Ok, even after my years of lurking on RfM, this was a surprise even to me. (Then again, I have not read here much for the last several months, so maybe I've missed this topic....)

My very nice LDS neighbor served a mission in Hawai'i (Maui). She brought that up yesterday when were discussing summer vacations, and we both mentioned that we hadn't been to Hawai'i in years and would love to go back. I said, "Well, at least you were there for two years! You must have done some incredible sight-seeing, tons of swimming."

She replied that her missionary service was great but that she couldn't swim because "Actually, we weren't allowed to swim on our mission."

I immediately thought, okay, must be an LDS "modesty" issue, at least for female mishies, so I said, "Oh...I guess they didn't want female missionaries wearing bathing suits?"

"No, it's not a modesty thing. No missionaries are allowed to swim, on any mission."

"So, I guess it's a safety thing? Insurance or something? Could you swim in a pool but just not in the ocean?"

"No, no swimming at all."

At this point, my mouth was gaping open. I asked, "So, could you at least wade or something? Go in the water but not swim?"

"No, we couldn't go in it at all." She added that once when some other mishies baptized someone in the ocean (so that's the lone exception, I guess, to the "no water" policy), she stayed "far up" on the shore so that she wouldn't be "tempted" by the water.

Even she--and my neighbor is pretty hard-core TBM--said, "It always seemed silly to me that you could be in water for baptisms despite the rule about avoiding water!"

I asked her how she could possibly stand being in Hawai'i for two years and not even put her feet in that gorgeous warm water. (We live in Northern California, so believe me, warm ocean water is only a dream.) She replied that she would just remind herself, "That's not why I'm here." I then asked, again, why they aren't allowed in the water.

She said something like, "Well, in the old days some people said...well, it doesn't really matter. We aren't supposed to go in a small boat, either, so I guess, yeah, it's just for safety reasons."

Okay...I let it drop. But I have read so many stories on RfM about missionaries being sent into dangerous neighborhoods, being denied basic medical care for life-threatening illnesses, riding bikes in places with terrible traffic...yet it's too dangerous to go in the water? To WADE in the water? What the...?

And seriously, those poor missionaries. It must be a special kind of hell to be sent to a place like Hawai'i and not be allowed anywhere near a pool or the ocean!

And I can confirm that there was no going in the water in Tahiti. I was allowed to wade on to the reef to catch (by hand) food for dinner. And I saw a baptism in the ocean. That's it.

Mormons believe that Satan controls the waters.

This belief came about after Joe had a particularly bad ride in a small boat and almost drowned. Mormons have been paying the price ever since. Mormons do go swimming, just not allowed while on their mission. Many mormons won't swim on Sunday, and won't allow their kids to either.

This is why water park in utah go unused on a hot summer sunday

There is one amenity here. The outdoor swimming pool.
(slight exaggeration--a campground, baseball diamond...but pretty much just the pool).
It is heavily subsidized by property taxes of the LDS & non LDS residents alike, but is closed on Sundays anyway.

Another ridiculous step toward mind control and emotional slavery

All the years that I was growing up, we were told that Satan had dominion over the water.

If Satan has "power over the waters", then HOW THE HELL are we supposed to baptize people.
So Satan is the one washing people of their past sins to begin life anew in Christ?????

Can any TBM explain that???

I used to ask this question. Never did get an answer.

I think that is great that you used follow up questions about that to your friend. It probably makes her think how crazy the explanations sound when you are not beholden to the cult. And isn't it crazy someone could be baptized in the ocean, but missionaries aren't allowed in the ocean? And isn't it crazy that they can take baths, but not step foot in the ocean?

I knew this about missionaries when I was a member, but as for the explanation, it didn't explain anything: the Devil has control of the water. Ok, so it's good enough for non missionaries to play on Satan's water, but not missionaries? It makes absolutely no sense. She was a missionary and she can't even figure a way for it to make sense. That's a BIG part of Mormonism, to be following arbitrary rules because you'll be rewarded for your obedience. Never mind there is never really any reward, never mind that it doesn't make sense. Whatever you do, don't use your brain. Turn it off!

Oh and we had better not discuss the rules about drinking coke with ice cubes.

Avoiding water was a rule when I served as a missionary a decade ago in Australia. Nevertheless, it didn't stop a number of like minded companions and me from hitting the beaches on occasion.

I have a close relative who went to Hawaii and was on the islands of Molokai, Kauai, and Oahu. Swimming was strictly prohibited as was being in the Waikiki area of Oahu. There were missionaries who were sent home for going to Waikiki on P-Day.

Hughie Mortensen was called to serve in the Rarotonga Mission in 1965. He wrote me a letter in 1966 telling me that he was having a good time, wish you were here, and if I could make it, to bring a surfboard, because that's how they got from island to island when they were out tracting.

Was he fibbing to me? Maybe he could stand in the water to get on his surfboard, but then had to stay on it when they were out on the water...?

He's full of it. He'd have to surf over a hard coral reef. Aitutaki is the closest island. It's a 45 minute flight by air.

That Goddam Satan.... who knew he could swim?

I always concluded that it was for insurance liability purposes. I always had a hard time believing Satan controlled the water story, otherwise I would have been water chocked in the shower years ago.

Anyways, I did once wade in the shallow end of Lake Erie one time on my mission. Felt nice on my feet and I miraculously didnt drown.

You took a big risk venturing into the realm of Satan's dominion. I guess it was his P-day and he was out.

You were lucky you didn't get poisoned by the toxins in that lake.

madalice Wrote:
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> You were lucky you didn't get poisoned by the
> toxins in that lake.

Looking back on it, that is actually probably the biggest risk I was in. I shutter to think I stepped foot in the lake now, but not for missionary rule reasons.

I live near Lake Erie and Lake Ontario. Have not had any desire to wade into either pond. There's swimmers, boaters, and even scuba divers every summer who love to explore there. I prefer walking the boardwalks, and marinas. All my life I've suffered from a phobia of water. Now I wonder if it has something to do with that early Mormon teaching?

So, while on a mission, how do you bathe and get clean if you don't somehow get into the water?

The Philippines has some of the most beautiful beaches in the world. Fortunately for me, two years after my mission I got to go back for a friend's wedding. In addition to swimming in the ocean, I got to participate in several other banned activities such as karaoke (a national obsession, called videoke by the locals) and cock fighting (cruelty at its max).

While in the LTM (now called MTC, showing my age) one of the 12 came and spoke to use (I can't remember his name). He said the reason missionaries don't swim is purely a safety thing. If they allowed us to swim, with 25,000 missionaries, there would be 2-3 deaths a year from drowning, and he didn't want to make that phone call to parents. He said it had nothing to do with Satan over the water.

The teachings I was raised with having not gone on a mission was we couldn't go in the water on Sundays by virtue that Satan has dominion over the water. That concurs with some of the other posters.

I understood the ban on missionaries was for the same principle. Guess there have been rationalizations over time, but the underlying principle was the Lucifer thing. If you tread where he has dominion then God cannot protect you.

My brother served his mission in Paris, France and Versailles. He couldn't drink the wine. Only problem there was he couldn't drink the water either, due to sanitation. That was in the days before bottled water was the rage. So he drank lots of bottled soda, or boiled his water lol.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/31/2015 05:45PM by amyjo.

amyjo Wrote:
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> My brother served his mission in Paris, France and
> Versailles. He couldn't drink the wine. Only
> problem there was he couldn't drink the water
> either, due to sanitation. That was in the days
> before bottled water was the rage. So he drank
> lots of bottled soda, or boiled his water lol.

When was he there, amyjo? I was there 79-80. My last 6 months were in Versailles. Maybe I know him?

We had no problem drinking tap water, it was perfectly safe, by the way :)

Wow, interesting...thanks everyone for the responses.

What A New Name says is intriguing about being told years ago it was about missionaries' safety and nothing to do with Satan. I wonder if the man who told you that was just smarter/less gullible than others in his position and really didn't believe the "Stan has dominion" thing (and was embarrassed by it), since a lot of other posters said they did hear it was about Satan. My God! If so many people here didn't say it I would think they were kidding me!

I also wonder if the Satan thing is what my neighbor meant when she commented that "in the old days, some people said..." but didn't finish that thought. Maybe she realizes how crazy it sounds too!

Sorry, one more thought: What a narcissist Joseph Smith was. People drown all the time, but suddenly, after *he* nearly drowned, it must have been because Satan controls the waters? Jeez.

My grandpa served a mission to Hawaii after serving in WWII and he was allowed to swim. It seems like the church was more lax in the past.

Eh,Nevermormon here,if water is so freaking bad then why do they have that big oxen baptismal font in their temples?

A bad omen at the very least no?

TBM DH told me that in early 1970s mission, they weren't to swim for safety reasons. Sometimes, somehow, some way some occasionally swam on P days.

DH is a good sport, and a good man. He's been inactive for years, but he always defends the church and gives the pat answers to my questions. I'm working on him. I've asked him, "If the church weren't true, would you want to know?" (Thanks to Tal, I think, for this line?) This was a great way to begin the discussion! And he replied, "Well, Hell, YA!" So we're starting to watch some youtube things as he hates to read. (sigh.) Please root for him....

Rooting away!

When I was in the SL Mission Home in July 1978 S. Dilworth Young was talking about why missionaries couldn't go swimming. One lady missionary stood and said, "because Satan has power over the waters." Young said, "That's false doctrine sister and don't you believe it!"

Fast forward to my second area in my mission. Due to some orthopedic problems I asked my MP if I could swim on P-day. He said yes but he was a pretty liberal guy.