Something good about Mormons:

I bet Mormons steal less than other groups. Now, I'm not talking about pyramid schemes and white collar crimes, I'm talking about good old-fashioned shop-lifting and good ol fashioned "put 'em up" armed robbery kind of stealing. I bet Mormons do less of it. I would guess that if you took a small town in Utah of, lets say, 10,000 people, a town that was over 90% LDS and compared it to several towns of similar sizes across the country, I bet you would find the LDS town has a much lower rate of shoplifting, burglary, robbery etc.

Mormons have plenty of problems, but I do believe that when it comes to non-white-collar crimes they have caught onto the concept of "Thou Shalt Not Steal"

What do you think?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2016 01:27PM by johnnywiplash.

That's kind of damning with faint praise. Mormons are known to do a lot of anti-social things. They're cliquish. They shun you if you don't believe as they do. Many have been know to disown their own children over a difference in beliefs. They generally won't have anything to do with non-member grandchildren unless they can find a way to surreptitiously baptize them. But by golly, is a small town environment they're not likely to be shoplifters. I do think you're right about that.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2016 01:40PM by Devoted Exmo.

I'd bet that early Mormons stole more than most other groups.

Today's leaders steal billions of dollars and hours from faithful members every year.

Now, today? You may be correct when it comes to burglary and robbery. However, what percentage of any other population commits those crimes? A very very small percentage.

I'd bet that rates of petty theft among Mormons is about the same as other populations. Mormon kids steal candy. BYU students steal textbooks. Mormon adults steal from their neighbors. They may not be sticking guns in people's faces or breaking into homes, but I wouldn't say they're much better than any other group.

That's one reason they were hated so much.

I've read many posts about shoes, wraps, and money being stolen while the victims were doing temple sessions.

My Mormon neighbors stole my newspaper on a regular basis. After leaving Utah, I never had a problem with non-Mormon neighbors taking my paper.

They steal my brain cells every time I visit Utah. There's that.

From what I've seen, Mormons might steal from their neighbors, but it's more like they "borrowed" something and never returned it.

When I was in high school and our band performed at Disneyland, a couple of Mormon kids were part of a group who shoplifted some candy from one of the Main St stores. Because of that incident, our high school wasn't allowed to perform at Disneyland until the culprits had graduated at least. One of the Mormon kids was actually considered Mormon Royalty because he was related to someone who was tarred and feathered along with Smith, and 2 of Joe's wives were sisters and also that kid's ancestors.

"One of the Mormon kids was actually considered Mormon Royalty because he was related to someone who was tarred and feathered along with Smith"

The only person who was tarred (but not feathered) other than Smith was Sidney Rigdon. He and his family left the church circa 1844, so I doubt that any of his descendants were Utah Mormons.

I think we need to remember that Mormons are like every other human being. They are human beings with all the same tendencies as anyone else; the good and the bad.

It is wise to remember: anything one human being can do, so can another.

The culture maybe more forgiving of some illegal actions, but the victims suffer just the same as anyone else.

The jails/prisons in UT are full of people (some are Mormons) breaking the law, committing all manner of crime, getting caught and paying for their crime, just like any other state.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2016 01:51PM by SusieQ#1.

Indeed, they are my people. I cannot hate mormons.

The premise of the argument made in the OP was that in Small Town, Utah, Mormons are less likely to steal than in Small Town, Anywhere Else In The USA. I think it's an interesting thought experiment.

Yes, people are people but Mormons do have a certain type of conditioning due to their particular environment.

Don't agree at all.

My experience is that a small town of 10,000 people, in Utah or Scotland would have a similar rate of theft and stupidity from the residents.

In fact, in Utah there would be a higher rate of deaths from gunshots.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2016 01:56PM by scotslander.

I'd like to hear about your experiences.

There are locks on the lockers in the temple.

When I was a kid every auxiliary pres and councilors, every primary teacher, etc was issue keys to the church building. Somehow lots of the folding chairs and tables went missing. Mormons are no longer all issued keys to the church buildings.

Members are warned not to leave valuable is the coat racks in the foyer.

I know many LDS eBay sellers who help each other by bidding up each other's auctions. (I reported them to eBay.)

All of the storage cabinets in the church buildings that contain ward supplies, seminary supplies, RS supplies, cleaning supplies, etc, are locked.

Why would you lock all of these or not feel free to leave your purse in the coat rack if only Mormons were there and they were less likely to steal?

Edited for typo



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2016 02:01PM by darkprincess.

They waited until he was out in the parking lot to nab him.

2 Random towns in US, about 10,000 people in each. Here are the annual crime stats.

Vernal, UT - Population 10,344

Murder 0
Rape 8
Robbery 4
Assault 6
Violent crime 18
Burglary 30
Theft 397
Vehicle theft 12
Property crime 439


Fredricksburg, TX - population 10,829

Murder 0
Rape 0
Robbery 1
Assault 6
Violent crime 7
Burglary 40
Theft 196
Vehicle theft 4
Property crime 240


Carnoustie, Scotland - population 11,394 - Annual crime stats

I can't get the statistics, the Scottish police are not as open with their data. However, I can assure you that zero rapes is the norm.
They do state on the local police website that "After talking to local residents you've told us that your greatest concerns are speeding/dangerous driving; young people causing annoyance and antisocial behaviour." Sounds like a crime hotbed in that godless town.

Thanks for sharing that! Very interesting!

Take it from a Vernal native. Our main problem is methamphetamines.

Meth is a problem in just about every small community.

Boing!!!! Just got a data woody... Gotta love real statistics and numbers.

The whole meth thing is very interesting.

Hypothesis:

Oppressive and manipulative cult creates environment where people are depressed. Meth and other drug usage increases. With a increase in drug usage, the crime rate is dramatically higher.

the1v Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Hypothesis:
>
> Oppressive and manipulative cult creates
> environment where people are depressed. Meth and
> other drug usage increases. With a increase in
> drug usage, the crime rate is dramatically higher.

I would challenge your hypothesis. Here is mine, based upon my Scotland experience.

Small towns are boring. Youth there are really, really bored.
To make things more interesting they turn to alcohol and drugs.

A lot of the picturesque towns in Scotland have alarmingly high drug and alcohol problems due to the boredom effect. No Mormon cult there.

Combine that with no jobs and you've got the perfect storm for drug use. And then it becomes a downward spiral.

"Scottish police are not as open with their data. However, I can assure you that zero rapes is the norm."

Does that figure include sheep? :-)

Those aren't reported due to lack of evidence. The poor cops are scot's and get distracted by a shapely wooly backside.

Never forget that Utah was founded as a pirate kingdom. Gentile goods were BY's property as soon as they crossed the borders of the rogue nation.

Pirates and Piautes practising the principle of righteous domain.

Why do you think that?

My Mormon friend steals but in the manner in which she would never say it was stealing. Lying about kids ages to not pay full price admission. Sneaking into waterparks when its super crowded with yesterdays wristband to get two days for price of one day. Things like that.

"I do believe that when it comes to non-white-collar crimes they have caught onto the concept of "Thou Shalt Not Steal""


You'd be wrong...

http://www.neighborhoodscout.com/ut/crime/



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2016 03:57PM by pettigrew.

Just my 2¢, when I was in high school the other Mormon girls were always shoplifting little things--jewelry, lip gloss, hair clips... They'd pop stuff out of the packaging and toss it in their purses. It always seemed to be daughters of the local leaders/in crowd, now that I think about it. The kind that got away with all sorts of things with canned answers and a hair flip.

The pyramid schemes and white collar crimes by CULT members are WORSE in my opinion than old fashioned stealing because it is more devious [involves more lies, which the EVIL CULT is so good at], and they end up with more money/items which are not theirs.

I knew a lady in SLC a while back who actually stole a BoM from the DI.
Think about this - there are locks on the lockers in the dressing room in the temple. That speaks volumes doesn't it?

Mormons aren't special. No one is. Regular people are regular people, and even though mormon people are brought up into some freaky, abnormal, socially backwards nonsense, millions of other Americans are brought up in some other variety of that nonsense too, usually religious nonsense.

From what I've read, Utah has very high rates of certain kinds of crime, including drug use, trafficking, child pornography, rape, and, not that this is a crime, but Ogden, UT has one of the highest rates of teen pregnancy in the country (I think.)

This is all stuff I've read in the past- some of it years ago- so it might not be true now, or as true in the case of crime statistics, but I'm too lazy to gather data, so take it with a grain of salt. I'm sure a native can either a. quickly corroborate this as true or b. put me in my place by negating it as false.

All I know is when I lived there, it seemed like the drug problems in that state, especially in Utah County and Salt Lake City, were completely unmanageable, especially with prescription drug use (probably heroin is the problem now, since that was almost 6 years ago) and meth, like people discussed above.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2016 06:08PM by midwestanon.

When I worked for a retail store, I found out just how common it is for most stores to lose a significant amount of their inventory to theft and fraud (the fraud comes into play when an item is shoplifted and then the perpetrator attempts to return it for cash or credit.) From what I learned, it's pretty much every store, everywhere. I doubt that Utah is an exception.

That's why many stores have a zero tolerance policy when it comes to shoplifting. Get caught, and they are totally uninterested in your sob story. They *will* call the police.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2016 06:47PM by summer.

I used to be one of the floor-walkers at the BYU bookstore. That was my college job. We caught a huge cross-cut of Kolobia in the store--undergrad students, grad students, people attending Education Week, visitors, jamboree-attending Boy Scouts, etc. The worst case was a local bishop. He was so humiliated that he later tried to commit suicide. We had a sort of come-to-Jesus meeting of the security staff and where they changed some of our procedures, but we were still required to bring them back to the back, where BYU police came and arrested them. Then they were given a court date, where they normally got convicted of a misdemeanor and had to pay a fine; we couldn't avoid that.

The church itself stole a chunk of my childhood. And tithing is flat out thievery.

Church members might steal less because outright theft is more of an uneducated crime and church members tend to be more educated in general. Joseph Smith stole other men's wives. But he wasn't very well educated. Even at that, he used trickery and threats as opposed to kidnapping them. You can get more for less risk if you swindle someone instead of outright taking their posessions away from them directly. Mormons tend to be more like the Romulens on Star Treck than the Klingons.