The upcoming GC reminds me of the first GC telecast I attended with my TBM DW three years ago. We were married only a couple months, and I was just learning about TSCC...both from the missionaries and my wife, and through my own research.

DW wanted me to see the GC "live" at the chapel, and had volunteered us to drive the missionaries since I was their most promising investigator.

As soon as we got there, the missionaries dragged us over to another pair of missionaries from another ward that shared the same building. Introductions were made and the conversation soon turned to shoptalk among the missionaries.

The other missionaries were a little bummed that their investigator had declined at the last minute to watch the GC with them. Apparently she had an anti-mormon boyfriend "who thought he knew more about TSCC history than they did." That caused more than a little chortling among the missionaries.

They then read to us the texts that the BF had written to the missionaries, sharing with them the history he had shared with his GF, their investigator. During the course of the back-and-forth texting, which was still going on throughout the GC, the BF texted that the missionaries had been duped by their leaders and knew nothing about the truth of TSCC.

The BF listed off historical facts about the TSCC in Missouri and the events leading up to Joseph Smith's death, but the missionaries would have none of it. They accused the BF of being liar, or a dupe himself; but they could not refute any of the facts. Besides, who would know more about TSCC history than the missionaries...it was their job to know.

At that time, I was already well into Bushman's "Rough Stone Rolling" and had been doing my own research based on Bushman's references. Nothing the BF had written was inconsistent with what I had read in "Rough Stone Rolling", and I was easily able to confirm within minutes on my phone everything the BF wrote.

Seeing missionary arrogance (borne of ignorance) in pitched battle against someone who had facts, reason, and research on his side was a sight to behold. The missionaries got spanked...hard, and they didn't even know it.

That "anti" mormon boyfriend has just planted some really nice seeds. I had seeds planted on my mission that I dismissed. Those seeds that were planted on my mission is how I was able to get out.

During a time that I was very unhappy as a Mormon, I said to myself "I wonder if there is something to that stuff I heard on my mission?" I got on google and started searching for the things I remembered hearing and I was an unbeliever within a couple of hours. It was one of the happiest days of my life.

Did you convert to Mormonism?

Oh, heck no!

I remain a nevermo; planting seeds of doubt in all TBMs (be they missionaries or members) who visit with the hopes of showing me the light. I don't seek out people to un-convert; but if they come to convert me, all bets are off.

DW and I have mostly agreed to disagree, but that's not to say we haven't had some arguments over my refusal to convert. I may be too accommodating in that I don't actively refute everything she says about TSCC, and even attend SMs with her; but I'd prefer to keep things civil and non-hostile between us.

Unfortunately, I'm afraid that my accommodation gives her hope that I will eventually convert. I'm still struggling to find the right balance, and I don't trust my naturally irreverent tongue to remain civil once it starts wagging.

surprenant Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Oh, heck no!
> ...
> Unfortunately, I'm afraid that my accommodation
> gives her hope that I will eventually convert. I'm
> still struggling to find the right balance, and I
> don't trust my naturally irreverent tongue to
> remain civil once it starts wagging.

You are correct that you are giving her [false] hope, and I suspect that you will find this to be an increasingly difficult line to walk. Her whole world right now is about bringing you into TSCC. These other folks will aide and abet her in it, until they give up on you, and then they will turn hostile.

At that point, your wife will be in a precarious position. Many TBM spouses reject their unbelieving spouse, because Joseph's Myth is more important, and when it gets down to brass tacks, the "family religion" would rather bust up a family than loose a member. Hopefully that won't be the case for you, and, better yet, perhaps you can lead your wife out of it.

The Morg doesn't just lament "errant" husbands and wish they come too, like more traditional churches. They will suck you in, or cast you out. Maintaining a delicate balance in between will be difficult for your wife, especially if she's an all-in TBM. If that's the case, then she needs you to be all-in too, for a "celestial marriage," to enter the CK, etc. Also, other TBMs will look down in her for not having a "worthy" husband, especially if/when you start having children.

Fortunately, we don't have to worry about kids (we're too old), and she already has her ticket to the CK with her first husband...which really ticks her off.

I was once, and still may be, a ward project, but I hope we dispelled that during our last argument. She doesn't want to hear anything critical of TSCC, but I have promised her that she will learn everything I know before I would allow the church to break up our marriage. I have all my research ready whenever she wants it...all she has to do is ask for it.

I've known a number of TBM/nevermo couples who have figured life out just fine. One of my friends has a husband whose family was Mormon a generation or two back. She is TBM, he loves her and attends SM with her but knows church history and has no interest in converting. They seem to have a very happy marriage and are doing well after 15+ years.

Basically, it can be done.

In regards to your story, missionaries are incredibly arrogant. They don't know what they don't know. I remember overhearing these kinds of conversations now and I just smh.

I remember having these kinds of conversations.

Unfortunately the "anti" material back then was mostly from evangelical Christians and full of easily dis-proven lies. Today it is so easy to validate information that I have a hard time understanding my TBM relatives.

I guess that I was much more of a thinker even back in my TBM days. I saw the internet for the first time on my mission from an office elder ('96). I left in ('00) but never read a single "anti" bit of literature.

I don't understand why people don't look things up---google is RIGHT. THERE.

I don't know whether to be impressed at the fortitude it takes to avoid looking it up, or astounded at the willful ignorance...??

One time when the missionaries dragged out the old trope about how Joe couldn't possibly have written the BoM without divine assistance, I did a quick search on what B.H. Roberts had to say about BoM and "The View of the Hebrews". They saw that I was online with my tablet and insisted that they weren't allowed to surf the internet.

"But you're not surfing, I am. Besides, I'm just going to read you a quote by B.H. Roberts, a well-respected church historian. He was convinced that Joseph Smith could have written the Book of Mormon."

I had to explain to them who Roberts was and that he had prepared a comparison between the two books for the TSCC leaders. When I finished reading Roberts' summary they were speechless. I wrote down "B.H. Roberts", "Ethan Smith", and "View of the Hebrews" on a piece of paper for them, and suggested that they may want to look into it themselves if they thought I was leading them astray.