Paging all MBAs! Seeking actionable feedback!

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Given that the so-called church is actually a business,
Would their business practices be all that "bad" ethically,
Or would their business practices make smart business sense,
If it weren't for the fact that they claimed they weren't a business?

Some examples:

- a sales force trained in using pushy sales tactics - don't other businesses do this, and doesn't it make them a profit?

- making grandiose but subjective claims ("Our sh*t is the best!") - isn't that just table-stakes for any business that has products or services to sell to customers?

- constantly fretting over conversion and retention rates, measuring growth (or shrinkage), sending out surveys or setting up focus groups, A/B testing, and all sorts of other numbers-focused activities - does TSCC focus on this more so than would any member of the Fortune 500?

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I'm not trying to justify or defend what TSCC does in any way. They have an inferior (invisible!) product that costs way too much, one that very often causes injury and rarely produces benefits (except for those at the top). On top of that under-compensate and even abuse the "employees". But given the mindf*ck that I've experienced over years of hearing "We're not a business! We're invested in and care about your spirituality and salvation!", and then discovering they were lying about it all the time (meanwhile telling *me* to be "honest in all my dealings with my fellow-men"!!), I just want to double-check my thinking.

Are some/any/all of their tactics justifiable, commonplace, and profitable in the context of running a legitimate business?

Or, is it as I sneakingly suspect, that their tactics and strategies are hallmarks of ponzi-schemes, rackets, and other undesirable and illegitimate operations?

"Millions swear by our product!"

Yes.

Are we going to ignore the man-whore founder, subjugation and inequality of females, the racism, bigotry and the 10% tax it charges it's unpaid laborers, invisible financials and non-payment of taxes?

I think any one of those things, except the first, would bring a whole host of ugly legal things down on its putrid head.

Consider yourself checked.

Obviously, the nasty things you list won't be acceptable in a legit business. But what I'm asking is if any, *any* business-related skill I may have learned in my misspent years in the church has any valid use in the normal, adult, professional working world?

Oh, well, in that case, I will say you should re-channel your enthusiasm into not modeling your ethics on a slime-ball organization.


Contrast to this:

http://www.businessballs.com

It makes LDS look like exactly what it is, in your too-kind description, ponzi-schemes, rackets, and other undesirable and illegitimate operations."

"*any* business-related skill I may have learned in my misspent years in the church has any valid use in the normal, adult, professional working world?"

To that question I would say that the experience in ld$ inc. would be equal or a little less to any other non credential minimum wage job. Folks from Shopko can generally move to Mcdonalds pretty easily. Walmart looks for people who aren't criminals, don't steal, and have a pulse. Having LDS experience is about on par... with these jobs. Being a missionary can prepare you to be a "tela performance" guy or gal taking incoming calls.

But seriously the ones who get help from Mormonism inc. are the mormon royalty. Those that can profit off of their family names. It works well for those on the Bountiful's hill that are related to the Bretheren. Outside of Morridor not so well.

I don't know why one has to be an MBA to have an opinion about this but here goes...

For one thing, the church misrepresents itself as a religion, which could be classified as a charitable organization except the money and the service flows in the wrong direction for the organization to actually be considered charitable. The people who should be receiving the money and the service are giving it to the church, rather than getting something in return for what they give.

If it represented itself more like a business (and had to pay taxes, as well it should), then it's still an unsustainable business model. The main reason is the "business" is set up like a multi-level marketing scheme. There's no actual product being sold (just an emotional, touchy feely "solution" to a problem that they have to work hard at convincing you it exists). In fact, there's no actual market demand for what the church is selling (give your all, your time, your money, your children, your property, your effort, your energy, your soul, EVERYTHING to the church). And there's no return on investment for the "customers." You don't actually get anything for your money when you pay in to "buy" the "product." You get admission to the temple, which is completely fake at best, and promises eternal family. They don't have the ONLY corner on the market in terms of eternal family, but they will tie themselves into knots trying to convince potential customers that this is the one and only place where you can obtain this product.

So, in terms of ethics, this is a bait-and-switch business model. It's like those infomercials where they demonstrate this awesome product and you're stoned at 7:30 in the morning and decide you need the Ron Popeil Pocket Fisherman, so you order it and when it arrives, you try it out and the damn thing breaks into pieces on the first use and you never did manage to catch a fish.

The only way this "business" is sustainable is if the leaders expect and encourage people to breed the downline to keep new customers rolling in, rather than offer a product that people want or need, which would garner repeat customers. If the church had been a real business, it would have shuttered its doors years ago.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/26/2016 10:28AM by dogzilla.

Actual businesses that regularly make promises they can't fulfill get sued for fraud, deceptive advertising, etc.

Religion unreasonably gets excused from such actions, because their unfulfilled promises are a "matter of faith" and are often supposed to be fulfilled in some imagined fantasy "afterlife."

Were LDS, Inc. an actual business, instead of a business hiding behind religion, they'd have been sued out of existence long ago. Over racism and discrimination if nothing else.

The mormon church violates the most critical rules of business.

1.) They don't pay taxes
2.) They lie about their product
3.) Up until 1990, they threatened their most valued customers with penalties of grusome ways you might be killed.
4.) Up until 1978, they institutionalized a policy of racial discrimination.
5.) Over the long term, their product causes a deprived presence of morality in individuals.

I could go on and on. The point is that the product of mormonism would never survive in the marketplace if it were not disguised as a valid religion.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/26/2016 10:56AM by azsteve.

This is a topic that greatly interests me.

Is not disclosing your financials legal? Yes. Is it ethical? No. It really isn't.

Any business that operated the same way the church does would have zero doners. There is no business in the real world that would be able to operate and stay in business using the same practices. It is a corporate sole. There are no other shareholders. No room for investment. Any funds given to the church belong to the church. There is zero return. Are all the segments of the corporation self sufficient? I don't think so. Even if they were we have no way of knowing because there is zero disclosure.