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Posted by: Cold-Dodger ( )
Date: February 26, 2015 10:52PM


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Posted by: reuben ( )
Date: February 26, 2015 10:54PM

He believed that he could get money and sex by being a prophet. That's the only thing he believed in.

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Posted by: dejavue ( )
Date: February 26, 2015 11:16PM

IMO he had to believe in himself at least a little bit. He was successful in what he chose to do, even if he was a con artist. That's successful until it caught up to him. Then, again IMHO, he got what he had coming and deserved. The mental gymnastics of this man were amazing!

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Posted by: iamanevermormon ( )
Date: February 26, 2015 11:21PM

I think he probably believed it to an extent, but in general was probably just a cynical charlatan.

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Posted by: BYU Boner ( )
Date: February 26, 2015 11:30PM

He told the lie so many times he started believing it. It's the way lies work, after a while the truth becomes fuzzy. Of course, Horny Joe told the lie different ways at different times in his life to different audiences, but I think he did believe some if it eventually. The Boner.

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: February 27, 2015 10:53AM

byuboner Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> He told the lie so many times he started believing it.

That's my take. How intoxicating to think that you have a special access to communications from God. Why not believe in that? It made him quite the special snowflake.

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Posted by: Void K. Packer ( )
Date: February 27, 2015 12:18AM

I don't know if he believed his own propaganda, but I sometimes wonder what must've gone through his mind when the Kinderhook plates were brought to him. Was he, like, "You mean I was unknowingly right about the metal plates thing?! Hot damn!"

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Posted by: verilyverily ( )
Date: February 27, 2015 12:26AM

They say if you tell yourself something long enough, you will eventually believe it a bit even if deep down you know it is a lie. So who knows? It doesn't really matter what he believed. It is just horrifying that other people believed him and still do. That is the heartbreaking part.

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Posted by: myprofie ( )
Date: February 27, 2015 12:59AM

Whatever was in his head, try to imagine him trying to walk away from it.

Power, money and sex. He had involved too many people, taken their money, went after their women. Worst of all, he used their faith in god, their rock, as his hook.

Modern fallen religious leaders and/or financial con-men are persecuted and prosecuted, and even though we have a deeper cynicism, we are still appalled even if not personally victimized.

IMO, he constructed the equivalent of multiple houses of cards in multiple arenas. It was a series of bad decisions, just like we see happening in people's lives today. It leaves their lives devastated even as it shatters those around them.

He finally went too far, and paid with his life.

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Posted by: Chump ( )
Date: February 27, 2015 11:11AM

The outcome would have been no different had he come clean. He would have been killed. He painted himself into a corner and there was no way out...unless he had actually fled instead of returning to Carthage. He probably realized that he was going to have to live in isolation if he wanted to survive. The thought of never getting laid again was too much for him, so he decided to take his chances and return.

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Posted by: lastofthewine ( )
Date: February 27, 2015 01:16AM

About as much as Charles Schultz believed in Snoopy.

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Posted by: Templar ( )
Date: February 27, 2015 10:48AM

We now know for certain (TSCC has been forced in their latest essay to admit) that Joseph had sexual relations with other men's wives. He was "sealed" to them in very private ceremonies by "the power of the priesthood". This then allowed full sexual access to those women who went along (usually without their husband's knowledge) completely avoiding the legal requirement of spousal support.

It's almost unbelievable what Joseph Smith was able to get away with "in the name of god". He must have really been an atheist or completely self-deluded to do what he did and not fear the ultimate "judgment of god" considering his protestant upbringing.

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Posted by: Chicken N. Backpacks ( )
Date: February 27, 2015 12:05PM

Ego, power, booty calls...the usual cult leader traits.

However, one theory I have is what I call the Kagemusha Theory, based on a great Kurosawa movie, where a petty thief, who happens to look exactly like a samuri warlord, is hired simply to be his double, but after the warlord dies he starts to act like him, and finally believes he is the guy, commanding a whole army.

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Posted by: Exdrymo ( )
Date: February 27, 2015 12:27PM

Total conman. It took a while for me to come to this conclusion, though. You have to look at more of the history to see it for sure, but once you do, it seems obvious. Some of Steve B's posts cover this topic pretty thoroughly.

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