of Job, but the answer below from Epicurus is - i think - better.


[341�270 B.C.] Greek philosopher Epicurus

"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.

Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.

Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?

Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"

I also like this quote from the movie "Caddy Shack" where the reverend misses a putt on his best round ever.

"There is no God."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/02/2014 02:08PM by perky.

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Posted by: saucie ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 07:39PM

perky Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Why does evil exist if there is an omnipotent,
> loving God? They tried to answer this question in
> the Book of Job, but the answer below from
> Epicurus is - i think - better.
>
>
> [341�270 B.C.] Greek philosopher Epicurus
>
> "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
> Then he is not omnipotent.
>
> Is he able, but not willing? Then he is
> malevolent.
>
> Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh
> evil?
>
> Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him
> God?"
>
> I also like this quote from the movie "Caddy
> Shack" where the reverend misses a putt on his
> best round ever.
>
> "There is no God."


Awwwww yes, one of my favorite quotes of all time. Thank you.

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Posted by: baura ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 02:32PM

I used to be an agnostic, but now I just don't know.

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Posted by: upThink ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 03:23PM

I prefer to think of myself as an "Ignostic" in that unless you have a clear definition of what you mean by "God", "heaven", "hell", etc, the entire debate is meaningless. To one person, "God" might refer to the "first mover", the one responsible for the creation of the entire universe and everything in it. To another, "God" might refer specifically to an old bearded fellow floating in space. To yet another, "God" might be the personification of nature and has no distinct form or at least not a human form. To yet another, "God" might reference our evolutionary potential... suggesting that if we manage not to destroy our civilization in the process, we can eventually possess the attributes, powers and wisdom that we currently ascribe to Deity.

Ignosticism definition From Wikipedia:

Ignosticism or igtheism is the idea that every theological position assumes too much about the concept of God and other theological concepts; including (but not limited to) concepts of faith, spirituality, heaven, hell, afterlife, damnation, salvation, sin and the soul.

Ignosticism is the view that any religious term or theological concept presented must be accompanied by a coherent definition. Without a clear definition such terms cannot be meaningfully discussed. Such terms or concepts must also be falsifiable. Lacking this an ignostic takes the theological noncognitivist position that the existence or nature of the terms presented (and all matters of debate) is meaningless. For example, if the term "God" does not refer to anything reasonably defined then there is no conceivable method to test against the existence of god. Therefore the term "God" has no literal significance and need not be debated or discussed.

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Posted by: Dave the Atheist ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 09:59PM

Atheism is an absence of theism.

Anything else is a strawman.

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Posted by: saucie ( )
Date: September 02, 2014 10:54PM

Why?

Because I believe in no gods.

How?
Because I studied my way out of believing in any supernatual
being just like I studied my way out of believing in the
Mormon church.

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Posted by: Kismet ( )
Date: September 03, 2014 12:31AM

I'm an atheist because when my belief in Mormonism fell apart, there was nothing left to anchor any kind of belief in God or in Jesus. My belief in God just dissolved and was gone, like waking from a dream.

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Posted by: greenAngels ( )
Date: September 03, 2014 03:46PM

Kismet Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm an atheist because when my belief in Mormonism
> fell apart, there was nothing left to anchor any
> kind of belief in God or in Jesus. My belief in
> God just dissolved and was gone, like waking from
> a dream.

The exact opposite happened to me! LOL. I feel like I awoke from this dream where I realized that there was no God and once I realized that, Christianity, Islam, Judaism, etc etc just didnt make sense anymore.

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Posted by: Xyandro ( )
Date: September 03, 2014 10:15AM

I'm an atheist because I find it the most compelling explanation for how things are, such as why morality seems to be relative. I asked myself, "What would the world look like if there wasn't a God?" That's pretty much what it looks like.

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Posted by: schmowned ( )
Date: September 03, 2014 03:56PM

Now imagine what the world would look like if there wasn't a God and millions of deluded souls weren't operating their lives as if there were. Ahhhhhhhh.......one can dream.

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