I decided to post under my real name a few days ago. I really want to be anonymous for this one, but I want the world to know. I post as me.

Yesterday my oldest sister committed suicide.

The history of how she got to that state of mind is complex and not at all easy to post in a short forum post. There is much blame being thrown around between my family and the in-laws. Her death hasn't brought us together in grief, but divided us further.

We all share some of the blame, none of us are innocent. Me included I'm sure.

However, I fucking hate the church! It is the biggest problem in what went wrong in my sisters life, and none of the fucking
hypocritical TBMs in either side of the family can see it.

My sister felt like a failure. she felt she failed enough as a mother and a wife to take her own life. She would have been listening to lessons year after year that if your children leave the church, you are a failure as a mother. If your fucking husband cheats and has an affair it's because you failed as a wife.

I love you Pamela. Even though you defriended me on FB because I was openly supportive of your daughter coming out. Even though I openly supported your son who didn't believe. Even though you refused to have any communication with me for several years because I wouldn't agree with how you thought about your daughter.

I still loved you. It didn't have to be this way.

There are no words, just hugs.

The blame lies squarely with the church. They know they have a defective product, they have the epidemiological data to prove it's dangerous, they have many options for making it safe, and all they do is make it more hazardous and soul crushing in the name of selfishness and greed.

I'm sorry for your sister's "death by Mormonism".

So sorry for your loss. I hope you aren't feeling any guilt personally since the things you could have taught her might have lifted some of the pain she was feeling. LDS, Inc. has a lot to answer for. It makes me crazy that in General Conferences they refuse to tell the gay members that they are loved and that they must love themselves as whole and complete persons with no reason to be looked down upon. All their teaching about same sex attraction and needing to fight being who they truly are is killing people. I wish there was a law to stop them from doing this.

Here may be the belly of the beast. If you yell "fire!" in a crowded theater or incite a riot, that's not free speech. If your words drive people to suicide, I would call that murder by depraved indifference. There ARE laws. You can't bully people online to the point of suicide. Lucky for TSCC you can't prove malicious intent, but you can certainly prove they are turning a blind eye. In this age, large organizations are obliged to act on data because data is so easy to come by. That's the beauty of being large, trends mean something. A spike in suicides isn't something you just blow off.

"Turning a blind eye"

Those are the words I've been searching for. LDS, Inc. turns a blind eye to so much of the pain it causes in people's lives. Most of it has to do with making members feel less than perfect because perfection is the standard they hold-up as God's desire. They also cause so much pain for missionaries by turning a blind eye to the consequences of the pain they inflict by pressuring them to get converts. Shaming and blaming is rampant in tscc.

So terribly sorry for your loss.

My brother also took his own life just a year ago. I know something of your pain right now.

Shortly after his death, I happened to read Andrew Solomon's chapter on suicide in his book about depression, "The Noonday Demon". While nothing makes it better, sometimes a little light shining into the dark crevices allows you to draw a breath of untroubled air.

In some remote ways, the church figured into my brother's death as well. But for me the piece that gave me clarity was the insight that those who commit suicide are, among other things, impulsive. Don't know if this was the case with your sister. But it surely was with my brother.

In any event, the thing we must each know, and reaffirm for ourselves, was that people make these choices and we are not to blame. Not that we might not have done things differently, but the decision was theirs, not ours.

I hope you find peace.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/19/2016 07:41PM by Twinker.

Thank you

I'm so sorry for your terrible loss. There are no words to comfort, except that we need more love in this world, and you loved her.

How sad she didn't see other alternatives. I am sorry too that instead of bringing people together this has driven them even further apart in your family. I hope you all can eventually make peace with her death and each other.

I'm so sorry for this terrible loss.
(((()))

Best thoughts to you and your family. Thank you for sharing with us.

What a devastating thing to experience! I am so sad that you are going through this. I, too, hope that the family divisions can somehow heal.

Please take care of yourself!

I am so very sorry for your loss. I am also so very sorry your sister was in so much pain that for her, taking her life seemed to be her only option to end that pain.

Darren, you have my sincerest sympathy. I, too, lost a sister to suicide, and the blame all around (I blamed her husband and the church) split the family severely. This was eight years ago. This was my post on RfM in 2008:

========
My TBM sister has finally made the break and is free of the Mormon church.

Background: Two years younger than I (I'm the oldest of five), we were both raised by our devout Mormon parents in a small mostly Mormon town in southeast Idaho. She was a talented singer and wanted to become professional. She got a BA in music at BYU and had an opportunity to study under the famous soprano Eileen Farrell, but Dad didn't want her to be so far away from home for so long, and was afraid it would take her away from her destiny to be a good Mormon wife and mother.

So she married her boyfriend from BYU and ultimately raised four good Mormon children, who in turn gave her a bunch of grandchildren and even great-grandchildren. She took seriously her role as a mother, and especially as a grandmother.

Having escaped the strict control of our father, she found she was now controlled by her husband. He was very devoted and affectionate to her, but controlled her every movement - how she should wear her hair, what clothes she should wear, when she should have a nap, whether she should go jogging with him. She could not escape. She commented once, "If only he would just leave me alone for a while!"

She found temporary escape in alcohol and became a secret drinker, supplemented by prescription drugs of various kinds. A couple of suicide attempts got her into therapy. The therapy lasted only a couple of months, until the therapist insisted on having a session with her husband. After that session, he came home and announced that she would not be going back to that therapist, who was obviously a quack: the therapist had suggested that HE might have some problems, when any fool could see that SHE was the alcoholic, not HIM. So no more therapy. The solution was simple: just obey the commandments!

When they retired and moved to Utah, things seemed to improve. She had been fairly successful in AA in California, and in Utah she was close to the temple, got active in Relief Society, and seemed OK. Always very devout, she began going to the temple two or three times a week with a small group of friends. She was recently invited to an interview with the temple president to explore whether she would like to work as a temple ordinance worker a few times a week. She was very excited about that. But her husband felt that it would not be a good idea, since it would "take her away from the home" too much. So that was that.

She was worried last week that God did not love her any more, because she was not "worthy" - she had slipped off the wagon and was nipping again at the brandy.

She finally made her break.

Yesterday she swallowed every pain-killer and aspirin in the house, followed by a pint of brandy. And her heart stopped.

She was 73 years old - 73 years of a life of obedience, unfulfillment, frustration, sadness and no sense of self-worth - the life of a slave, thanks largely to the Mormon culture in which she lived.


The next Mormon that tries to tell me how much good the church does is going to get punched in the mouth.

Thank you for sharing. It helps.

Richard, I'm so sorry that you lost your sister, and that her husband was such a consistently wretched jerk to her.

As a lifelong single, I've always said that there are worse fates in life.

Richard, I clearly remember reading that post 8 years ago. As I read I kept waiting and looking for how your sister was able to finally break herself free from TSCC. I felt devastated reading at the end that it was through suicide. I remember feeling that it was very clear, in her case, that the Mormon church was to blame for her lack of esteem and sense of failure.

Darren, I'm so sorry. Again, the blame seems to lie clearly at the feet of TSCC. I really believe that only a Mormon parent would feel a failure simply because his/her child isn't exactly the same as the parent in thought, belief, and action. You have my sympathy.

Sending hugs and condolences. Please try to take of yourself during this time.

Darren, I am so terribly sorry. I don't think that there is much that you or your family could have done, if that's any comfort.

To me, if a church doesn't teach and encourage the virtues of love, acceptance, and kindness, then what good is it? Because in the end, that's all that matters.

Darren,

Please accept a virtual pat on the back for doing right by your niece and nephew. Keep fighting the good fight.

I wish I could take away some of your sorrow. I just hope that you can at least feel some small degree of consolation knowing that you are living an authentic life.

i'm crying !!!!. I'm so sorry !!! I've had it with death. and the innocent people dying prematurely. my condolences.

Darren, I am so very sorry for your loss. As CrispingPin said, a virtual pat on the back for supporting your niece and nephew. May memories of happier times with your sister bring some comfort.

((((())))). I am so sorry for your loss.

I cannot begin to understand your grief but please accept my most heartfelt condolences. The LDS church is evil and the more I hear of tragedies like your family is dealing with the more hatred I have for all those TBM's who perpetrate the fraud and the hateful message and are too stupid and clueless to understand or even care.

RB



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/19/2016 08:25PM by Lethbridge Reprobate.

So very sorry for your loss.

Suicide leaves a gaping tear in your heart that will never fully heal. You will never get that closure you longed for with that loved one, all you can do is self-help and be there for your loved ones who are left.

When you love someone deeply you grieve deeply. We don't get a pass or the easy way out.

((((Hugs))))

"When you love someone deeply you grieve deeply. We don't get a pass or the easy way out."

That is so true. When we love, we risk grieving. The only way to avoid grief is to never love. Grief is the price we pay for love. Sometimes that price is very high, but it's worth it.

Thank you all for your kind words and thoughts.

I phoned my dad this Father's Day. We could hardly talk to each other. We just cried on the phone. My Dad is devastated. Being the good TBM that he is, he can only see the way to blame those who don't toe the church line.

I'm so very sorry, Darren.

My deepest condolences mate!!

One of the Young Women values is, "Choice and Accountability."
Where is the accountability of the TSCC in these suicides?!!
Death by Mormonism...the cult should be on trial for these murders.

I'm so sorry for the loss of sisters, brothers, nieces, nephews, etc. who lose hope and take their lives because of the imagined authority of a corporate-church.

(((BIG HUGS!!!)))

I am so sorry Darren. HUGS!!!

So sorry for your loss :'( My father chose to end his life a year and a half ago...still very sad with many unanswered questions...but I do know that guilt of not being able to live up to mormon standards was a part of it :(

Sending (((hugs)))

I'm jealous of her. She's free of pain.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865656524/Family-coping-with-2-sons-suicides-hope-free-app-will-save-others.html

The graph in the article is positive evidence that Mormonism has a direct correlation with suicide rates.