I am a convert to the church and currently inactive and don't really believe in the core doctrines. However I must certainly say that I do have great admiration for the Mormons and their family values and work ethic.

I did a semester at BYU in Idaho and noticed how attractive and good looking both the guys and girls were. The guys were tall and handsome and the girls were pretty and blonde. It was almost like being at a fashion show. I grew up in the Latin hoods of SoCal and seeing people dressing and acting so classily showed had a huge impact on me. I also noticed that the guys were exceptionally hard working. They would work their butts off doing summer sales and also have part time jobs during school and worked hard in their schooling as well. All th girls I met were incredibly classy and hardworking as well. The people especially my professors were extremely kind and awesome.

I certainly do not believe in many things of the Mormon church and think Smith was a fraud but certainly can't help admiring th Mormons.

Thoughts/opinions?

Gee - all my nieces and nephews who attended byui are brunette and short, and some outright dumpy. They all managed to mate and temple marry - and procreate right away. All of which leads me to think there is another generation of short dumpy brunettes headed to byui.

Are you a troll by any chance?

That struck a funny chord with me.

¡Orale! ¿Que barrio?

If you're a guy, I wish you would have latched onto my dil before she married into our family.

The devil can appear as an angel of light ...

All kidding aside, it's because of the amount of emphasis put on image in the LDS church. Successful people are considered more righteous - god blessing the faithful and all that. And, they believe that the righteous will prosper in the land (from the Book of Mormon.) So there is a huge push to appear successful/righteous.

It's scratch the surface skin deep and one of the things I find most creepy about Mormons. Because they aren't honest about their humanity - they are too worried about playing the correct role for the Mormon church. They have to appear perfect and by trying too hard, they appear far from it.

I can see what you're saying. I remember having similar feelings (thirty-five years ago) when I arrived at BYU. I think that the students that go to BYU and BYU-I are, for the most part, ambitious and anxious to fit the stereotype of a model Mormon. The pressure to fill that mold can be motivating in keeping up appearances and doing well.

In my experience, the impression I had of the students at the Y doesn't extend to the Mormon population in general. Those BYU kids do seem to be the cream of the crop.

I have a couple sons attending university in Texas, and I have to add that I have been very impressed by how attractive and successful the students are on those campuses. The men are tall, buff, and intelligent, and the women are pretty and confident (and have a variety of hair colors and skin colors, as well). College students, in general, are more or less at the prime of their lives physically. They're impressive everywhere, I think.

There are lots of beautiful blonde Mormon women ... Like Elizabeth Smart. That particular look is a dime a dozen in the Salt Lake valley.

There's something about lots of the Mormon men that is downright goofy, though. Early balding (as in during their 20s or early 30s) and unattractive facial features.

Hmmm, nice tag line: "SLC blondes: They're not just Smart, they're Mormon Smart".

I started going bald in my early 20's. Reading the writing on the wall, I quickly converted to Mormonism and snagged a hot brunette TBM. Other than the hair club for men gift certificates that my wife gets me every year for fathers day, I really don't think my wife cares that I am bald. I don't honestly know how she feels about me being morbidly obese, though.

on the population of Point of the Mountain. Some of these criminals are very successful, and handsome.

With your sharp superficial observation skills and willingness to join a group founded by a conman, which you know is a pile of sh*t, you should fit right in.

Or you can go back to your missionary chat. Posting here doesn't count and you know it.


Kathleen

before they get to BYU?

Thoughts?


K

We brown-haired dumpy ones don't stand out. Like an earlier poster wrote, Mormons like people who are beautiful and successful. Those who don't make the mark don't get the good jobs, good boyfriends, etc. You will see the beautiful people out and about, but us dumpy ones hide in our rooms or in the library.

applesauce

Nice I agree

Mormons are in a rat race to heaven. They can really make their hamster wheels spin now, but wait 20 to 40 years and see how pooped they get.

Just in case any of you might be wondering - NO - I am NOT a troll. It is an honest, sincere question.

Welcome to the board! You mentioned attending for the one semester...did you transfer to a different school? If so, what is your impression of those students?

A better question is, "Why are ex-Mormons even more attractive and even more successful?"

I would say that there is an extremely high level of competition in Utah. Especially regarding looks and financial status. Not in all areas but many across the Wasatch Front. When social media is thrown in the mix, there are middle age adults trying to out do anyone they can and post it to their brag board. Plastic surgery, starvation diets, and obsessive workout regiments are super trendy and on the rise.

Oh and of course stomping on anyone for financial gain. That's a biggie, but it's been that way since Brigham's days.

And yet I saw so much poverty there while visiting in May. The people who waited on me as clerks in hotels and service stations, I know they were low paying jobs and all ... but for some of these people they were their life careers.

I saw the extremes of cosmetic surgery more when I visited St. George, Utah winter of 2015 than Salt Lake City and Ogden this past May. Nearly everywhere I went up north in Wasatch country I observed mostly impoverished people who were barely making minimum wage to survive. Some of them had families. Some were grandparents.

What broke my heart was seeing some who were no older than myself or younger, who were toothless, because they had no freaking dental care. These were people in service jobs, not the homeless!

I didn't take surveys asking who of them were Mormon or not. It didn't matter to me, because poverty is poverty and cuts across all sections of society. It was just more marked there than where I live.

The lack of dental care in Salt Lake Valley struck me as odd, in a place with so much freaking wealth. How can its people subject its poorest but working class to such abject conditions?

Contrast that to St. George where I met several women in sales jobs who had dental veneers they paid thousands or tens of thousands for to look like a million dollars. They did. But their smiles were/are so fake. They did it to get an edge in the job market they work in. It was just observing extremes from one end of the state to the other. I know the bleached bubble heads exist up north in Utah, I just didn't see as many on my trip.

If you look at the wives of some of the GA, you'll see them there. Or the General Relief Society Board. Some of those women look like they've paid a fortune in plastic surgery to keep up appearances. Mostly blonde, botoxed, facelifts are the obvious telltale signs. It is very bland and superficial though. It's their way of bragging about their success, and being a trophy wife for their husbands. Only their beauty is only skin deep, and what accomplishment does it take to pay a plastic surgeon? No wonder depression is at an all time high in Utah! Perfection appears to be only skin deep in Mormonism. While their souls are in a barren wasteland. Where it's "always winter, never Christmas." (from Narnia)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/07/2016 04:44AM by Amyjo.

I agree Amyjo, there are areas of poverty and blue collar communities in Utah, but places like Centerville, Bountiful, Draper, and especially up north in areas of Weber County are the ones I am familiar with.

This is where people don't necessarily worry about putting food on their table but will spend hours in the gym, drinking their green smoothies, and seeking the next youthful procedure. The competition is thick and success is only skin deep. Not everyone in these areas, but the ones that do are the majority.

I wonder if I'll live longer by moving back there when I retire? Or drop dead trying to be younger than I am instead of enjoying the age I'm at and just trying to age naturally and gracefully?!

I'm all for good health. But so many of these cosmetic procedures are just that: cosmetic.

I've probably seen more bad cosmetic surgical outcomes in the tabloids than good outcomes. Having lots of money and being able to afford to have things done is no guarantee it's going to work.

I saw a woman at High Holy services last year (she may hide the rest of the year because haven't seen her come out since,) who had a face lift that went awry. Oh my goodness, it was hard not to feel sorry for her. The women who age naturally may look their age but it's their intelligence and personality people are drawn to more than their looks. That's the way I hope to age. The more plastic surgery people have, the more fake they start to look.

I'm not against plastic surgery. I am against the overuse and misuse of it - if people want to self-destruct through self-obsession with their bodies that's up to them. For me I value my life more than that. Elective surgeries I try to keep to a minimum.

Working out would be alright if that were all some of these people spent their money on, and time.

Last time I lived in Utah was a junior in high school. I remember how obsessed the teens were then with their bodies and self-image. I wasn't bulimic before moving to Ogden, Utah. I became bulimic while living there, and would spend inordinate amounts of time with my best girlfriend going to the Deseret gym (don't know if it's still there or not,) and I joined Lil Audrey's while I lived there to work out. I was only 17.

My mom became anorexic living there. Hmm. We're talking 40 years ago, already. Lots of pressure to look good, even then.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/07/2016 02:55PM by Amyjo.

That's unfortunately a route many young girls take and boys. Eating disorders are prevalent and seem to only be getting worse.

The Deseret Gym is gone, but Gold's gym is front and center at the junction by the mega plex.

I think that just because Mormons look nice and smile it might look like they are being cocky. But what I see a lot in Mormons it that they don't care how they look. They don't have time with all the other perfect and hard working stuff they do.

Gee, and I've wondered that about the Canadian guys at the border crossing to Canada. Man, those guys are drop dead gorgeous!

I can guarantee it isn't because of their religion.

But you go into further to Ontario, and the guys and women there are just really youthful looking, and better educated overall than their American neighbors. I don't understand what they have that we don't.

Even their gardens and lawns, & houses are better kept overall.

Canada looks European. The US side looks like a developing nation compared to how clean and well landscaped Canadian properties are - both residential and commercial.

As for Mormons, you're probably confusing the age of Innocence and youthful ignorance with attractiveness.

Where my children went to college they could buy condoms from the vending machines next to the potato chips. Kids were having sex in the dorm rooms whenever they wanted to. And many of the kids partied like there was no tomorrow. Sadly for some, there was no tomorrow.

One thing for LDS is the standards are extremely high. For the kids who go there and are willing to keep those standards, they have to be perfectionists and wear blinders to the mainstream culture where anything goes. For non-conformists, going to church college would be a living hell.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/06/2016 09:56PM by Amyjo.

OK, technically I'd say it's because they managed to convince enough good Scandanavian stock to emigrate back in the 1800's.

I can't figure out why they seem to have such nice skin. Zits are a no-no in the mormon world.

Because the Danites eliminate substandard Mormons.

I wish I had a group photo of my last ward. If that doesn't make you change your tune, nothing will. Actually that pretty much goes for every ward i've been in.

The young good looking kids go off to college and come back looking like their parents.They usually are a bit more arrogant though.

You get that way from living in a damn bubble.

They are rich white people who would still be the way they are even if they weren't Mormon. The way they are has nothing to do with being Mormon.

I also found an intellectual dearth among the Mormon college classmates I went to university with in the Morridor up in Idaho.

At my singles ward where the young adults attended from the college, the focus was all on the socializing aspect. There were hardly any scholars in the group.

The only real outstanding scholar among them with a high GPA and scholarship etc was a convert to the church. He was an AP reporter even while we were in college. Otherwise, most of us, myself included, were not really very scholastic.

Part of the problem with being TBM is it limits your ability to think deeply. It restricts access to those areas of the mind that encourage growth and abandonment in the arts and sciences. As LDS we are taught to be prim and proper men and women. In the world but not of the world. It has so many rules and prohibitions that restrict a person from being a free spirit, basically. Or otherwise encourage its members to delve into subjects like philosophy or ask too many questions. Because it doesn't have any answers beyond the pat formula it uses to recruit members. Once you start asking hard questions in Mormonism you are instantly on the outs.

Maybe that's why there aren't all that many cutting edge scientists, mathematicians, artists, etc that come out of church colleges or Mormonism - unless they leave it.

So I would venture there are many "bright" LDS. But not all that many that are high IQ and into the genius realm, including at church colleges. It just doesn't attract that type of thinkers. The deep thinkers, philosophers, intellectuals have pretty much figured it out and left by now if they were born into it. Those who weren't aren't going to be sucked into it unless they're drawn to the clean cut image that offers superficiality but lacks substance. You know, like the Stepford Wives.

Most thinking people aren't drawn to cults however, so most academicians don't concern themselves with such appearances unless they're studying them out of curiosity or majoring in Anthropology or Sociology.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/07/2016 05:50AM by Amyjo.

Been to a "special interest" fireside lately?

"Family Values"?

just on the surface; Lip Service that is...

attractive? successful? You and I must have different definitions for those adjectives. I'd say that look plastic and deceitful......

I agree with the above poster that college gets people at their (typically) physical high point.

I think it's highly dependent on your definition of "attractive" as well. The first time I visited my college on the west coast, I thought everyone was gorgeous, vibrant, happy, curious, adventurous... here, they are good looking in a cookie-cutter kind of way. I see what you mean by attractive to some degree, but it's not my bag personally.

Because in Mormonism, perception is everything. Nothing is delved into. Nothing really investigated. If it looks good on the surface, nothing else is of concern. And if something is actually wrong, well there's a pill for that.

It's a shallow culture and we reflect that in how much energy we place into how we're seen.

2.5 times the national average of plastic surgeons per capita.
5 times the national average of anti-depressants.

I also consider for the handful of successful and attractive people that would label themselves Mormons in this day and age... all one has to do is look around at the larger world of the population who are attractive and successful who were never Mormon, many of whom are far more successful than many LDS.

It is after all, more intelligent people in the population pool, on average, who would not be drawn to a cult in the first place. And if born into one, would not remain in such after reaching maturity.

Although there are some people who have joined Mormonism to establish a fast track to wealth and prosperity, because they've seen how its broadcast from the pulpit by the laymembers. It is, in a weird and quirky sense, very similar to some of the prosperity churches that broadcast on television, only with a tighter rein on its members.

You also forgot to mention the Mormons who aren't attractive and successful, in the church. Or the converts who join because they're looking for a substitute family instead of ready success ....

Cherry picking only works when the orchard is the same. Mormons are diverse IMO. What's driving the clear headed and intelligent ones away is this very kind of thinking, ie, superficiality in place of substance. Churches are supposed to be about heart over matter, after all. The soul journey does not equate to outward beauty or success in the world. Not that those things don't matter, but they have their place and should not be confused with spiritual worth or salvation.

After posting my comments, it occurred to me the flip side is also true in Mormonism. There are lots of Mormons who are not attractive or considered successful in the eyes of the church, or the world.

To the church, these people are as good as forgotten. They are in a lower caste system.

They are the ones who are marginalized, disenfranchised, and looked down upon at church. Outside of church they aren't even pitied because Mormonism does very little to help the poor in their midst. Lip service is all it does, if that.

Out of all the church services I've been to, only a very tiny percentage of them ever even mentioned the poor among them, or discussed helping them including charity projects.

It was different where I grew up as a child in Idaho. Service projects were common to help the poor and elderly. Not anymore. That's because they don't have the initiative, or people (male or female) who have the time, energy or resources to make a difference in their community.

Maybe some people care about the poor. The church in general does very little to assist them. Compare that to other churches who make it their mission to help the poor and needy, and downtrodden. Not so much the Mormons, unless it gets them some publicity.

The fast offerings collected are supposed to help the poor. Yet the people who need it the most in the wards are the ones who are forgotten and looked down upon. And the elderly? They're neglected just because they got older. That is one of the most undervalued but greatest resources the church has are its aged population.

Where I worship now the aged are revered and honored. Doing acts of charity and service are as common as meetings. It's like night and day compared to Mormonism.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/07/2016 10:26AM by Amyjo.

If Mormons look down open the old why is all of the leaders old? Some people say they should be young. And the reason they don't do a lot of poor help in the community is because they don't want publicity. That's why you don't know about it. It's all when people are not looking. They don't care about fame.

Ugly goes clear to the bone.
Once they open their mouths and start spewing their delusional doomsday narrative, they become a lot less attractive.

Scientologists seem attractive and succesful in movie acting careers.

OP, why are you inactive?

As a nevermo who married into and divorced out of a TBM family, I saw first hand just how important appearances were. My former in-laws were all blessed with amazing genetics, and probably fit well into that 'pretty' category which you describe.

While this family struck it rich in the genetic lotto, their consuming need for outward perfection was only matched by those of similar wealth in their ward. By the time I escaped their charade? The bishop and several of his flock were indicted and imprisoned for fleecing millions from their own. Looks, dear friend, can be very deceiving.

Flying into Salt Lake City from the east coast I've always noticed that there are a disproportionately high number of blondes. For the women it's the sort of look that Elizabeth Smart has or Julianne Hough. You just don't see it quite as often on the east coast. I attribute it to the high number of Scandinavian immigrants in the 1800s.

As for vibrancy, you will see that on many college campuses. I used to marvel at the good looks omnipresent at my alma mater, the University of Colorado. The students there tend to be into sports, particularly outdoor sports such as skiing, snowboarding, cycling, etc. They are a good-looking bunch!

Mormons tend to want to impress others by their looks and supposed success. Some of them can be good looking but often the financial and professional success are exaggerated. They might live in a big house and have new cars and boat but owe more than any of them are worth.

That amazing blondness for the most part, I would say,is achieved with amazing genies in an amazing amount of choices of amazing genie bottles. And amazingly enough, I dabble in the blondness once in a while. ;)

Mormons as a whole are no more "attractive and successful" than any other group.

They may LOOK that way to some people, but that's only because they're instructed to put on a happy face, put on a good show, and pretend they're happy and successful whether they are or not. It's part of their intentional training to convince non-mormons that they're enjoying the "blessings of heaven," and so you should join them. The reality, though, is far more "normal."

As for attractive...personally I'm not into blondes, but if you are, great -- enjoy.

lol JamesTheMormon and JamesTheCoolGuy

I live in VERY rural Utah. Lots of toothless folks here who do a lot of tobacco chewing, including bigshits. A good number carry their food supply with them. Just saying...

They've been trained to follow authority and are good salesmen. 2 years of selling the Book of Mormon teaches you to keep going after you hear no. I've hired quite a few to work for me. It's extra satisfying.

It is because of all of the tithing that MORmONS are paying

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeJqjDp87rA

MORmONS are quite exceptional, and IF you do not believe that then; A. Just ask them, B. you are under the influence of Satan.

If a person paid huge amounts of tithing, like everything they earned, then maybe they could become almost as beautiful as PRofit Gordon BS Hinckley !!

I know, right? All movie stars. Mormonism is the prettiest religion by far. Have you seen Lutherans? There's no comparison.

I have always though that the students at my alma mater (the University of Colorado) are ridiculously good looking. I always attributed it to a fondness for an outdoor lifestyle combined with a general prosperity. The one thing that I'll say about Utah is that there are an awful lot of blue-eyed blondes there due to the Scandinavian ancestry. But that would be true of Minnesota and other climes as well.

I think the OP is definitely right about Mormons being uber hardworking and therefore successful (of course hard work is no guarantee of success or anything else...). I attended grad school with a large group of Mormons (married males in their early to mid 20's) and observed the following: they studied hard, made good grades, followed all rules, held down jobs all while raising young kids (their wives were all SAHMs). I found their work ethics to be admirable (see also: annoying, lol). They were clannish but unfailingly friendly, upbeat and positive. It would appear that bad attitudes and pessimism are not part of the culture. I am more of an introvert, so some of that uber friendly "Pollyanna" stuff was obnoxious to me...but I still had to admire the tenacity. It was like, "damn! don't you people ever get tired? Crabby? Cranky???

Total, complete, idiot. Look at athletic events when the camera pans the crowd at BYU games. Some of the homeliest humans alive. Watch a byu fireside, especially the choir. You'll think you're watching "The hills have eyes movie". Byu students have taken huge steps backwards looks wise since the 1980's. It's just more evidence of the church losing it's youth. Look at photos of cheerleading squads. Today's group wouldn't even make the marching band calendar. Geesh, idiots.

Who are you calling an idiot? The OP? Usually name-calling indicates a lack of ideas.

And it also makes the OP's point. While we are an angry, unattractive lot, the TBMs are actually friendly.