so, I perused the Morg essay on Early Polygamy in Utah...not a mention of the Second Manifesto.

The year my Pa was born.

And my Mom in 1907, as a Mexican born child of a Swedish bride.

The 'essays' admit plyg marriages were still ongoing after 05.....

but only in Canada and Mexico.

And I gotta bridge across the Grand Canyon for sale, cheap.

Sorry, I hit the wrong button. The Second Manifesto was in 1904, not in 1905. In the essay it's stated that in 1904, TSCC strictly prohibited polygamy. During the interim between 1890 and 1904 only a few special exceptions to the manifesto were made...nothing was said about a Second Manifesto.

When I first read Mike Quinn's account of the "few special exceptions" to the 1890 manifesto, the reality of the Morg's "Lying for the Lord" became readily apparent. I knew a lot of polygamist families when I worked in Salt Lake, and many of them claimed to be true Mormons who maintained the teachings of JS and BY although the mainstream LDS Church had strayed.

how did you learn of the Manifesto of 1904? Did it cause you cognitive dissonance? The monogamous Boner.

There are a couple of books on the hearings. Smoot wasn't a polygamist, but he was an apostle and his enemies claimed the church ignored the Manifesto. Pres. Joseph F. Smith had to go to Washington to testify as did others. The whole story came out. Smith was fined $300 for breaking the law by living with his plural wives.

So the GAs had to say, no more--indeed they were authorizing plural marriages, especially in Mexico and Canada. They kicked out John W. Taylor and Matthew Cowley (apostles) and excommunicated a few other polygamists. And they issued the Second Manifesto.

Smoot was eventually seated.

Throw grandpa under the bus, we's gettin statehood!

The first one in 1890 was purely for show. All devout Mormons knew that and continued with their polygamous marriages without an interruption.

After the second manifesto, some of the sister wives had to go into hiding. My plyg priesthood bishop ancestor packed his second wife and her kiddies into a wagon and sent them off alone to Snowflake Arizona. She wrote in her journal about cooking mush one morning over an open fire when an Indian Brave approached their camp and ate the cereal while they watched.

Even Wilford Woodruff married again, taking another polygamous wife in 1897. How is it that Mormons don't know this stuff?

Cheryl Wrote:
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> The first one in 1890 was purely for show.

The same way the 12th Article of Faith was just for show.

<<We believe in ... obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.>>

Except when they didn't.

"How is it that Mormons don't know this stuff?"

Most of them don't read....they have it spoon fed to them in Sunday School.

This is interesting:

The four-year Senate proceeding created a 3,500-page record of testimony by 100 witnesses on every peculiarity of Mormonism, especially its polygamous family structure, ritual worship practices, "secret oaths," open canon, economic communalism, and theocratic politics. The public participated actively in the proceedings. In the Capitol, spectators lined the halls, waiting for limited seats in the committee room, and filled the galleries to hear floor debates. For those who could not see for themselves, journalists and cartoonists depicted each day's admission and outrage. At the height of the hearing, some senators were receiving a thousand letters a day from angry constituents. What remains of these public petitions fills 11 feet of shelf space, the largest such collection in the National Archives.

afteraffects:

President Joseph F. Smith on April 6, 1904, issued a "Second Manifesto," which reaffirmed the first regarding polygamy. He also declared any church officer who performed a plural marriage, as well as the offending couple, would be excommunicated. He clarified that the policy applied worldwide, not just in North America. Two members of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, John W. Taylor and Matthias F. Cowley, resigned in October 1905 following the manifesto. This change to the Twelve was made public in April 1906, when George F. Richards, Orson F. Whitney, and David O. McKay were added to the quorum.


but I understand that just like when the church would not quit baptizing Holocaust victims even after they said they would, the church still didn't completely stop polyg marriages until sometime after 1911.

Not till I got here.

Other Susan

I was not aware of a 2nd manifesto....wasn't the first manifesto referred to as "revelation"?

I still do not completely follow how TSCC can claim that certain rules/commandments have come straight from the mouth of God, but then they continue to break them as if it were something that they just made up cuz it sounded good. Such as the word of wisdom.

That's one question that trips up TBMs: if the WoW were *actual revelation*, and straight from God, why did the early church members break it repeatedly? If Joseph Smith spoke with God Himself and received this message, why would he openly disregard it?

The same would apply here: if the 1890 manifesto was received directly from God, why in the world would they act in direct opposition to God, over and over again?

(the answer is, of course, that it did not come from God -- but it is interesting to bring up these topics with TBMs. There is no justification they can offer)

when the whole truth comes out it makes the half-lies more damaging because it's painfully obvious that the Morg knew it chose to perpetuate a lie.

+1

absolutely. These are the types of topics that I focus on, in discussions with tbm spouse. In certain areas, it's cracking the shell.