https://youtu.be/0A97odud60o

This is a child abuse case where the LDS General Authority grandfather accused two six-year old girls of being promiscuous with him from age 3 to age 6.

Please share this video for the sake of ALL children of ALL religions.

Additional info from the owner of the video:
At the request of my daughter (and in support of her recent efforts to publicly address the accusations of her LDS General Authority grandfather against her at age 6--accusing her of being promiscuous with him from approximately age 3 to age 6): I am re-posting this video.

As an adult now (and being made aware of her grandfather's accusation and the evidences surrounding that accusation), she is putting forth the efforts to go on the record with the facts of this case, along with her side of the story, which counter the original claims that this LDS General Authority made, not only against my daughter (six-years old at the time), but TWO six-year old girls, 50 years apart: How many other six-year old girls were molested in the time span?

Despite a recent admission by the mother (Jean Mickelsen Berger--Rexburg, ID, on tape, transcribed by a certified court reporter) solidifying the fact that these accusations of two 6-year-old girls, by this General Authority, took place; the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles has refused to meet, or to even look at the evidences against this General Authority despite two certified letters sent to each Apostle individually, one year apart, listing those evidences.

If you wish to apply labels such as hateful, unforgiving, spiteful, revengeful, etc.; I can only reply with justified labels of Pedophile Sustainer, Pedophile Financier, and Pedophile Enabler. (i.e Pedophile): Choose well your disposition before applying a label. This subject matter will not go away until it is addressed and handled properly. If this knocks a slat or two from your white-picket fence, put you head back in the sand, and feel free to unfriend me.

It takes a village to raise a child: It takes substantially more of that village to molest one.

Source: https://www.facebook.com/100001608752300/videos/1036814619715487/?hc_location=ufi

Neither video will play. His slimy face comes up for a second on the Facebook link but video will not

Both links come through on this end. Not sure why they don't on yours.

The first mugshot on the Facebook link is the father of the child who was molested by her grandfather.

The General Authorities tried to destroy him, and take away his children. He finally succeeded (in Provo, Utah courts,) after all was said and done out of fear of what further exposure would do to their 'reputation.'

Like Catholic church before, LDS Inc was more worried about its good name than the welfare of the children who have been victimized by pedophiles high up the ladder.

:(

Sorry for my slimy comment...I'll keep trying

Armand may have got one you can use, check it out. :)

It isn't a slimy comment btw. Someone there's a slimeball, and it follows the chain of command all the way up the ladder to the slime at the top. Truly disgusting, isn't it?

:(

Don't come through for me, either.

Turns out the link is not correct. This one worked.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0A97odud60o

Many thanks. :)

Edited to remove embed link from YouTube, doesn't work either. But the YouTube one does on my computer. Don't know why you aren't able to access the FB one. Try going to Ronald Meldon Karren's FB page if accessible, it's a public page:

https://www.facebook.com/100001608752300/videos/1036814619715487/?hc_location=ufi

The YouTube link again:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0A97odud60o&feature=youtu.be



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/14/2016 09:55AM by Amyjo.

Holy Cow! I started watching this with the intent of stopping simply because he looked and talked the morg language. But then, I became spellbound and listened to the whole thing.

This turns my stomach!

The mighty morg has such power, reach, and control that nobody stands a chance against it. Nobody! I would like to see how it ends, but I guess I already know.

Some people are motivated by money, some power, some attention, and some are willing to sell their souls to have all three neatly tied up with a ribbon. Do it in the name of gawd and you have a perfect recipe for disastrous results.

I'm glad I watched this video, but I don't feel well now. I don't know whether to have a drink of Tequila or take a nap. Jesus, I have such deep loathing for the morg machine.

Just watched this. His video seems simultaneously over the top and hard to believe, whilst still making you think (because you're familiar with how Mormon hierarchy works), that it just might be true. I wish he'd name a name or two (besides just Mickelson), but I would wager that it's not legally possible, and probably also pointless in Utah to even try. If what he says about winning custody, etc., is true, then that's a sort of anecdotal evidence that something is truly going on.

As far as doing away with the the death oaths in the temple in 1990, that's going to always be a difficult one to pin down. In fact, since only us old people remember that, and the still active old people deny that it was ever so, the younger people taking over just will not believe that it ever happened.

I watched the whole thing, roughly 15 minutes. It is truly horrifying.

This is an incredible coincidence.

Lynn Mickelson presided over my mission (Colombia-Cali) in the late 1980s. I served there from 1992-1994. I know him somewhat by reputation. I do not know him personally.

My stake president happened to serve in the same mission that I served in about 5 years before me. He served under Mickelson and has stayed in touch with him over the years. Mickelson has been something of a mentor to him. My stake president was a convert to the church as a young adult and so Mickelson's influence on him as a young missionary was particularly profound.

It was not even 6 hours ago that I sent off a resignation letter to this very same stake prez along with a copy to Salt Lake.

Now I see this. Among the men that have been presidents over my mission, there has been a swarm of rumors and allegations. I cannot confirm most of it, but I find it very believable.

My first MP is rumored to have been ex'd for being gay. My second MP is divorced. A previous MP is rumored to have carried on an affair while serving in the second quorum of the 70, was quietly released, and has been living in Mexico with his mistress since then.

And now this...

It was unfortunate however that this guy started wandering off at the end into blood oaths and conspiracy theories. I felt that it hurt his case. This video should be edited down by a few minutes. There was also a girl at the end that looked like she was getting ready to speak. It made me wonder if there was going to be a part two.

This much I know for sure....

6 year old girls do not act "promiscuous" unless they have been violated and have been taught things that they should have no clue about until they are considerably older.

Even if Mickelson were innocent of violating these girls, I would still have serious questions about his judgement here. If what he claimed was true about the girls being "promiscuous", rather than rejecting these two girls and refusing to hold them on his lap any longer, he should have taught them about appropriate and inappropriate touching and should have immediately started investigating further and finding counseling for his granddaughters. Assuming he didn't molest them, he is still rejecting his granddaughters at a time when they are vulnerable and desperately in need of a loving grandfather to help them understand that they didn't do anything wrong.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2016 05:21AM by Strength in the Loins.

I agree. If he were anything other than the perpetrator, the first thought of a loving grandfather seeing a 6 year old girl act in a promiscuous way would be "where in the world did she learn that behavior?"

It's astonishing to me that the cover-up goes all the way to the very top of the ladder.

Not that I should be so shocked. Still, it's shocking to read and to hear about, no matter, because of the damage done to the victims, and continues to be done as the lies continue to be told and cover-up goes on with those in the know, who are responsible and as culpable as the perpetrator when they cover for him.

It's reprehensible.

As for a grandfather accusing his own granddaughter of being promiscuous sitting on his lap as a six-year old child? What he really means is he got an erection from having her on his lap.

What a piece of shit is right! Blaming that on his granddaughter just means he's in some serious need of some honest to goodness sex talk. The guy's in denial.

Apparently the church is too. Drawing big guns on gays in the church, and turns its back on pedophiles in the Quorum of the 70. Yeppers. What priorities they have ((((not.))))

Re: The blood oath that is spoken of....I wonder if Robert Kirby had to swear to it when he was a Utah cop?

RB

Ron, they're referring to the law of consecration--

"You and each of you covenant and promise before God, angels, and these witnesses at this altar, that you do accept the law of consecration as contained in this, the book of Doctrine and Covenants [he displays the book], in that you do consecrate yourselves, your time, talents, and everything with which the Lord has blessed you, or with which he may bless you, to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, for the building up of the kingdom of God on the earth and for the establishment of Zion." (Thank you Internet!)

There was no blood associated with it. The blood oaths prior to about 1991 were for revealing the secret handshakes (grips fro
Masonry) the first was slitting one's throat; the next, slashing one's chest open; and the last, disemboweling oneself.

And yes, Kirby, as well as any Mormon endowed before the big changes would have done these. Remember, most of us hadn't a clue what was going on in the temple and there was tremendous peer pressure standing in a room f family and friends all doing the same.

Prior to my endowment, I had TBM friends say they first thought the temple was pagan. Most memorable was a family home evening sister who said her first thoughts were--this isn't my church.

Back to the original post--the above posters are accurate in that six-year-olds do not have the cognitive capacity for sex unless something horrible has happened like bang abused by a grandfather.

This is interesting, but I wish he showed us the concrete proof he has. Maybe he's saving it for later.

The audio recordings don't count as concrete proof as it's possible to fake those. Unless someone can find audio of the GA speaking and run that and the phone calls through voice recognition software to see if they match?

Mickelson was the stake president in the stake I grew up in. He once promised my inactive father that if he would become active, he would become a great leader in the church. Thankfully my father didn't listen to him.

I knew his children. His daughter Jean was year or two younger than me in school. I always thought they were a family to look up to. You never know what is really going on.

So sad that a six-year-old was held responsible for her grandfather's perversion.

I feel completely sickened by this. I literally want to vomit.

LDS Death Spiral;

They've NEVER put the conversation in terms of Kindness, Honesty, or Respect; those aren't on their agenda/menu AT ALL.


LDS GAs should Eat Shit & DIE.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/14/2016 02:23PM by GNPE.

If this guy had stopped with the details of his divorce and interactions with Mickelson, it would have been much more compelling. But when he wandered off into blood oaths and the Glenn Pace memo, digging up minutiae that is at least 25 years old and has no direct bearing on the facts at hand, it bothered me. It sounded very sensationalistic.

But there are some things here that should be easily verifiable.

1. This guy is actually Mickelson's former SIL.
2. This guy was an active member holding PEC level callings up until just a few years ago.
3. This guy actually was awarded sole custody of his daughters as he claims (wouldn't this be available in court records?)
4. He graduated from BYU.
5. This guy has a successful career consulting with top level CEOs.

That much should verifiable. If he's lying or exaggerating on these points, then there probably isn't any need to investigate further.

LDS leaders have been doing this type of stuff and covering it up since Joseph Smith first began the b.s.!

I'd like to see concrete evidence and proof. If it is true then it should blow up the internet. I find this a bit suspect. If he is making it up or taking things out of context he isn't helping abuse victims

I wouldn't rush to judgment on this video. Let's get some more facts. It seems like it's designed to enthrall while leaving out very important facts. Molesting children, then covering it up is the worst, but accusing someone without the facts is wrong. Can you tell me how he got the recording of the policewoman speaking with Michalson? Doesn't that strike you as odd that he has it? Doesn't it strike you as weird how the video sucks you in at the last moment by introducing one of the victims to tell her story and cuts out right then, like a teaser? Doesn't the background music seem more like a movie than a documentary? What's up with this?

I'll take a look at this later. Lots of people say they have proof. Maybe one day such proof will be available.

Speaking as a parent if one of my children came to me about what happened to this man's daughter, I would go to the ends of the earth to expose what his daughter and his family endured at the hands of a General Authority.

The things he's alleging indicate a coverup at not only the highest levels of church officials, but also how they tried to bribe him (his own FIL caught on tape,) and bribing Ohio officials on another child molestation matter to keep silent.

It's corruption run amuk. If the church officials were really "holier than thou" then fine. When they aren't, what's with brandishing others or their children with Scarlet Letters for being openly gay which isn't a sin in the eyes of the law, or in this case an innocent child sitting on her grandpa's lap gets maligned for making him get a hard-on because she sat there? 50 years apart another six year old girl was accused of doing the same for sitting on the same man's lap. How perverted is his logic anyway? That is indefensible. The man has a loose screw (or more,) and it was his granddaughter's relationship he willingly destroyed because he refused to be accountable for his sexual prowess.

That's about as twisted logic as I've heard so far coming out of SLC and its sex talks.

The girl's father is using whatever means he has at his disposal to expose the corruption and fraud. I say kudos to him for his courage and for standing up for his daughter. That takes a special kind of hero to do that, considering who his opposition is he's willing to take on.

The man is a 7th generation Mormon, until this happened. This was the catalyst that caused him to resign his church membership.

He's not too believable, and he's probably now got his own court battle to deal with after libeling and slandering his father-in-law.

The points where he loses me in credibility are:

1. Using Pace's Satanic Ritual Abuse documents. This shit--SRA--never happened, and that's a proven fact. http://skepdic.com/satanrit.html He should know it too. Also, making the Pace memo seem like some hidden piece of information that his family only knows about, when in reality, it's all over the internet.

2. What's up with him calling his mom a whore? The dude obviously hates his mom and uses that time to call her a cheater and poor latter-day saint. I guess his mother disagrees with him? This tactic of his is pretty low.

3. The dramatic production. Facts don't need to titillate to be true.

4. His penchant for drama. Although he's just a financial planner, he has all kinds of posed and pretentious pictures of himself on his website. I sense a very strong thread of narcissism. http://americanfinancialplanner.com/about/

5. His name dropping to tell us how awesome he is--appeal to popularity, and his appeal to authority, "I've been in so many high priesthood callings . . . " He's trying to convince us on something other than the facts. If priesthood is some proof of believability, wouldn't we assume his father in law is more right since he has more priesthood?

6. His inflation of facts, for example, when he mentions that all police and judges take an oath to the church. He makes it sound more ominous than it really is. It's the standard "Law of Consecration" that many of us took, and look where we are. This is something done in the temple and not because these people are cops or judges; there is no extra oath.

7. A secret psychiatric group that specializes in the victims of general authorities? Give me a fucking break. These "secret" cases only come to this group? What a joke. He makes it sound like the church is having orgies up at the COB all day long for the GAs, and this group of undercover psychiatrists are saving the lives of all these myriad of GA abused kids. Most GAs are douche bags, but this is unbelievable.

8. Tons of secret recordings. The one with the police lady sounds dubious. 1. Where would he get it? 2. Why would this even need to be recorded? 3. Would the police department really be so unprofessional if they know they are being recorded?

9. Just one more observation on his self-importance. If you read his biography on his website, it sounds like he's completely got all the world's financial problems figured out, if you just follow his plan--whatever that is.

I guess he could be telling the truth 100-percent, but he seems pretty suspect. I would be pretty reluctant to advance this story, unless you don't mind looking like a fool. My instinct tells me this guy is more full of bullshit than a bull's colon.

He didn't call his mother a whore.

He said he was the product of an adulterous relationship she had while married to the man who raised him as his own.

But not a whore. At least not in the video I shared here. Did you read that or listen to it elsewhere?

He sounded credible to me, and not given to theatrics. He speaks like someone wanting to set the record straight, and open the conversation on what transpired between him and the church authorities.

Anyone in his position with an ounce of integrity would do the same.

He doesn't come across as angry either, but he was the victim like his daughter was, of a church coverup.

Exposing the lies is what he's about. Most of the ex-Mormon boards I've read his blog on are very supportive of him. I certainly am.

I know how contrived and dishonest church officials can be.

As for cops and law officials in Utah, I don't know off hand but imagine many of them are LDS. To be on trial there against any church official would be intimidating, considering how much homage the locals pay church authorities? The woman cop on the secret recording just laughed along with his FIL as she said she knew the [FIL] wasn't guilty of anything, but it was her obligatory duty to ask him did he *do it?*, nonetheless, laughing the whole time. She didn't take her job seriously at all.

The church GA was not once considered potentially culpable by listening to her exchange. Instead they defamed the SIL from the very start. Which would be standard fare, considering the source.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2016 10:19AM by Amyjo.

You could be right. The church is pretty messed up, but all the drama he uses doesn't help his credibility.

I hate people who hurt children, so if his father in law did this, hopefully he will be able to expose it.

Thanks for sharing the link to his financial planning page. I'll explore that one later.

Looks like he majored in the same field as I did as an undergrad. Mine was Political Science with a concentration in International Relations.

Other than that, how he made the transition into financial planning would require further studies in an altogether separate field from that. (After reading his page, it looks like that was his only university training, which he used as a springboard into his financial planning career.)

:)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2016 11:18AM by Amyjo.

Okay, AmyJo, someone just posted this on another thread. Yes, this is creepy in the context of the accusations against him--hell, really, in any context.

https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2003/10/the-atonement-repentance-and-dirty-linen?lang=eng#watch=video

Reading this was written shortly after what had transpired with his granddaughter.

It makes me feel more sorry for her that she has him for a grandpa. What a hypocrite he is, not to take responsibility for himself and would rather scapegoat a six-year old child for his hormones.

It wouldn't have been a perversion had he dealt with it in an adult and mature manner. What he did was the aberration.

The coverup and bribery attempt just makes it all the more disturbing.

Well, at least we have our eyes wide open. We're not sitting through endless General Conferences listening to speeches like his being more brainwashed by their endless mind control.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/15/2016 12:43PM by Amyjo.

Here is a link to the Pace molestation report, with lots of commentary by, one assumes, one of the Tanners:

http://www.utlm.org/newsletters/no80.htm#PACE

I do not know if it's real.

But KittyWayMo has involved herself, so I'm happy!

Given the explicit content in the video, if the allegations aren't true then he will be sued by the individuals and the Church for slander/libel.

If Kirton McConkie don't come knocking on his door, what does that suggest about the allegations?

I can guarantee you, just with what I saw working in a law office in Provo that did a lot of family law, if they really started looking into LDS child abuse, it would make the Catholic scandals look cartoon like.

Especially when you start looking at things like this--fondling and inappropriate touching. I wish I had done something about an incident involving one of my own daughters and my father-in-law. My husband's entire family were just flat-out perverted. So, of course, when I went to him about it, he not only didn't believe anything happened, even if he had, he would have said "no big deal."

But years later when all signs pointed to this daughter's own daughter being abused by her grandfather (my ex), I wish I could have said, "the reason I 100% believe that's what happened is because that's the way he was raised. You know that because of what happened to you." But she doesn't. And if I said it now--something she was too young to remember, I would be accused of making it up. My ex would never in a million years back me up, even though he knows what happened, because it would throw suspicion on his own fondling of his granddaughter.

Unfortunately, my granddaughter didn't come out of it as unscathed as my daughter did. She showed every classic sign of being abused and they had to involve a number of counselors when my granddaughter was between about 5 and 10 years of age. But they still refused to believe the problems had anything to do with sexual abuse. I think because they don't think that kind of touching could possibly affect a 5 year old that badly. It can. It happens. And it happens profusely in mormon world where these perverted men are way more worried about getting caught in an affair than they are in getting caught fondling children.