I am working on a topical guide for the apostate. I have about half of the topics addresses and have about 140 pages of quotes, cataloged by topic. subtopic and quote. I would like those who are interested to take a look. I have drawn on my own work, the work on MormonThink, The Book of Mormonisms, Deconstructor's site, as well as a number of other sites.

If you have a few minutes, please take a look and see if you think it is worthwhile. The index is hot linked to the quotes. The categories are not in the final order.

http://jhuston.com/half_first_draft.htm

This is wonderful stuff Jim. I noted a couple of things as I skimmed it for the first time.

1. References to concubinage/cohabitation would go well with the polygamy section. Carmon B. Hardy made references to George Q. Cannon's opinion that concubinage was justifiable.

2. A few quotes from various LDS scriptures that contradict the LDS traditional view of the Garden of Eden as the place where Jesus paid for the sins of the world. (I'm happy to send them to you if you think it fits what you are trying to do).

3. I can find a few instances where "Ensign" and page number is mentioned but the month and year is missing.

This is a great resource and I will continue to review if this is the kind of information you are looking for.

Great job!

Anything you want to send would be great. In battling on boards, finding what I needed, when I needed it was always a problem. When I started this, I didn't realize the scope. I have already spent a few hours on this. I will review the quotes and get the additional information.

Jim this work is fantastic. Very impressive. I'll see what comments I can offer.

Regarding the index: I would guess that your goal is for the reader to find a given topic and its entries as easily as possible. Therefore, I would suggest you change your wording in some cases so that the FIRST word in the heading is the word that the reader is most likely seeking.

Here are a few examples I noticed offhand, each immediately followed by my suggested change.

“What a leader says is scripture”
“Scripture” as defined by Leaders

“Never criticize - leadership can't lead you astray”
Criticism of church leaders

[The next two are subtopics under the polygamy:]

“Some women didn't like polygamy”
Women questioning polygamy (or) women against polygamy (or)
Women: some against polygamy

“Polygamy benefits Indians”
Indians benefit from polygamy

Best of luck, Jim. lease keep us informed about this worthwhile project!

+1

Just scrolling through 3-4 pages, I found quotes I hadn't seen before and that will be valuable references for questions that are asked on the board.

Thank you for your hard work, Jim. Your contributions are such a valuable resource for so many.

What would be most helpful, and I've nevr seen one, is a timeline. A timeline that would bring the history into perspective. An example of this is during the time between the first vision and Moroni presenting JS the Golden Plates, JS was hauled into court and found guilty of commiting fraud for money-digging. I'm sure there are other anachronisms, but this one comes to mind.

I always fantasized about having a color coded timeline so that First Vision incidents would be blue, polygamy red, etc.

This is definitely a must-have book. THanks, Jim.

Anagrammy

Good stuff Brother Jim. yeah, I found some quotes I hadn't seen before either. Email me when you have a permanent web address and I'll link to it.

The topic "Rape for God" is talking about my ancestors. The Miles referred to was my great great grandfather. The family has a lot of mixed feeling about him. My father has a beaver skin top hat that belonged to him.

I look forward to seeing the finished product. The best testimony breaker is almost always the words of the Prophets themselves.

You've really invested some time and effort into this project. I especially appreciate the section on Science and the Cosmos. Good stuff! That is precisely the kind of information that directly lead me out of Mormonism. Keep up the good work and let us know when you've completed your project.

THANKS!

THIS.IS.AWESOME!!!

Thank you SO much for putting this together! I am anxiously looking forward to the rest!

best way BY FAR to argue with TBMs is to throw these quotes at them. My own collection is puny compared to this!

Gold mine!

Saw the link to your work over on postmormon.org and had to come over here and comment. Great stuff!

No sex parts unless you make it to the celestial kingdom (unless you were black, then you can be a slave with sex parts)

You got to add this Jim.

“In both of these kingdoms [i.e., the terrestrial and telestial] there will be changes in the bodies and limitations. They will not have the power of increase, neither the power or nature to live as husbands and wives, for this will be denied them and they cannot increase. Those who receive the exaltation in the celestial kingdom will have the “continuation of the seeds forever.” They will live in the family relationship. In the terrestrial and in the telestial kingdoms there will be no marriage. Those who enter there will remain “separately and singly” forever. Some of the functions in the celestial body will not appear in the terrestrial body, neither in the telestial body, and the power of procreation will be removed. I take it that men and women will, in these kingdoms, be just what the so-called Christian world expects us all to be – neither man nor woman, merely immortal beings having received the resurrection.
(Doctrines of Salvation. vol. 2, pg. 287-288.)”

Please note that this is “Doctrine”.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/10/2011 12:18AM by AmIDarkNow?.

I just skimmed. Is there a section for "protecting the practice of polygamy from the public"?

planning on coming up with your own original ones ..I see that in many cases you have just cut and pasted and used the headings we came up with when compiling the Book of Mormonisms.

I am using Book of Mormonisms as a secondary source to find what I can't locate any other way. There is a lot of source material available. Any headings that are similar will be different. I had close to 100 pages of my own at an 11 pitch typeface. There is a lot of duplication between sources.

I recommend your book and Unsaintly Saints which has been released on Kindle.