This is a follow up to this post, and the couple of threads that came from it: http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,1507854

I just wanted to come back and thank you all for your words. After reading what you guys had to say, I texted the sisters and told them I would not be joining them at church today. They suggested another time and I said no. They said that they would have to change my baptism date because of the requirement that I attend church. I said that was something I needed to talk to them about anyway and have asked for their email addresses. I haven't heard back yet, but I'm already composing the email in preparation, hah. I had originally thought I might just wait until Wednesday, our next meeting, but that is just a bad idea.

All of you had some really important things to say that I very definitely needed to hear. It's strange, I mentioned that I am aware that extreme people pleasing is a terrible way to live and I'm working on it, and that's true. Some very stressful stuff has gone down in my recent past because of my tendencies and I frequently find myself having to actively remember that it's okay to say no. In this case...well, it's weird, but I think I'd just...forgotten who I was.

I hate to say that because it makes me feel weak, but I had kind of just let these sisters throw their words in my face until all I saw and heard was those words and nothing else. They were very good at taking what I already believe and twisting it into their beliefs (despite some protestations on my part that there were distinctions between my and their beliefs), as some of you mentioned missionaries are literally trained to do. Before I knew it, I could hardly remember what I originally believed. I've always wondered how people who've never believed in something like this, who are educated, etc, convert to something like this, and now I know, haha. Ugh.

Anyway, upon some of your suggestions, I went to a UU church this morning and it was great. There was a reading about loving yourself, written by Charlie Chaplin, and it really struck home (it's called As I Began to Love Myself, if anyone else wants to look it up). Everyone was super friendly and very laid back, we had a tea/coffee and conversation hour after the service in which I met lots of great people (tea! yay!). Then I went and signed up for a World Religions/history class. Then I remembered that I've always loved yoga so I went and found a yoga studio. Hey! A life I'M dictating instead of some people I hardly know! What a novel concept!

Obviously this probably isn't over yet. You've all warned me that sometimes it takes 30 no's before they get it and leave me alone. Obviously it's not like a magic wand was waved and I'm suddenly a brand new person who knows exactly what I want when I want it and the world will suddenly fall into place and everything will be rainbows and puppies. And obviously, the email I need to send hasn't quite been sent yet. But I took a big step and I owe you guys a lot.

Everyone said something that resonated, but I have to say, the description that MikeyA gave of what goes on behind the scenes regarding an investigator was a real wake-up call. So thank you for that.

Enjoy your Sundays not eaten up by 3+ hours of church.

I think that you've made some really positive moves already! Good for you.

I would keep your communications with the sister missionaries short and sweet. Remember -- you *don't* have to explain yourself. I would just text them back -- "I have decided not to be baptized into the Mormon church. Thanks for your interest, but please do not contact me again. My decision is final." Then, radio silence.

Please keep reading this board. You will be living around a lot of Mormons for as long as you are in SLC. It's best to know exactly what you're dealing with.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2015 03:57PM by summer.

If you meet a nice ex-mo at the UU, consider having them sit in during the meeting with the sisters (if that happens) That friend can keep your resolve strong and you know that you have another person who knows what kind of craziness (constant pursuit) by the missionaries or church members that can happen . Its important, for your own growth, that you are the one saying "no, thank you" to further visits. GOOD LUCK!!

Many people wrote great posts. You are up against a lot of research and training on mind control, but you can do it!

You performed a Matrix style bullet dodge! Maybe you should keep a little notebook of things you've done that you are proud of, and put this in. There is such a thing as a positive "no".

Good for you! Enjoy your life on your terms :)

I wouldnt have a meeting with them. Just email or text them your decision and then cut off communication.Tell them as much or as little as you like. You dont have to give them an explanation unless you want to.You do not have to be rude,but be firm and clear that you are not joining and do not want further contact or discussion.They will take any hesitation as an invitation to keep contacting you.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2015 04:46PM by bona dea.

"it's weird, but I think I'd just...forgotten who I was"

That's the essence of mind control right there. And you don't have to be stupid or weak to fall for it, just unprepared. Now you know. So never ever give that part of yourself to another human being again.

[About 25 years ago I served as a liaison between a cult recovery group and the church I was attending at the time. At church one Sunday morning during coffee and chat time a couple wandered in looking a bit lost. I spotted them the moment they came in the door and said to myself within the first second, ex-cult members.

Sure enough, I walked over, struck up a conversation. This was their first week to try another church besides their cult church and they were deathly afraid of what they might experience or who they might run into, like maybe one of their own leaders monitoring their activity, or perhaps even Stan.

Eventually, after they began to relax, I found out that the guy was (so he told me, and I had no reason not to believe it) a brain surgeon.

Nope. It doesn't matter how smart you are.]

Anyway, congrats to you, and the new directions in your life. Stay vigilant. Teach others.

JAR

p.s. So does this mean you won't be buying my car?

SLCnewbie wrote:

>...They said that they would have to change my baptism date because of the requirement that I attend church. I said that was something I needed to talk to them about anyway and have asked for their email addresses.

Mistake! You DON'T "need to talk to them about" it. All you have to say is (you may copy these words if you like to put in the e-mail you send them):

"There will be no baptism, not now, not ever, NEVER. DO NOT CONTACT ME AGAIN!"

They would LOVE to "talk to you about it." They think it would give them a chance to change your mind. They would be able to urge you to pray with them about it so that GOD can tell you what to do (i.e. get baptized quick). It would keep the false hope alive in their minds that if they just say the right thing they can save your soul.

Funny thing is my missionaries, all three, prayed together and got the answer, from whoever, that my baptism date would be ...
I said no, i didn't want a date set by them. Why doesn't this shake their belief in god's ability to guide them. I am confused.
( well I am not really, I know that they know they are talking shite)

It's not necessary for you to have any more contact with them. Cut them loose, and they will soon forget about you. If they have your phone number, don't answer it when they call, or block their calls. If you don't want them knocking on your door, put up a simple notice saying "No religious solicitors please" or something similar.

I think you did yourself a lot of good by going to a UU service. If you still need someone to talk to about this stuff, I again suggest that you contact Sandra Tanner at Utah Lighthouse Ministry. She's a wonderful lady and she can give you some good advice.

Utah Lighthouse Ministry Bookstore
1358 S. West Temple
Salt Lake City, UT 84115

Hah, as I'm seeing. They've called me four times since I posted this. (I ignored them all.)

The reason I said I wanted to send them an email is just because I didn't want to be constrained by the text limit. However, I learned that lesson fast. Anyway, I texted and said I didn't want to be baptized end of story and that we can't meet again. Hence all the calls I guess.

if you know either missionary's first name.

The format would be, for example:

marilyn.monroe@myldsmail.net

It's not uncommon for a mishie not to reveal her first name and go by "Sister Monroe" to one and all.

Saree

Just tell them you have read the essay about joseph smith's polygamy on LDS.org and you no longer find him a credible person and can no longer go through with it.
the missionaries I had never phoned me again after I told them God should have chosen a better prophet.
I refused my baptism date when set because like you I knew I would feel too pressured into going through with it once I had agreed. They of course know how his and use it to their advantage.

Very cool.

SLCnewbie, thank you so much for coming back to tell us of your rapid progress! I am delighted that a suggestion that Summer, greenApple and I all made regarding the UU church was something useful to you.

The yoga class is a great idea. I smile thinking that you'll be bending over backwards not to be a Mormon. :)

Who is offering the world religions/history class? I have kicked myself for not having taken that as an elective while I was in university.

It's actually just a class hosted at the UU church, but if I enjoy being back in a class-like atmosphere, there are a few world religions/history/other humanities classes at the university that I'm looking into for later. Religion was actually one of my minors (I sort of by accident picked up two minors while at school) and history my major, so I really miss it. You can probably still find something in your area now!

http://www.exmormon.org/tract2.htm

Not that you are still thinking of joining but this will give you a good overview. If they keep pushing you, maybe you should introduce them to their own essays lol. Some very uncomfortable history there that I bet they don't even know about :)

I read that at least three times for myself over the past week or two. The thing that really influenced me in this essay was actually the part about what your life would be like after converting. Everything about that was something I feared being a part of. That essay, actually, is a huge reason I posted my original post about asking how to get out of the situation I'd gotten myself into.

Just for future reference,many churches require a year of weekly classes before they will even consider baptizing you. They cover theology and history and do not whitewash things. Makes you wonder what the rush is.

good point Bona Dea, by contrast I was basically told to quit thinking about it and take it on faith. They hadn't even told me about tithing yet. Probably a little unfair because they knew I had been researching eveything on the satanweb, but still, who says " Look stop thinking and shit and just sign here" I am of course para phrasing here.

I attended a few RCIA classes with a friend. They discussed the evils of the Crusades and the priest abuse scandal with no whitewashing and they encouraged people to be sure before committing. No.pressure. So different than the Morg

Hooray!! Well done. I'm so happy to hear you are standing up to them. Post here again if they get difficult. We have water hoses...

What they missionaries will say to explain your "change of heart"

"She knows it's true, but she just doesn't want to give up coffee."

Lol, well, if that's how they want to think of it, I'd just tell them to go for it. It's half true anyway. :P

"They got ahold of some anti-Mormon literature."

LDS missionaries do NOT want their investigators to research info about Mormonism that doesn't come from the church, becuase the missionaries know that that's often the end of their investigator.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2015 07:16PM by randyj.

I am so proud of you!

Not only have you kicked them to the curb, you've begun with steps to become a part of your community...

Attending a new church for the first time. One that you enjoyed!

Signed up for an academic class on something you, and presumably the other students, are interested in... chances for new friends with similar interests!

Joined a yoga studio.

All of this within 24 hours of your first questions!

You are NOT a doormat!

One more thing.

Those panic-stricken phone calls you've been ignoring???

Yeah, the see a sale slipping away. Nothing more.

Don't pick up the phone. Text them back and ask why they are calling you when you've told them to leave you alone? Then, block their number.

You've done well! No more contact needed with missionaries (who have been indoctrinated their whole lives). Not good to get lost in a collective (matrix).
Good advice here. You can always check back here for more ideas and support! Best wishes ;-)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2015 05:54PM by reflections.

It would amuse the heck out of me, that if they continue to pester you, you go to Mormon.org to chat with a couple of missionaries to ask how to find out the email address for their mission president so you can write to him to get them to leave you. I would have SO MUCH fun with the ensuing pandemonium!

Don't be surprised when, as the result of the spirit testifying to them, they show up at your door tonight.

It would be a hoot to tell them they can read at about it here, and give them the URL, neatly printed on an index card, one for each of them, with a couple of hearts drawn on it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/08/2015 06:00PM by elderolddog.

You go, girl! (To yoga and tea...)

You have been baptized, into assertiveness and self confidence.

Feel proud of yourself. Congratulations and best wishes!

Congratulations and well done! Big pat on the back for you.

Thanks for your kind words, it has made my day.

I rarely post here, but have been reading daily for almost 10 years. Your story really hit a chord with me, and I guess I felt guilty about getting people like you to join the church.

You have a great future ahead of you, enjoy!

MikeyA

You have done amazingly well mate!! You have dodged a big bullet, but also learned a lot about yourself I suspect. I am SO pleased for you!