Recovery Board  : RfM
Recovery from Mormonism (RfM) discussion forum. 
Go to Topic: PreviousNext
Go to: Forum ListMessage ListNew TopicSearchLog In
Posted by: Exmosis ( )
Date: April 17, 2017 05:18AM

A friend who was raised a 7th Day Adventist shared her story. it was very enlightening. So many similarities to Mormonism in the sense that cults or organizations that have cult characteristics have lots of similar aspects to how they entrap people.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: bohica ( )
Date: April 17, 2017 09:59AM

Yes, I remember lurking on some JW recovery group sites and being very surprised at the similarities. Probably shouldn't have been. A cult is a cult is a cult. Just a matter of degree. For that matter, reading about the Warren Jeff's fundamentalist group was equally eye-opening. Shades of grey...

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Redneck Wonderland ( )
Date: April 17, 2017 10:08AM

There are alot of similarities.

SDA, JW, Mormon, all 3 Cults practicing the Occult.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: badassadam ( )
Date: April 18, 2017 03:15PM

What does the occult mean exactly?

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: April 19, 2017 06:17AM

The priesthood is a kind of folk magic. Blessings are the spells. Folk magic was a big thing back in Joe's day. It's an interesting subject.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: badassadam ( )
Date: April 19, 2017 05:02PM

Very interesting indeed.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: EssexExMo ( )
Date: April 19, 2017 06:33AM

badassadam Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What does the occult mean exactly?

Hidden - it's from the latin base 'celare' and is related to words like Occlude and also cellar


Cult is from a different base entirely and is not related.
Cult is from the latin 'colere'
It's also the base for words like Culture and cultivate,

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Tori ( )
Date: April 19, 2017 05:46AM

My new rule for cult spotting is 'is there an internet forum to help people recover from involvement with this group?'.Followed by, 'do they ever have to argue that they're not a cult?'. Seems an accurate test for me. I don't think anyone ever had a 'recovery from the Methodists' group nor did I ever hear an Episcopalian say 'people say we're a cult but it's simply not true.'
Tori

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Exmosis ( )
Date: April 19, 2017 08:33AM

Excellent way of putting it, Tori!

There was a kind of a painful wistfulness in this person's trying to express how she was very inspired on the one hand by one of her SDA mentors and yet constant looming depression, trying to do all the cult busy work etc.

I recognized the feelings immediately, and wanted to shout: Cult, cult, cult! but instead, just sent her a few links in which others have studied and written about it.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: boilerluv ( )
Date: April 19, 2017 07:09PM

Don't forget the Scientologists. Just because they have good looking movie stars as members doesn't mean they're an okay group. Read Leah Remini's "Troublemaker," if you want the lowdown on this cult. Wow--fascinating reading! There are others (the Duggars' "Quiverfull" church comes to mind), but I think the three primary cults in this country are the Mormons, the JWs and the Scientologists. They have a lot in common. I would include the FLDS, which is evil to the core, but I don't think they have as many members as the other three; however, they are so hidden and secretive that I could be wrong about that.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: April 19, 2017 08:05PM

I know it's not a popular opinion among the religious here, but...

All religions are cults. By definition and in practice.

Some are more destructive/obsessive than others (like mormons).
But it's a difference in degree only.

My $.02 :)

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Exmosis ( )
Date: April 20, 2017 10:29AM

All churches have their own rituals, etc but the newer ones are the ones that to me have more cult-like behavior.The ones that I call cults are the ones that demand your time and money, excessive amounts of it that is, and where voluntary attendance and participation is not encouraged, and people's lives aren't monitored in various ways. In that sense, I don't think that most truly mainstream churches are cults. Businesses, yes, but not cults.

But the JW, SDA, Scientologists, Mormons, and a few others, they do the above and as such, I define them as cults. You don't hear about people trying to recover from Methodism or Lutheranism, do you. Catholicism - maybe somewhat but for the most part, your day to day involvement and donation is your own personal choice, so for that reason, I don't include them either.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: April 20, 2017 11:35AM

Exmosis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You don't hear about people
> trying to recover from Methodism or Lutheranism,
> do you. Catholicism - maybe somewhat but for the
> most part, your day to day involvement and
> donation is your own personal choice, so for that
> reason, I don't include them either.

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&rlz=1C1CHBF_enUS707US707&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=recovery+from+catholicism

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Justin ( )
Date: April 20, 2017 02:18PM

The reality of Catholicism is that if I quit going to mass nobody would even care. If there is any compulsion in Catholicism it usually comes from the expectations of a person's family rather than the institution itself.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Dave the Atheist ( )
Date: April 20, 2017 11:02AM


Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: caffiend ( )
Date: April 20, 2017 12:50PM

Hie, your concept of cult is a very wide net indeed. If I may restate -- admittedly negatively -- it seems that you reject any belief in God as irrational, and therefore a group that organizes with a belief system is ipsofacto irrational, and hence cultic.

If you check the sites of various anti-cult groups (such as Steve Hassan's freedomofmind.com, you find that the underlying theme is control and undue influence. While acknowledging that people in cults very often claim to participate voluntarily, there are many groups, Christian and otherwise, where people join and participate because of a non-coercive shared belief.

I use an informal checklist to determine the nature and degree of cultic organization. A non-exhaustive list includes:

(Asterisks are used only to indent subcategories.)

*Powerful, charismatic leadership (living or deceased)
****Leadership is accountable only to himself/herself/themselves
****Membership has neither knowledge nor control of finances
****Members compete aggressively for rank and position
****Extreme willingness to dismiss/deny/rationalize sins and shortcomings of the leadership and high-ranking members
*Intensive Community, often manifested as:
*Legalistic oversight of personal life, including:
****apparel
****family relationships, notably
*********sexual and marriage relationships
*********shunning of apostate/non-believing family members
****food and drink
****activity requirements which consume members' time
*Special revelation/writings unique to their group
****belief that they/their founder complete or correct traditional Christianity and/or the Bible. This typically produces:
*********Spiritual elitism (Note "Members compete for position," above)
*A belief that everybody/everything outside their group is evil or lost,
*Esoteric (hidden) beliefs--secret teachings not available to outsiders or even new believers
******Their group (or confession) possesses the only means to Heaven.
*"Spiritualized language" (words unique to their group, and/or special meanings to common words)
*Deceit with people outside the group. This may be:
******Misleading outsiders about the group's true beliefs and practices (note "Esoteric Beliefs," above) and
******Defrauding outsiders financially (since they are "of Satan")

Although not exhaustive, I think this is a good list. The more items a group practices, the more cultic it is. Some features may show up in groups that are not necessarily cultic. It's a matter of number and degree. For example, I do believe that only faith in Christ gains a person the Kingdom of Heaven, and we try to use theological terms precisely, but I think even HieToKolob would be hard-pressed to describe my Baptist church as a cult.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: BYU Boner ( )
Date: April 21, 2017 01:18AM

Howdy Hie! I find sociologists have some pretty observant thoughts on cults. Although there doesn't seem to be a consensus as to what, exactly, constitutes a cult--there are several indicators: charismatic leadership, "us vs them" mentality, mind control, shunning, lack of accountability, etc. Cults are not just confined to religious structures.

On RfM, I casually refer to Mormonism a cult. However, it's probably more sociologically-appropriate to say that it's a cult-like religious organization (due to the sheer amount of adherents).

Personally, Hie, I plan on starting my own cult. I'll ask some folks here to join me. We'll rally 'round the hops. Those who refuse to partake are to be labeled unhoppy wankers. Members must provide me with one bottle from their sixpacks to be in good standing. I, alone, will determine what beer is to be drunk. Those dissenting will have their hops cut off!

Now, Bro, I need a second in command. Give up your integrity Hie; it's easy! Just come over to the hoppy side! You and me, hops a plenty! And ambers, pales, malts, Belgium's, Guinness's. De la bier, s'il vous plait! HA, I almost gotcha! The Hoppy Boner.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: eternal1 ( )
Date: April 20, 2017 01:24PM

Kinda depends on how you want to define it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult

“The term cult usually refers to a social group defined by their religious, spiritual, or philosophical beliefs, or common interest in a particular personality, object or goal. The term itself is controversial and has divergent definitions in popular culture and in academia and has been an ongoing source of contention among scholars across several fields of study.”

“English-speakers originally used the word "cult" not to describe a group of religionists, but to refer to the act of worship or to religious ceremony. The English term originated in the early 17th century, borrowed via the French culte, from Latin cultus (worship). The French word, in turn, derived from the Latin adjective cultus (inhabited, cultivated, worshiped), based on the verb colere (to care, to cultivate). The word "culture" also derives from the Latin words cultura and cultus; "culture" in general terms refers to the customary beliefs, social forms and material traits of a religious or social group.

While the literal original sense of the word in English remains in use, a derived sense of "excessive devotion" arose in the 19th century. The terms cult and cultist came into use in medical literature in the United States in the 1930s for what would now be termed "faith healing", especially as practised in the US Holiness movement. This usage experienced a surge of popularity at the time, and extended to other forms of alternative medicine as well. In the English-speaking world the word "cult" often carries derogatory connotations.

Most sociologists and scholars of religion began to reject the word "cult" altogether because of its negative connotations in mass culture. Some began to advocate the use of new terms like "new religious movement", "alternative religion" or "novel religion" to describe most of the groups that had come to be referred to as "cults", yet none of these terms have had much success in popular culture or in the media. Other scholars have pushed to redeem the word "cult" as one fit for neutral academic discourse.”

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Cpete ( )
Date: April 20, 2017 02:13PM

Religions are mainstream cults.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: praydude ( )
Date: April 20, 2017 03:11PM

Cult + Time = Religion

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: nevermo4 ( )
Date: April 20, 2017 03:41PM

There are two cults that I can think of,which would be more prevalent in my neck of the woods.

One is Islam.I can recall,while on holidays a few years back,visiting the grand mosque in Kuala Lumpur. While there a worker approached myself and my friend.He explained how although we were allowed outside the mosque in certain areas,we couldn't actually go in as that was for members only.He said that it's not that they didn't want us inside or that there would be anything wrong with it!We also had to cover up.


He also told us that the Koran 'is true' as poor Muhammad was only a 14 year old illiterate boy when he scribed it.

Even as a Never Mormon the parallels between the cults struck me.


Have you ever heard of the Catholic off-shoot,the Palmarians?A crazy group I saw a documentary on once and have heard of people being recruited to join in Spain.

Options: ReplyQuote
Go to Topic: PreviousNext
Go to: Forum ListMessage ListNew TopicSearchLog In


Screen Name: 
Your Email (optional): 
Subject: 
Spam prevention:
Please, enter the code that you see below in the input field. This is for blocking bots that try to post this form automatically.
 **      **  ********    ******   **    **   ******  
 **  **  **  **     **  **    **   **  **   **    ** 
 **  **  **  **     **  **          ****    **       
 **  **  **  ********   **           **     **       
 **  **  **  **         **           **     **       
 **  **  **  **         **    **     **     **    ** 
  ***  ***   **          ******      **      ******