It's true!--except the part about the fight breaking out. The theme was truth and honesty, and the sermon happened to be presented by a visiting friend of mine who is a very liberal Presbyterian minister. The UU pastor came up to me and said, "You know, we're doing an LDS hymn for the offertory. You'll probably recognize it." What they chose was, "O, Say, What is Truth?" They sang 3 of 4 verses, because one of the verses is very doctrinal Mormon. It was kind of a weird experience hearing the Unitarian choir doing a Mormon hymn. Frankly, it was also a weird experience to have them associate Mormons with truth and honesty.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 03/28/2017 10:41AM by cludgie.

You could've given the sermon for that day.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/28/2017 10:05AM by Amyjo.

LOL. We often sing songs in UU service that have familiar tunes. I didn't know how many mormon hymns are to the tune of hymns that have been out there for hundreds of years. And many traditional hymns that a lot of Christian churches and the mormons sing are in the UU hymnbook with tweaked words in certain places.

The best one with a familiar tune is Blue Boat Home, one of my favorite songs, let alone very favorite hymn. My daughter came to church with me one time and when I saw it on the order of service, I thought I would just wait until we start singing it and then see what her reaction was.

Of course, it starts out all upbeat and we usually have a djembe drummer along with the great piano part in it. So we're all upbeat after the introduction and then we get about 2 lines into the hymn and my daughter starts laughing. We're singing trying to hold our laughter in. When it was over she goes, "that was interesting."

But to have an actual Mormon hymn, sung the way mormons sing it, would be kind of trippy. And you're so right, especially thinking mormons sing about truth. Something they know nothing about.

Unfortunately, I cannot make it through "Blue Boat Home" without getting emotional.

I hear ya.

cludgie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Unfortunately, I cannot make it through "Blue Boat
> Home" without getting emotional.

I'm with you because I can't sing it, either, even though I love it. I'm in tears at about bar 8 and my throat closes up and I can't sing any more.

For anyone who's wondering, here's a link to this beautiful song.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhsXl1_rEwI

Many hymn melodies go back generations and are public domain. Also--I'm not a musicologist--many share common elements in meter, phrasing, harmonic structure, and length of staff and stanza. So a good, durable melody will be adaptable to a wide array of lyrics.

On a similar note (pun intended) you have heard the famous "Pachelbel Canon" more often than you think, because the chord sequence is very basic, and the melody works even when altered a bit. Similarly, you've watched "Cinderella" many more times than you're probably aware of. They're more than memes--they're templates.

Pachelbel Canon Rant:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdxkVQy7QLM

At least it wasn't Praise to the Man.

I came to love singing Blue Boat Home once I learned the new words for the old Mormon sac hymn all about Christ's conditional love.

Q. Do you know why UUs are the worst denomination at singing hymns?

A. Because they're always reading ahead to make sure they agree with the next line.

Thus spake Mujun.

HAHA. How true it is.

This is in Utah or the Morridor, right?

If not, it could be coincidence, and a definite sign that other denominations need to study and be fully informed about the nature of TSCC and why it is indeed a cult.

If so, maybe the Morg has instructed followers to infiltrate heathen denominations and look for new targets. The pews are white and ready to harvest.

In Georgia. They specifically said they took it from the LDS hymn book. Don't know who would have one.

I read it somewhere that the original reason Southern Baptists had held their 1999 convention in SLC was that they wanted to get back at the Morg for stealing and converting their flock, and that the real reason the temple near Atlanta was built was just to lure in more suckers and get baptized. Is TSCC still doing that today in Georgia, but using more nefarious means?

Well, again the church is no more viable here than anywhere. But in places like Atlanta, Dallas, Houston, etc., offer a lot of jobs and careers. Mormons flock there as much as any others, giving a sort of false impression of success. If you go to a Mormon church on Sunday in any one of those areas, you might think that the Mormons are doing great stuff, but it's only a reflection of local dynamics.

In my area there is a large military presence, hence lots of Mormons. I have a McChapel only a mile away from me, and the parking lot is packed during the sessions for both wards. Mormons and many others believe that the work must really be taking off. But DW says the missionaries have little to do and convert only the feeble-minded and the under-educated, who then become terrible burdens for the bishop and RS president, and that the normal attendees all come from other parts of the US for jobs and military.

The local ministers need not worry. Ain't nobody stealing nuffin'.

I'd also feel strange singing a mormon hymn about honesty in a UU Church. Nothing wrong with the hymn, however, just my exmo perspective on it.

Just read the lyrics to 'O, Say, What is Truth?' and in the context of what we talk about quite frequently on RfM...it's kinda funny.

Not funny funny, sad funny.

I just love the hymn about tactical thermonuclear war, "Onward Crispy Soldiers"!

This reminds me: I really must run out and pick up a couple more cases of Tang, just to be on the safe side...

I gave a sermon at a UU church once - not defending Mormonism, but still encouraging respect and sympathy for individual Mormon people. In honor of the fact that a lot of exMo's exist "under cover", still active and pretending to believe. They need sympathy and help on the way out, not mocking for ever having been TBMs in the first place. (My experience is that UUs aren't always very good at the not-mocking part, in spite of their expressions of tolerance.)

My inspiration to give the sermon, in fact was in two parts: (a.) I work for Marriott, which is not a Mormon company in spite of the common rumors, and (b.) I married an RLDS woman who shares almost nothing of TSCC theology, yet still gets associated (read: blamed) for it in the UU church.

The more Unitarians can pull back from the condemnation the better, I think. Or at least learn to place it correctly.

Interesting; thanks for the comment. This is good advice for us all, regardless of our current flavor of spirituality. At the least it's good advice for me.

UU_Nevermo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
(My experience is that UUs aren't
> always very good at the not-mocking part, in spite
> of their expressions of tolerance.)
>
> My inspiration to give the sermon, in fact was in
> two parts: (a.) I work for Marriott, which is not
> a Mormon company in spite of the common rumors,
> and (b.) I married an RLDS woman who shares almost
> nothing of TSCC theology, yet still gets
> associated (read: blamed) for it in the UU
> church.
>
> The more Unitarians can pull back from the
> condemnation the better, I think. Or at least
> learn to place it correctly.

I'm not in touch with Unitarians much these days. But my impression is that they're overtly tolerant, but covertly elitist, very proud of the fact that they aren't "beholding to creeds."

So, if whatever you believe is true, then I guess all beliefs are true. Hmmm...

Unitarians "borrow" hymns and liturgy elements from many other religions. It's part of their pantheistic approach, showing that they are tolerant and all-inclusive.

Of course, they often change the words to make them non-sexist or otherwise inoffensive; and then a few years later have to change them again when their perspective shifts. My favorite so far is a passage attributed to Jesus: "...if anyone would follow me, let them deny themselves..."

They use many hymns and responsive readings I remember from my Presbyterian childhood, most of them similarly modified.

Political correctness above all.

Come on cludgie I came to read about a fight, where's the honesty?

Ha! Made you look!

Ha you know what? Well played, well played.

I'd have to agree with you on that. Speaking as a person who's been a UU my entire adult life (and unofficially long before that.)

Something like 80-90% of UUs are adult converts - a common story is that a lot of us "escaped" from whatever fundamentalist or authoritarian religion we grew up in. (In my congregation we're mostly ex-Catholic, but there are a couple of ex-Mormons as well, plus a smattering of others.) I've heard people literally expressing pride in the fact that we have the most college degrees per capita (including graduate degrees) among all religious denominations.

One of the seven Unitarian principles is that we support and value the worth of all persons, but (covertly) I think a person has greater worth in the Unitarian church, the more letters they can spell after their name.

It got so bad that one friend of mine actually told me she felt like a second-class Unitarian because she never went to college at all. The only reason she stayed was to keep close to her Unitarian parents.

Needs their heads examined.