Instead of just one god creating everything and controlling everything in the cosmos, wouldn't it make more sense to return to the ancient religions where abnormalities or the inexplicable could be explained by crazy gods or goddesses, rather than try to understand why one god does what he does?

I've thrown that out to a few mormons... and I might as well be speaking in a foreign language. Zero references, despite their world religion claim.

Having one god, who made us to look like him, and created everything for us 'cuz he loves us, is a lot more palatable than running around trying to please a bunch of them.

And they're not necessarily ancient.

I'm a polytheist, but I don't use "crazy gods/goddesses" as an explanation for the state of the world. We humans did that all by ourselves.

Many Christians are actually polytheists in a sense.

They attribute anything bad to some "demon." I saw a video once
about some fundy Christians who were praying over a boy's
infected finger and commanding the "demon" causing the infection
to leave.

Don't Mormons believe that there are a number of demons equal to
1/2 of all humans who ever lived, or ever will live, on Earth?

I guess the only difference is that in Christianity you pray to
Jesus to kick the offending demon's butt rather than praying to
the demon to appease it.

I like to tease creationists. "Okay, let's say the universe was created. But why not by a committee? Why not by a project team?"

I'm all for Zerotheism.

Ron Burr

Personally, I don't see how making up imagined "god" things with no evidence whatsoever of any such thing existing, and no need for one... :)

If there are "gods" though (and there's no reason to think there are), "crazy" would be what they'd have to be...

Polytheism makes a LOT more sense than the "3 for the price of 1" god of the christian world.

Polytheism or animism...

I think you are right, the op wasn't clear.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/30/2014 06:11AM by builderbob.

I worship my wife, children, grandchildren, friendship, great food and great beer...in that order. I have need for little else.

Ron Burr

Mormonism IS Polytheistic. There's no a Trinity, and Elohim (the Hebrew plural) was once a man. Boner.

A man/god created all. No wonder we have so much chaos in the world.

In a philosophical sense, only monotheism seems to fit the bill. There are no competing rules evident that we can observe. We can send spacecraft to distant locations and the math we work out here governing their speed and trajectory is consistent with the same there. Likewise throughout the observable universe.

Reality for all its twists and bends appears to be a singular, unified essence. Hence, monotheistic.

I'm going to have to disagree, monotheism only makes sense if the single entity is infinite and uncreated. Two things that on the surface seem impossible. If we are to only consider the possible than polytheism is much more philosophically sound.

jacob Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm going to have to disagree, monotheism only
> makes sense if the single entity is infinite and
> uncreated. Two things that on the surface seem
> impossible. If we are to only consider the
> possible than polytheism is much more
> philosophically sound.


Any evidence to support this? And what's the origin of your pantheon?

The idea is not to support a specific pantheon or single deity but to suss out the likelihood or probability of an entity that could be considered god. If there can be one than there can be another. It is a fairly simple idea and is right more often than not. The only scenario where a single diety makes sense over multiple deities is the scenario where the single is infinite and uncreated.

It make sense to me why Aquinas landed on his Five Ways. If there must be only one god than that god must look like Aquinas' god. However Aquinas' god makes no sense.

Monotheism is for people who aren't smart enough to keep track of all the gods.

Also, they are not willing to explain why it should only happen once that a god "just existed" out of nowhere.

Some people take the view that there are only two options: either Jesus is the Son of God and His father is God, or God does not exist.

When you look at the problems with Christianity, you might come to the conclusion that there is no God.

But it is an interesting question: is there a God, even if Christianity is false, and even if Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, etc. are all false? Is somebody in charge? It's a very intriguing question.

If there is somebody in charge, that person might have complete power, or he might have limited power. There might also be more than one person/being in charge, but it feels better to think that just one being is in charge, who is perfectly good.

It is nice to believe in love and goodness. Are they part of the real truth, or are they just situational ethics? If they are part of the ultimate truth, that is wonderful.

Take Christianity. It teaches that a man had to be crucified. It teaches that there is a literal Hell and most people will go there. It you have trouble believing that, do you have to believe that there is no God at all? Or are there other options? I like to feel inspired and think there may be a powerful, loving force in charge.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/28/2014 08:59PM by behindcurtain.

Islam and Christianity are polytheistic. Call it a trinity, saint, prophets, angels, demons, devils, mother of god if you like...

I'm polytheistic. The polytheistic world-view makes a lot more sense in my life than any form of monotheism.

If not, then many human beings can be thought of as gods. Obama qualifies as a god, because he is very powerful and very influential, even though he may not be immortal or all powerful. Famous people, like Neil Diamond, Sean Connery, Robert Redford, Marie Osmond, Margaret Thatcher, etc. can be considered gods. Even Joseph Smith, Jr. can be considered a god, because of his influence. Does a god have to be perfectly good? If not, then Joseph Smith qualifies. Were the anciently polytheistic gods perfectly good?

It depends on your definition of "god". You could define a god as a being that has a higher IQ than humans, and has a different kind of body than a human has, that has limited power, and is not perfectly good but only somewhat good, and that eventually dies after 300 years or so. Maybe some beings fit that description, maybe they don't.

The important question is whether a god has power over humans and how much. If 100 gods were continually jockeying for power, you could not have confidence that one of them in particular would come out on top. It would be like politics. For the word "God" to have real meaning, for many people, it has to mean a being that has all power, and can never be defeated. If there are several gods, they have to share power in a perfect system, a system that cannot be altered. Each god would have no power to defeat the other gods, but together they would form an all powerful group of gods that can never be defeated. If you throw in too much caprice and weakness into the gods, then you don't get a stable source of power. At most you could say is that there is a groups of beings more powerful than humans, but no one of these beings is guaranteed to be all powerful all the time.

God has been fairly well defined. Consider the following attributes.

Immortal
Overwhelming power
Overwhelming intelligence
Not human but pretty damn close
Ability to do things that escape explanation
Fallible
Above mortal judgement
Prone to human emotion
Celestial residence

And there you have it god is an ultra advanced alien.

I know they don't like being called that, but their doctrine is:

1) We have a Heavenly Father, a Heavenly Mother, Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost, all of whom are gods.

2) "As man is, god once was; as god is, man may become": so, that means that HF had a HF and HM, and presumably HM did to. Does he have Heavenly Grandparents? How many gods are there? How many gods will there be if all these TBMs become gods?

So, Mormons believe that our world has at least 4 gods, and they are derived from other gods and produce future gods. That sounds pretty polytheistic to me.

If you believed/velieve as Man is God once was and as God is man may become.

You believe in polytheism.

If you believed/believe as Man is God once was and as God is man may become.

You believe/believed in polytheism.

If you believed/believe as Man is God once was and as God is man may become.

You believe/believed in polytheism.

If you believed/believe as Man is God once was and as God is man may become.

You believe/believed in polytheism.

Most Mormons really don't understand the Mormon doctrine of God.

Mormon doctrine evolved from the christian doctrine of one God to a doctrine of polytheism. The BoM started out with the doctrine of one God same as as the Bible but Joseph Smith later started teaching polytheism as was introduced along with the Book of Abraham, D&C, and temple doctrine of polytheism. - a council of Gods, Mother(s) in Heaven Goddess, Human men and women can become Gods,etc. the following quotes are examples of the Mormon doctrine of polytheism.

I will preach on the plurality of Gods (p.474)... The heads of the Gods appointed one God for us (p.476)...
Joseph Smith - Mormonism founder
History of the Church 6:474

A Council of the Gods. In the beginning, the head of the Gods called a council of the Gods; and they came together and concocted a plan to create the world and people it.
Joseph Smith - Mormonism founder
Ensign, April 1971, p.13-14

If we should take a million of worlds like this and number their particles, we should find that there are more Gods than there are particles of matter in those worlds... One world has a personal God or Father, and the inhabitants thereof worship the attributes of that God, another world has another, and they worship His attributes...
Orson Pratt - Mormon apostle
Journal of Discourses 2:345

How many Gods there are, I do not know. But there never was a time when there were not Gods and worlds, and when men were not passing through the same ordeals that we are now passing through.
Brigham Young - Mormon prophet
Journal of Discourses 7:333

God, angel and similar terms denote merely intelligent beings of varying degree of development. The thought, however, that there is a plurality of gods and other beings of varying grades, is a though of fundamental truth.
John A. Widstoe - Mormon apostle
Rational Theology, p.62

But if God the Father was not always God, but came to his present exalted position by degrees of progress as indicated in the teachings of the prophet, how has there been a God from all eternity? The answer is that there has been and there now exists an endless line of Gods, stretching back into the eternities, that had no beginning and will have no end. Their existence runs parallel with endless duration, and their dominions are as limitless as boundless space.
B. H. Roberts - Mormon apostle and LDS church historian
A New Witnesses for God 1:476 [Google - 7MB PDF]

Chapter 4 of the Book of Abraham: (Note that the book of Moses teaches one God like Genisis of the Bible, but the later written Book of Abraham is polytheistic.)
2 And the earth, after it was formed, was empty and desolate, because they had not formed anything but the earth; and darkness reigned upon the face of the deep, and the Spirit of the Gods was brooding upon the face of the waters.
3 And they (the Gods) said: Let there be light; and there was light.
4 And they (the Gods) comprehended the light, for it was bright; and they divided the light, or caused it to be divided, from the darkness.
5 And the Gods called the light Day, and the darkness they called Night. And it came to pass that from the evening until morning they called night; and from the morning until the evening they called day; and this was the first, or the beginning, of that which they called day and night.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/29/2014 08:27PM by builderbob.

I remember all of this....and it shows how much the Mormon Church as changed its way of thinking over the years. These statements should have been presented to Gordon B. Hinckley during his interview with Wallace. Maybe he would restate his famous evasive words, "I don’t know that we teach it. I don’t know that we emphasize it. I haven’t heard it discussed for a long time in public discourse. I don’t know. I don’t know all the circumstances under which that statement was made. I understand the philosophical background behind it. But I don’t know a lot about it and I don’t know that others know a lot about it".

So much for prophets.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/30/2014 01:16AM by orange.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/30/2014 11:24AM by orange.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/30/2014 11:24AM by orange.

It makes more sense that alien DNA landed on our planet from other parts of our own Milky Way Galaxy. From that point, life began accidentally on our planet. No god directed anything here, it is just too haphazard with evolution deciding the fate of everthing. Besides, why do so many religions depict god and gods in the same form as we do presently. Homo sapien sapien has only been around for 200,000 years. Are we saying that god has only been around for 200,000 years. Does god also have 99% chimpanzee DNA like we do? More than likely our purpose in life is not much different than it is for many other mammals.

If there is a god or gods, it is more plausible that IT does not look like us at all. We just want to project our human experience onto what a god must look and act like.