Please help! The men here have given really good relationship advice to people trying to work through post Mormon relationship issues. This isn't a post Mormon issue - we left Mormonism together a few years ago - but I could really use some sound advice regarding my husband. My husband is, in my opinion, a perfect man! We have a very adventurous lifestyle with a lot of travel and awesome experiences. We have always enjoyed each other's company. Life with him has been wonderful in every possible way!

In the last year, a particular aspect of his work has become extremely difficult and has now evolved into lawsuits, a process that will last for another year or two. This has taken a severe toll on his typically positive disposition. He has become somewhat withdrawn, but more so, he has been very preoccupied. In order to distract his mind from the stress of his work he floods every moment of his spare time with media input: reading, podcasts, movies, music, whatever he can do to keep his mind off work issues. The side effect of all this is that he has stopped talking to me.

The situation has become extreme. He will often go days without speaking more than a few sentences to me. When I ask a question or make a comment, he often doesn't respond. I think it doesn't even register to him that I said something. On one particular day, out of the blue, he turned to me and said, "I know I'm boring."

I've told him that I understand the stress he is going through, and his need to escape it, however, I needed him to please not shut me out. I was feeling very isolated and lonely. He said he would try, but he has not been able to do it.

This past Saturday, we went out to catch a show of an up and coming band. It was an awesome performance, everyone was upbeat and dancing and having a great time. He seemed to be enjoying it, except that there was this chasm of silence between us. When we got home, I thought we would carry the festivities of the evening into the bedroom. As we started to cuddle, he asked some simple question, I gave a quick answer and asked a question back, but he had fallen asleep. I rolled over and cried myself to sleep.

Now here's what happened. Sunday morning was one of those comfy, lazy, sleep in mornings. My husband soon reached over and started nuzzling to wake me up. We were naked cuddling and he was nuzzling to warm me up, but just as he started to ramp it up, I stopped him cold. Now, I can hear you all saying, "Oh, sure, just like a woman!" But what happened turned out to be pretty amazing.

I told my husband, while he laid there naked and vulnerable, that, from now on, if he wanted some loving he had to talk to my for an hour before I would give him any. He could talk about anything in the world he would like to talk about except logistical stuff, like did I pay the house bills. He kind of laughed, and then started talking. For over an hour we laid there naked, talking, laughing and cuddling. The love making that followed was so emotionally intense and connected! Later we went for a long motorcycle ride. It was a perfect day.

This is my concern, even though things turned out well this time, I worry that by repeating this he will view this as a mind game to withhold sex from him. I don't want to do that at all. I really can not continue another year or two with the isolation and loneliness. Does anyone have good advice for me?

Lucky guy. Wished I had a wife like you.

Let him read this post.

You got some...better'n I get. Ever.

When first you mentioned how he has been acting given his situation, I assumed that he is depressed. Your approach to the situation is very good. I agree with WinksWinks, let him read your post. It shows your love and concern. I'll bet it starts another of those hour conversations.

If you haven't already, it might be good for him to hear everything you have spelled out here. Is there is a reason you wouldn't be able to share all of this with him?

Do you think there is some reason he doesn't feel safe opening up to you about the work pressures?

As a guy, I would feel my wife was controlling me if she required an hour talking before sex. It does sound like you had a great time together, so hopefully you can build on that.

Maybe just say you are available to connect with him like that more often. You understand his work pressures but don't want that to get in between your relationship. Think about taking back the "from now on" part. And say that what you meant is that an intimate emotional relationship is as important to you as good sex.

I like to check out too when I get home, which usually involves all of the media input you listed. Often I overdo it and end up not spending any time with my wife when that wasn't what I intended. She takes it personally and sees it as though I were trying to avoid her. Knowing she doesn't like it hasn't made it much easier for me not to overdo it. If she gives me a guilt trip about it, I withdraw more.

Recently, she tried to make it simpler by saying she wants at least one night per week when we are doing something together (and she really means talking). I can do that. And I have told her she can join me watching a moving, listening to or playing music, etc. anytime and that I would feel closer to her too if she did that. We ended up making some music together one night, which I enjoyed very much (but I don't think she liked it much). I have said we could read a book together too, but she isn't up for that idea either (too boring). Anyway, it's one of the things we are trying to work out.

Clearly your situation was untenable and something needed to be done. From your description of the event, it sounds as though your action produced the desired effect. Perhaps it was the slap your husband needed to snap him out of his emotional stupor. Now the question is: will there be any lasting repercussions?

My opinion is that there likely will be. If my wife had taken a similar action in a similar context, I would not have responded as your husband did. I would have seen her withholding sex as an attempt to bend me to her will, reducing this most intimate act of sharing into a petty tool of manipulation, nothing more special than the biscuit she might give our dog for not peeing on the carpet. I might not make that connection immediately, but as soon as my depression lifted and I could see clearly again I would not be able to ignore the reality of what happened.

Of course, my opinion doesn't count for much. What you really need is the advice of a trained marriage counselor. You should not have to put up with the alienation he has imposed on you, but I have to question whether adding conditions to your expression of love for him will really improve your relationship in the long run.

Isn't he manipulating her, then, by denying her basic needs and only agreeing to them when offered sex?

Thank you all for the input so far. I need to emphasize that I did this in a fun, teasing sort of way. It was not stern, demanding, or meant as an ultimatum at all. I believe that is why he took it so well. I would never withhold sex to be small and manipulative, and so my concern about repeating the exercise before making love.

Counseling might be the best next step, I am hopeful of the possibilities of building on this, as jefecito commented. How can I best do that without it becoming manipulation?

Requiring an hour of conversation prior to making love is absurd. Being spontaneous and just getting wrapped around passion is healthy and requiring an hour of time investment prior is going to start being something he endures rather than engages in. You want him engaged with you not just enduring your crap till he gets into your pants.

He is likely in need of professional help for his own happiness and your manipulating him will do nothing positive. All you can and should do is encourage him to do things like counseling to ease some of the stress in his life.

If you want an idea try this out. Go outside and go for a walk together holding hands. Simple things like that really are the biggest ways to regain a connection..

Okay, guys, please help me out here. We already have a very adventurous lifestyle, with a lot of activities that we do together. We still do and enjoy all those things together. We are regularly physically intimate. Other than his recent withdrawl into his own mind, we are very kind and courteous towards each other. I just don't know how to pull him back into active verbal and emotional interaction. I'm afraid that if I can't pull him back out of his mind soon, then real damage will be done to our relationship.

'Her crap?' It doesn't sound like she wants him to endure hours of her whining about her feelings or how many calories she consumed. He's denying her her basic needs by not interacting with her on a regular basis, and she wanted to have sex the night before and he didn't want to.

And as she said, he effectively rejects her ALL the time.

If this behavior began with the work stress, he is escaping by shutting down verbally... his mind is revolving around the worst case scenario-if finances fall apart.

If he is making the majority of income, he doesn't want to terrify you with his fears, and increase his stress and responsibility. He may think you can't possibly understand. He is almost literally paralyzed with fear. No man wants to admit that.

What IS the worst case scenario? Losing your home? If you can discuss this with a therapist, the elephant is identified. He might be afraid of losing you, or working through retirement... Identify what is really going on and share the burden, which would cut it in half for him. That might help.

I hadn't really understood that he may be feeling fear! Thank you, bystander, I'm beginning to see the problem in a whole new light!

I hope that helps. If you make it clear you are on the same team/in this together, he may be able to begin to open up. You might need a professional to help him articulate his fears, and safely help you indicate how you feel shut out... Good luck.

I don't think what you did needs to be seen as a manipulative thing. It doesn't seem like he saw it that way. But you do want to be careful about making sex transactional. That could be a killer. On the other hand you can't just be expected to dish it out whenever the mood hits him. So the thing might be to let him know that you really want the affection and sex and that taking time to talk isn't something you are requiring of him, but that it really helps feel good about what you are doing.

How about just telling him that you know he is having tremendous stress, and you probably don't really know how much, but you are having a hard time and getting depressed, and wouldn't it probably help both of you anyway to take some time to talk.

His statement: "I know I'm boring" makes me think he doesn't really know how sad you feel, and is feeling criticized or inadequate instead.

Maybe it would help to let him know that you love him and are with him whatever the financial outcomes, that you aren't afraid and you are confident that you both can handle it together.

maybe offer him a daily break from his worries where you can both talk and have fun?

I really have no idea if any of this applies, but best wishes for this all to work out and for your happiness.

Are you both conversing over dinner? In my home dinner time was always conversation time. Let him have some alone time to unwind when he gets home from work, but insist that he be sociable at dinner.

My course of action would be to make absolutely sure he understands why you set up that deal---that you were intervening in a spiraling problem, not as a matter of course, point out that your insistence on an hour of conversation is a temporary exercise to get you both talking again, and then at the next opportunity, break the rule to prove that it's more of a guideline. Then handcuff him (or just figuratively if you're not into that) to the bed and snuggle/talk after.

I'm pretty young though, others have offered more experienced-sounding advice. Best of luck!

Not knowing either of you we can only speculate about your actions and the future repercussions. I can only speak for myself but what you describe as how he has been acting is exactly how I act when I am severely stressed.

I shut down and don't say much of anything. My wife and I have had talks about it because when I shut down I really shut down everything. But there are moments like your Sunday morning, where I can forget about my problems momentarily and I can enjoy the company of my sweetheart which is what it sounds like happened with you.

The hour of conversation before love making seems a little extreme to me. If he gets moments of clarity from his stress he isn't going to want to spend those moments talking, he needs to be close to you and know that he is safe with you. It sounds like he is dealing with mountains of stress at work and that is not easily dismissed no matter how much he may want to.

Give him time and don't build a wall between you because if he is like me what is going on with him has nothing at all to do with you and everything to do with his ability to provide for you.

Good luck.

I get my adventures in bed. I want exhilaration
& passion; strength & compassion in juxtiposition with his /
My vulnerability: sexually; its a metaphor through
Which as lovers he & I live our lives.

We explored tantric breathing together some years back. Not
Much talking during that , that might be something for
You two to do. Not much conversation its being in the now
Passionately engaged breathing finding a different unity,
Really wakes you up. Call it, a course in, a refresher
Course in 'stress management' when you tell him.
Tell him its just a an easy yoga position or breathhing together
I think he'll love it. and you will too,

Theres an awakeness an awareness a beingness a giveingnesd
That youre asking for in conversation.

Sometimes, dire times anxious fearful times during them, a
Warrior doing and being for couple or kids/ is just all tapped
Out for words that is. Tantric sexual breathing together
Will tap him back in.

Oh I know its crazy but I talk over dinner, on walks, in
A dark night, and I dont say no I dont think you should
With a long time partner whom youre in for the count
Particularly when one of you is on the mat for a fight
(In real life/ be it law suits or cancer now us not the time
Deflecting sexual closeness away from passion is not an
Effective way to attain or maintain closeness closer-ness
Within a marraige)

You obviously care, a Lot. that puts you in for the count. Try tantric breathing.

/mat analogy- married a wrestler on scholarship long ago, sometimes 'dumb' sports analogies help with vulnerability
During hard times

Ugh, the commenters saying that you were being manipulative or in some way trying to bend him to your will or control you or something

Yes, sex is an intimate act and it's not a tool and it's required to keep most marriages going. But so is everyday interaction. Can't we say just as clearly that if what you had to do (and it seems like you did it half jokingly, not as a serious contract meaning literally 'from now on') was 'manipulative,' then him refusing you the intimacy of conversation on a regular basis is also 'manipulative?' and controlling? Would people have this much sympathy for you if your depression was leading you not to want sex? Conversation is a pretty basic marital requirement. And of course for him then to expect sex from you after you constantly feel rejected--that's also not right. Not saying he's a bad guy, just that the accusations of you being manipulative when you feel rejected for both conversation AND sex on a regular basis are ridiculous. Your response was 100% correct. Show him this post.

my opinion, which will cost you dearly, as it's the only one I have, is that he is both depressed and fearful.

Have the two of you discussed the possible outcomes of the law suits? Do you know if he has any insurance that covers, both as to paying for the defense, and any verdict(s) against him? Have the two of you discussed the worst case scenario?

There are a lot of things he can to do attempt to insulate himself against a bad outcome of the trials. Are your personal assets in danger? It could be that he's afraid of how you'll react to the truth of his situation... Let him know you've got his back, at least metaphorically.

It certainly wouldn't hurt for you to ask about the worst case scenario and then let him know that you don't love him for his money. (Unless you do love him for his money, and you'll be moving along if he does become 'poor.')

elderolddog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ... Let him know you've
> got his back, at least metaphorically.

Yes...let him know you have his back---right now...and always...and forever.

This is very, very, VERY important!!!

I'm at work right now, so not a lot of time to respond, but you all have given me such great advice! Thank you so much, you have lifted my spirits and have given me hope that not all is lost! It's good to know, that if it comes right down to it, I can simply handcuff him to the bed... I just might try that! lol

To answer questions about the lawsuit: No, he is not personally involved in the lawsuit, but directly involved through his position in the company. If he loses, anf van not recover the money they have lost, which is millions and millions, the company may go under, and everyone will lose their jobs, including him. Yes, it's a tremendous amount of stress.