I've heard that liquor laws are unusual in Utah.

Here in the Midest, there are plenty of family-type restaurants (Cheddar's, Applebee's, Chili's, some pizza chains) where a normal family might go to eat lunch or dinner and take their children. Beer/liquor is available and the people at the next table might be drinking it. Horrors?!

Would a true Mormon family choose to dine at such a place if they were outside Utah? Or do they restrict themselves to fast food outlets that don't offer anything stronger than Pepsi?

I live in the Midwest and have frequently eaten with Mormons at establishments that serve alcohol. I'm frequently enjoying a cold one while sitting with them. The joke is that I'm the designated drinker.

But some might grumble or go somewhere else if possible.

I'd say most Mormons would eat at restaurants with a full bar, because they would have fewer places to eat out if they didn't. The only Mormons who might grumble about alcohol are those who have never left Utah except to serve a mission.

Lived in Ohio in a Mormon family. My parents wouldn't take us anywhere that served alcohol. So it was mainly family restaurants and fast food places for me until I moved out of the house and got married and even then it was very rare. Nowadays I enjoy the massive sangrias at Texas Roadhouse. ;o)

My parents are very TBM, they frequently eat out at places that serve alcohol and have a bar. They've eaten at Olive Garden and The Cheese Cake Factory and other similar type places. I'm pretty sure that my sister has taken them to eat at their local pub. They never batted an eye. They do make a point of turning over any coffee cup and when asked if they want coffee they will respond that they "are mormon, no thank you".

So, it might depend on what version of TBMness is installed in the person... I think most would be OK to just not order alcoholic drinks.

It does remind me of a funny(ish) story about my parents. They were out at Olive Garden one night for a date night. They tried some fruit punch drink that they made at the time. My parents came home that night raving about how good it was and how they looked forward to trying it. Next time, they thought to ask what was in it... Tea, that was what was in it. They had inadvertently sinned! They repented and vowed to never have it again. How great was their disappointment that they couldn't drink that ever again! They used it as a lesson for their kids to be constantly vigilant, for they were in the world, but not of it!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/13/2016 04:51PM by Finally Free!.

Most will eat in a restaurant with a bar without giving it much of a thought. They wouldn't likely sit in the bar though.

I have family that would wait in line for an hour or two before they would have dinner in the bar. Even when I was TBM I thought that was crazy. It just shows how fearful TBM's are of the gossip circles.

Mormons who live in Utah and are accustomed to being protected from the stain of alcohol proximity by Utah's draconian liquor laws and who want to avoid it when they go elsewhere, may as well plan on eating at home forever.

Most Mormons think nothing about eating funeral potatoes made from crappy canned soup, grocery-store white bread spread with chemically modified margarine, green jello made from animal bones, and feeding their kids out of Oscar Meyer snack packs, but they won't enjoy a good micro-brew or sit next to someone who is?

I know of solid TBM families who own retail businesses that profit from the sale of alcohol and tobacco, as well as literature and media they they would look down on others for reading and watching. I also know of Mormons who own casinos with restaurants that serve alcohol and they think it's perfectly okay to make a profit from all of it. And then there's Marriott...

Maybe there are a few mormo-nazis that won't eat in a restaurant with bar service, but most will simply rationalize doing it as a matter of convenience, especially if they can get a good deal on super-sizing.

Years ago we visited my TBM son and his family in Provo. They took us out to a restaurant south of town precisely because it did have a bar, and they knew we would like a pre-dinner cocktail.

The waiter was an obvious RM, probably a BYU student working part-time. This was back when any drinks served at the table had to be made by a supervisor, not just a waiter.

I ordered a bourbon and soda. The waiter looked uncomfortable, but went off to get my drink. He came back and said "We don't have any bourbon." I thought, "That's a hell of a note, that a bar doesn't have bourbon." I said, "Well, what kind of whiskey do you have?"

Off he went again. He came back with a notepad in his hand and starting reading what whiskey they had, which included gins, rums, vodkas and brandies (obviously these folks didn't know much about liquor). On the list was something called "Jim Beam."

I told him that Jim Beam was a bourbon-type whiskey. So I got my drink.

Another story:

My wife spent an overnight in Nauvoo a few years ago, and we stayed at a small downtown hotel with restaurant. At dinner the dining room was crowded. Almost entirely Mormons (who else would spend time in Nauvoo?). My wife asked if wine was available. "Oh, yes," said the waiter enthusiastically (obviously not Mormon). So my wife said, rather loudly, "We'll each have a glass of red wine." The whole dining room stared at us. We probably ruined their dinners.

I'm a Mormon, and I'll eat at places that serve alcohol, although I no longer drink.

I'll eat at all kinds of places. I live in South America and frequently eat with indigenous folks who aren't that far removed from cannibalism.

I can't be certain but I suspect that, were He alive and had a hankerin' for something to eat, Jesus Christ would feel quite comfortable in just about any joint, whether the folks at the next table were liquored up or not.

Depends on the member. Some have no problem with eating in a restaurant that serves alcohol, others avoid it completely.

It wouldn't have bothered me as a TBM. But a couple of my grown kids have worked at restaurants with bars--in Utah. And there are a some people who request not to be seated near the bar. It seems kind of stupid to me. It's not like they allow people to get drunk at a family restaurant.

What do they think will happen if the see an alcoholic drink? It is akin to seeing a woman who's dressed immodestly when you are trying to stay morally clean? Will it make them have uncontrollable evil thoughts about breaking the Word of Wisdom? Food porn?

Corporate restaurants (like the ones the OP mention) all have Utah liquor licenses. It's one of the reasons why Utah liquor laws are so unfair. Locally-owned restaurants have a difficult time getting the limited number of licenses the state grants. Corporate restaurants get their licenses. I guess this shouldn't be a surprise as Mormonism is a corporation and a lot of Utahans obviously like corporations! The barkeep's Boner.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/13/2016 09:43PM by byuboner.

Since the provincial government relaxed liquor and licencing laws in Alberta, liquor stores and pubs and craft/micro breweries have been a growth industry. Interestingly though, you still can't buy beer and wine in a grocery store or convenience store at least not in Alberta, but I'm a 10 minute drive from 3 good liquor stores and 5 pubs so it's all good.

RB

Mormons don't like to sit in the bar area. Most mormons don't mind eating at a place with a bar.

When Olive Garden first opened in Logan, the server would show you the wine of the day. That didn't last very long!!!!

You can ALWAYS tell in Utah if your server is a mormon or not by ordering a drink. They either don't know anything about alcohol or act offended.

Those are the places that I always leave one of my "MormonThink.com" calling cards. I leave them under my plate, in the restroom, and any other place I can think of. I don't go to Utah often, but I always print up about 1000 cards to scatter around.

madalice Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Those are the places that I always leave one of my
> "MormonThink.com" calling cards. I leave them
> under my plate, in the restroom, and any other
> place I can think of. I don't go to Utah often,
> but I always print up about 1000 cards to scatter
> around.

What a fantastic idea! Did you design them yourself, or can they be downloaded somewhere?

Some will. My convert neighbor won't though. She could hardly sit still when we invited her to dinner once and hubby and I had a glass of wine with our meal.

She thought she was being oh so subtle when she told us how alcohol had done things to people she knew that would make the hair on our arms stand straight up.

"That's why we firmly believe in moderation in all things." I replied.

Growing up in Las Vegas in the 50s and 60s, I never noticed mormons having any problem with being surrounded by alcohol, tobacco and gambling. The key was taking to heart the guardian phrase, "In the world, but not of the world."

Oh, the pride we felt!

I love going with Mormons to a bar. In agriculture if the customer wants to go to the bar, you go. As and exmo I didn't start drinking until I started going out with customers. I started with sweet wines and then discovered single malt Scotch (aka ambrosia).

Mormons in a bar are a fish out of water. They squirm, try to order something that doesn't look alcoholic and look around uncomfortably. It's more fun to watch their body language than whatever game is on.

In Utah I would eat at bars that had good food.

I didn't have to listen to unruly children.

Me and some coworkers went to Buffalo Wild Wings after work a couple of years ago to watch BYU and USU football game..

This was in American Fork, smack dab in the Bubble.

There were P..L..E..N..T..Y of mormons (TBMs I assume but maybe not..) there also for the game..95% rooting for BYU...Lots of sodas on the tables there. They even sat in the "bar" area (though you still have to order food to get served...not a true bar)

They do up here in Alberta. most restaurants have a bar and all the booze is on display and I've seen lots of Mormons there, especially when the restaurant is full and there's room in the bar. I've also witnessed an expression of disdain from Mormons I know as I tip a pint of ale. Very satisfying.

RB

My mother and sister (and probably my other TBM family, as well, but I don't have first-hand experience) will not step foot in a bar or tavern.
However, they will eat in the dining room of an establishment that has a bar.
I never understood how it was any different. I do remember being taught over and over as a child and youth that the spirit leaves you at the door of a bar or tavern--a veritable den of iniquity.

When I was 19 years old and engaged, I took my mother up to Seattle with me to help me decide between two wedding dresses I had found at a couple really great boutiques. I thought it would be nice to take my future mother-in-law with me, too. Then we could all go out to a late lunch together afterwards. My future sister-in-law planned to meet us at the restaurant.

When we got to the restaurant, which was upscale and nicer than any place this sheltered, small-town girl had ever been to :), the dining room was closed. The hostess suggested we eat in the bar, which looked pretty much like the dining room, only smaller, and was separated from the dining room by a low, subtle dividing wall, which made the restaurant seem like one big space.

My mother stopped right outside the entrance and refused to go in. She would not be budged. The mother- and sis-in-law were confused and baffled by this, never having been around a mormon in their lives!

I was mortified! Embarrassed! Humiliated! But I didn't know what to do against the force that is my mother, so I did nothing. We ended up going to eat at a Shari's instead. Talk about a let down!

My sis-in-law (who is really quite a judgmental bitch herself, but whatever) was horrified and disgusted by my mother's behavior and never forgot that and because of it, she judged me as the same and it strained our relationship for my entire marriage.

But my mother could stand tall in the belief that she kept her "standards", couldn't she?

I see people drinking all the time at Ruby River in Provo whenever I go there. So they can't all be TBMs.

The Marriott Hotels have bar service both in their lobbies and restaurants.

Lots of Mormons pay to stay at the Marriott since it's Mormon owned and operated (or is it still?!)

In the "old" days when it was relatively a newcomer on the hotel horizon, Mormons were given discounts for staying there. That's no more.

The average run of the mill mormon, yes.

The bent and wound up too tight, end is near, food and weapon storage, home school the kids with no internet mormons, not a chance in hell.

Fascinated,

Where in the Midwest are you?
The land of the "fish fry"?

Agnes, I'm in a university town. The only time fish fry events happen is on Fridays during Lent. The Catholic school hosts one, the local upscale, all-inclusive senior living center hosts theirs, a family restaurant offers up a popcorn shrimp special.
I've never been to one. In my world, fish on your plate should have come directly from the sea that morning (as it was where I used to live).