https://www.thechurchnews.com/leaders-and-ministry/2019-06-12/elder-holland-seminary-institute-teach-with-power-and-authority-50116


Hoping not to be reported to safety authorities, Elder Holland of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles laughed and said, “As teachers, we are to be spiritual arsonists. Our lessons are to be incendiary devices.”

In speaking about generation Z, he said ...

“They tend to support gay marriage and transgender rights as part of everyday life. “Because of this sociability, the thin line between friendship and condoning behavior begins to blur.”

This is triggering me to a place that is so wounded by this fucking church. As a small child I honest thought there was a man named Jesus who loved me and who would never ever hurt me. I thought the church was the “safe” place. I never could have imagined the darkness the church puts into the mind and the body and the family. I never knew you could wish to die to be free from it. I never knew you could watch her parents be destroyed financially and wither into nothing in their older years and then finally die with absolutely nothing to show for a lifetime of work. I had no idea of the horrors that lived in the temple. Nor did I realize that after I realized everything was a fraud that I would be thrown out of my family for the rest of my life and suffer every single torment that comes with that situation. This church is brought my life until pain and agony and now this motherfucker stands there and it mitt it was all intentional. It was all intentional. My suffering and the suffering of every single member of my family was intentional. Our dead like cold in the grave long before their time because of this brutal cult, and it was all... intentional.

This evil “church“ never intended to help anyone, it was meant to break us all and bleeders of our money and our free labor to make this man rich and live a life of luxury for the rest of his damn life.

Young people need so much love and so much understanding and they need a respite from the storm, they don’t need fire they don’t need distraction of their minds, they don’t need anything else to confuse them. Holland is now sounding like a Mormon terrorist. He just ratcheted things up. He is so threatened by the younger generation learning about the falsehoods of the church and realizing that people of all sexual orientations, Genders and colors deserve protection that he is willing to use incendiary words to boldly proclaim that he is willing to terrorize a young person into complete submission and obedience. For those of you who have been through this and who have experienced the seminary curriculum, they intend to completely indoctrinate and brainwash you and keep you so busy that your mind has no chance to fully embrace what you’re learning in school. They want to own your mind and eventually your children and your money.

"You can’t be a Bruce McConkie or Boyd Packer or Russell Nelson..."

Thank God!!!

Elder Berry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "You can’t be a Bruce McConkie or Boyd Packer or
> Russell Nelson..."
>
> Thank God!!!

Since Holland's target audience are CES directors, I think his words are condescending. I think that he implied that future leaders of the church are already chosen so get it out of your minds that you will ever climb the church's ladder.

I find the his comment rather baffling because that used to be the concluding challenge in primary. Be like the prophet, strive to do your best and lengthen your stride. Guess that is too old school.

From Dodo

"The apostle reminded his colleagues in the seminary and institute programs how much they — the general authorities and general officers of the Church — love and support them."

Aren't the majority of the CES members employed by the church?

I would think that their paycheck tells them that they're valued.

Dodo again-

“If you need to shorten a lesson a little in order to bear your testimony and stimulate a discussion on a contemporary issue, please do so when prompted by the Spirit that it is appropriate."

I say that's exactly what the youth need to hear. <sarcasm>
I can't ever remember thinking that I am not sure about this, but golly gee! Brother Dumbass just bore his testimony and now it's crystal clear.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/13/2019 02:22PM by messygoop.

So they want to burn away all the tolerance that children naturally have and replace it with a lifetime of bigotry. Just watch, youth suicides are going to spike again.

I’m Gen Z and an avid supporter of LGBTQ+ rights. Hope my parents haven’t read it, or not plan to read it at all. I know I am by far the most left wing priest in the ward (and most wanting to leave, even though I keep that discrete within the church and my family). The church, as seen from my observations in my stake, definitely seems to not look down on bigotry, especially towards the LGBTQ+ people.

Your generation is the world's hope.

Mormon Taliban is clean shaven and doesn’t wear a head covering.

Maude: Don’t be fatuous, Jeffrey.

"Our lessons are to be incendiary devices."

Uh huh. Sure, Jeff. And these are the lessons printed in the church manuals? The watered-down milk? The same lessons, cycled over and over, that bore even the most TBM to distraction and that few pay attention to any longer? THOSE lessons?

How are mormons supposed to be spiritual arsonists when their weak drivel masquerading as lessons suck all the oxygen out of the room?

This from the man who swore that there never were any death threats in the Endowment.

Maybe he liked the death threats.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/14/2019 10:48AM by slskipper.

The fear of death is very useful to these people. Profitable.

An arsonist is a criminal. He's spot on, because they really are spiritual criminals.

“we are to be spiritual arsonists.”

As an “arse”, he’s halfway there.

“As teachers, we are to be spiritual arsonists. Our lessons are to be incendiary devices.”

An interesting speculation for me is how given the context of Mormonism how this sentence could call the worst in human nature into action by teachers of their doctrines.

As a syllogism my thought is as follows.

1. Mormonism is boring.

2. Mormonism is exclusive and excluding.

3. Thus preaching to "ignite(incite)" strong emotions will heighten the negative "exclusive and excluding" type of emotions and dampen the boring "more good" puritanical aspects of Mormonism.

"a third of general authority discussion time is spent reviewing some needs of the young people,"

Well They aren't doing a good job finding answers. Too many lessons on temple marriage, worshiping dead people. Too much time spouting off the the mantra of "worthy priesthood holder" (whatever that means) and a total disregard in addressing the needs of a diverse population where they are. Needs such as organizing people to develop small businesses. Organizing immigrants into good jobs, and how to make money. Organizing young people to invent or create knew things to make lives better. Putting teenagers to work learning how to build and fix things is more important than another lesson on sealings and and dead-dunking dead people.

Jesus's parables were meant to be incendiary devices. As with the parable of the good Samaritan, they were meant to challenge established thinking.

Perhaps the Mormon church should teach Jesus.

I feel Lori C's pain and indignation towards the Mormon cult.

Also, I think decultified is right.

Mormonism is pretty bland. Perhaps we fear it too much.

The most incendiary think the cult could do, at this point, is simply up the tempo of its dirge-like hymns, and give the MoTab (or whatever it's called) a face lift. Add electric guitars and drums. Bring younger blood into the Fossil Fifteen. It'll never happen.

The cult is drowning in its own soul-sucking mire.

Incendiary? Yeah, the male "Warrior" image, again! They will go down screaming and hating, and bring as many others as possible down with them.

I'm sorry Lori C, that members of your family were some of the victims. Maybe all we can do is save ourselves, and keep trying to save our loved ones.

I have to struggle every day, to not hate the cult. Hatred might pull me to their side of the "war."

When you consider how they kill off the spirituality of the youth that sounds about spot on.

That was how I was starting to feel as a Mormon college undergrad in my 20's @ Idaho secular state run universities. Like my center of gravity was being siphoned off internally by the religion that proclaimed to be the only living gospel there is.

To know it's deliberate and with malice aforethought by those in authority over the entire operation, then yeah, it does make sense. Were Holland speaking to the laypeople that talk wouldn't have flown. That he was speaking to those who were future church authorities says to me he was repeating a talk he may well have heard when he was their age, sitting in the same seats they are now.

Bastards. They know what they're running is a scam on the rest of the membership. To strip people of what is essential to their souls is or ought to be a sin of the highest volition. Let's hope they get their rebuke if not in this world in the one to come.