Is mormonsim to blame in some way at all for the quality of public schools and education in Utah?i have heard teachers have the lowest of any state and and Utah has the least spending per pupil in the whole of the USA?Critics of Mormonism and Utah make a point about this,but how does Mormonism play in to this isssue?

I'll start. I'm tired, so I may not make a lot of sense. Mormonism posits that the only thing that matters in life is commitment to the church. They see no need to produce scholars and scientists. The non-Mormon community values things like contributing to the larger world. Mormonism sees the larger world as not worth their time or trouble. Mormonism posits that once you find Mormonism any other subject is meaningless.

As for funding education: this is a sore spot in Utah. The legislators cut funding for public schools any way they can- mainly to prevent their children from exposure to Evolution. But charter schools are their darlings. In Utah charter schools exist to establish the ideas of right-wing Mormonism into the students' minds. They are not there to teach algebra. They are not there to teach arts and music. They are there to teach the students that God likes America best and America exists for Mormonism.

Yes, there are exceptions at the high school level, but at the elementary level, when students are most pliable, that is the tragic truth.

Now it's time for other viewpoints.

This state has too many children and too few adults to pay to educate them.

According to the 2013 American Communities Survey published by the US Census Bureau. The state with the youngest median age is Utah, were the average resident is 29.1 years old. The median age in the US is 37.3 years old.

This is about it. It's mostly demographics. It has little to do with Mormonism besides the fact that Mormonism is the reason Utah has the youngest population out of all the states.

Yes, active Latter-Day Saints pay a voluntary 10% church tax (tithing) to support temple, mall, church buildings, and general authority stipends. They also are told to have large families. Money that could go for building more schools and smaller class sizes goes to the Mormon Church. And, of course, poorly paid LDS teachers are expected to tithe to support all of the above. The Boner.

Most church buildings and chapels are tax exempt and do not pay property tax. In utah property tax is a big chunk of education funding. So not only does the church ask for 10% off the top in tithing, citizen's property taxes increase to make up for what the church doesn't pay.

This forces many families to shop at walmart & church owned Deseret Industries and so the church again collects what is left in member's pockets. At least after they buy their quota of MLM products.

It is kind of a miracle that small to medium size non-MLM businesses can even exist in Utah. (Add to the fact that mormons are encouraged not to patronize businesses that open on Sunday).

I think the lack of quality in Utah education has to do with high classroom size and the fact that "church" rates higher on teacher's value lists than "teaching job".

It is mind boggling to see a school teacher teach a Sunday RS lesson on how to help your children pick "good" mormon only friends and then hear the same teacher at parent teacher conference drone on about how she feels every child is equality important in her classroom and how she loves each and every student. Sure.

Teachers can bully just like kids can-- if not worse. I have seen teachers treat students they don't like badly.

Perhaps it would help the discussion to look at the past and how we got the Utah education k-12 in the first place. The mormons came and set up "church schools" with the explicit idea from Brigham young that it is the parents responsibility to pay for the education of the children. Therefore in Pioneer Utah there was NO public education period. Brigham young also set it up that the qualification to teach was to have a testimony of the truthfulness of mormonism, credentials were of no importance. It was the Episcopals and Methodists who came to salt lake in the 1870's that set up the first public education with credentialed teachers in Utah. But the mormon schools lasted clear until 1890. At that time Utahns began to be taxed for education. And much to their displeasure. The sentiment of minimizing taxes is near and dear to bretheren and the mormons in Utah. This is why we are dead last in spending.

(See the book "the Gentile comes to Utah")

GAs like to present/pretend that 'the gospel' (the LDS church) provides Everything necessary.

It's not just Utah, it's the entire Morridor. Utah, Idaho, and Arizona have some of the lowest per-pupil spending in the country. This U.S. Census bureau graphic from 2013 gives you an idea:

https://www.census.gov/content/dam/Census/newsroom/releases/2015/cb15-98_graphic.jpg

So I would say that Mormonism most definitely does have something to do with it. You have very young families, larger than normal families, and a large percentage of a family's income sucked away by the Mormon church.

I taught school in Utah 20 years ago. Back then we teachers had a saying:
"Welcome to Utah; Where we stack 'em deep and teach 'em cheap."

As with any bureaucracy there is a vast amount of waste.

Do they need 3 or 4 vice principals in jr high?

Does the choir need $200.00 dresses?

Or my favorite. Realease time. One class a day learning religion.

Huge families that don't pay into the system while the elderly go without to pay.

The restrictions on what can be taught especially in health and sex education.

Money does not equal value when it comes to schools.

http://www.nationsreportcard.gov/reading_math_2013/#/state-performance

versus

http://www.governing.com/gov-data/education-data/state-education-spending-per-pupil-data.html

We moved from California to Washington this past summer.

2013 numbers/per student spending.

Washington spent $9,672
California spent $9,220
Utah dead last at $6,555.

First off all of these numbers need to be re-evaluated for cost of living. Utah obviously comes in very low no matter what. California is also way below the average when it comes to paying it's teachers.

Washington is in the top 10 states in standardized testing. California is in the bottom 10 states.

The biggest difference that I see is the attitude of the teachers and parents. School bonds for new schools, pass relatively quickly. Schools and parents have an attitude of "We can try to do it with what we have but it would be easier with more," versus "We don't have any money to do it, so we won't even try."

I also see more consistent intelligent use of resources. My sons grade school in CA lots of money for very highly paid administration and senior teachers but no money for hot lunches, busing, basic school supplies, teaching assistants, IEP students, or extracurricular activities.

Side note: I notice that the Morridor does good in reading but not so hot in Math. Logical thinking is not encouraged apparently. Wonder where that comes from?