I had my faith crisis recently and felt like I needed to be honest about it to friends and family.

It's been about 4 months.

I've realized who my very real friends were as a result and they are few and far between.

Everyone else keeps their distance.

One of my few friends came out about her non-belief but hasn't told anyone else including her husband.

She told me that part of the reason she hasn't followed my lead is because of the gossip that made it's way around about me after I spilled the beans.

She claims that word around the church is that I am having emotional or mental problems and that is why I stopped going to church.

I read somewhere that the true sign of a cult is that it won't let you leave it with your dignity intact.

Maybe that's true.

Am very sad and frustrated.

Yep, that's the pattern.
Either you're not going because you want to "sin" (you know, awful things like [gasp] have a cup of coffee!), or you're having "mental problems."

They never whisper among themselves that you've stopped going because you found some information showing the church's truth claims false. No, that's just not possible!

You're not alone, michelle. Most of us here have been there.
And your observation is spot-on.

I can't relieve your sadness or frustration...I can only commiserate, and let you know that when you're fully out, and find friends who don't care if you believe in the church or not, it gets better :)

Hang in there.

Things probably would have gone better if you had just told them you had the Ebola virus instead of the truth. :)

" . . .the true sign of a cult is that it won't let you leave it with your dignity intact." Yup. No maybe about it.

Their only way for Mormons to protect their own fragile self esteem--dignity, is to attack yours. They blow your candle out so that their dim flame seems important and bright in comparison.

As much as it hurt, I was glad to find out who my real friends were. Don't waste time trying to convince these ex-friends and shunning family that you really aren't having emotional and mental problems. Their verdict is already in and you have been sentenced---probably for life.

Good luck with your new life. Everything in mine has been continually better since getting the hell out of that cult. My life began the last time I walked out of the ward house.

Done & Done Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Things probably would have gone better if you had
> just told them you had the Ebola virus instead of
> the truth. :)
>
> " . . .the true sign of a cult is that it won't
> let you leave it with your dignity intact." Yup.
> No maybe about it.
>
> Their only way for Mormons to protect their own
> fragile self esteem--dignity, is to attack yours.
> They blow your candle out so that their dim flame
> seems important and bright in comparison.
>
> As much as it hurt, I was glad to find out who my
> real friends were. Don't waste time trying to
> convince these ex-friends and shunning family that
> you really aren't having emotional and mental
> problems. Their verdict is already in and you
> have been sentenced---probably for life.
>
> Good luck with your new life. Everything in mine
> has been continually better since getting the hell
> out of that cult. My life began the last time I
> walked out of the ward house.

Yes, definitely don't waste time trying to convince them you are not mentally ill i can attest to that and need to take that to heart. I have been trying to convince my whole family i am not nuts for more than a decade at least. It is a waste of energy and time. No accomplishment will convince them that you are on their level or their sanity.

Since Mormonism is the One True Church, the sole repository of Authentic Christianity, the keepers of the Plan of Happiness, and guardians of the Eternal Family, there can be no legitimate reason for leaving. Ergo those who leave must be unbalanced.


You wouldn't think an adult could nurture the above nonsense in his own skull - but many Mormonss do.

if a mormon admits a testimony that mormon is also admitting that all apostates are defective as the one true church takes that postition.

"Mormonism is the One True Church, the sole repository of Authentic Christianity, the keepers of the Plan of Happiness, and guardians of the Eternal Family"

That statement is so funny and so true. It's perfect self-parody.
It's why Book of Mormon, the Musical was so damn funny. When you're self-important and deluded, what could go wrong?!

Once you realize how silly a group-think that persuades people they've got super-powers really is, you won't feel sorry for yourself that they're kicking you out to keep their delusion pure. Instead, you'll think, "how do help my friends and family see the truth before they go over the falls in a rowboat?"

I am so, so sorry. I too know this pain, having been shunned by my community and abandoned by family.
Even my own parents (!?))aligned with my abusive upstanding priesthood-weilding. spouse...for a while.
They didn't understand what was happening, having no frame of reference, and neither did I.
I only knew I was saving my own Life.
I can now see that the members need scapegoats upon which to prop their teetering shelves.
I have painfully lost the unloseable, my Family....ironically, at the hands of an organization which claims to be 'All About' that.
On the positive side, I am gaining a life rich with REAL experience, and a new level of authenticity and healing, even with my parents (who were doing the best they could with what they knew.)
After escaping the cult's clutching tendrils, a TBM faux-friend offered to me a kind of (envious?) Attagrrrl, seemingly in admiration for what she and our other sisters could not do.
This gives me compassion for those yet ensnared and a level of respect for my self that had not formerly been present.
Stay true to YOUR path;
It is the only right one for YOU.

I'm terribly sorry, Michelle. Unfortunately, it's not at all unusual for Mormons to resort to name calling (i.e. sinner or mentally ill) when someone leaves the church. It's mean and nasty, but it's what they do. Keep an eye out for new friends who won't care about your religion. With one of my best friends, it was a good two years before we even got around to discussing religion. A true friend won't take it personally if you don't believe the same way she does.

Mormonism's cultyness includes having all your "friends" be
Mormons. Of course, they're not really YOUR friends, they're
minions of the cult who "befriend" you only because you are also
one of them.

So when you leave the cult, they stop being your friends. Also,
since you've been in the cult you've cultivated very few
friendships outside the cult. So when you leave you find
yourself friendless.

Yes this is what they do. They treat you like a mental patient. Hell they made me think i was crazy for at least a decade. That is how effective it was. These days i feel like i am more normal than they are.

I also just recently discovered lots of troubling facts about the mormon church and had confronted the missionaries about it. They admitted the facts but tried to rationalize! I am literally mentally ill of major depression because of that discovery and had tried to poison myself to death but were unsucessful because of the emotional burdens it had brought to me by knowing that I have been a long time victim of a fraud.

I do not care now what would other people might say or think about me. My only concern now is to transition back into a normal way of living. I know it is painful but I believe we can make it. We know who we are and that's what matters. Good luck and Take care. We have friends here.

Hi Michelle,

My wife and our four daughters left Jehovah's Witnesses ten years ago. Our experience mirrors yours. As soon as it became obvious we could not be convinced to return to "the truth" (what JWs so often call their faith), folks, even close friends, began to shun. When we openly celebrated Christmas two years after leaving, then the elders[1] took action[2], and, against my wishes announced my name at the Kingdom Hall. This triggered an official shunning response that unfortunately has lasted all these years. In contrast some family have decided some limited contact may be okay. Because official action was taken only against me and not my wife or baptized daughters, some likely feel they are obligated to shun just me.

Since there is no valid reason to leave a true faith like the Mormons or JWs, those who remain, must concoct some rational to explain the departure. Secret sin, mental problems, being seduced by the world or apostates are all on the list of possible go-to explanations.

The problem is the items in this list are not entirely wrong. To consume coffee or alcohol is a sin by Mormon standards, as is celebration of Christmas by JWs. Since many Ex-Mormons and Ex-JWs do these things, well... It is true that Ex-Mormons and Ex-JWs often begin to believe "worldly" things like the theory of evolution and most obviously and that Mormons and JWs are merely a religion like many others. And apostate simply means "stand away from" and by definition JWs and Mormons are apostate in regards to nominal Christianity. Ex-JWs and Ex-Mormons are likewise standing apart from their former faith.

But... the degree of truth in this list, doesn't really function that way the believer thinks. That is, it doesn't in anyway prove there are no valid reasons for leaving these faiths.

Perhaps most insidious is the mental health reference. Who really would believe that it is mentally healthy to participate in a faith one does not believe, even sharing testimony and trying to convince others it is the truth? Is it mentally healthy to have religious leaders suggest that ones own thinking is not to be trusted (Prov 3:5)? However, leaving such a faith is not a simple thing mentally either. When I left the JWs after a life time of involvement I did feel like I was going crazy. I took up running and that helped. At six months I got up enough courage to meet Ex-JWs face-to-face and that helped. My confidence in the choice to leave steadily increased, but it takes time to process all this stuff.

I remain so impressed by folks who have the courage to leave such faiths. In regards to those who remain, all we can do is keep the door open. The good news in our case is some key family members have accepted us in our outside-the-faith state and after 10 years we have been surprised by a few people who have reached out to us after leaving themselves.

Take care,
-Randy
[1] "elder" = JW religious leader, male, usually older than 25. Only men recommended and approved by the hierarchy have this position. Has the authority to teach and judge in the congregation.
[2] "action" = Simple announcement at the Kingdom Hall, "So-and-so is no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses." Referred to as "disfellowshipping." Implies the subject is an unrepentant sinner who is the moral equivalent of the sexual deviant mentioned in 1 Cor 5.

I would like to point out that "dignity" is not a mormon possession.

If a group of scoundrels, say the Joe Smith gang, came along today, and tried to trash your good name because you didn't believe he could "read" a rock in a hat, would you be concerned that their claim that you have emotional or mental problems carried any weight?

You are shedding deluded people. You may love them, but most of them have also been deluded into agreeing with the current Joe Smith gang that to be "worthy" of their love, one must believe that Joe Smith could read a rock in a hat.

I just think it's important to examine the source of one's dignity. It may have once been LDS, but we now know that to be a disreputable institution. We know the believers of the Joe Smith stories hold many, many disreputable beliefs.

They do not have the bearing or respect of reputable people to issue statements regarding non-believers' dignity.

If a pig came along, and told me that I was crazy to think that a sty was a smelly crap hole, and that any pig who didn't want to dwell in his crap hole must be out of his or her mind, I wouldn't argue with the pig. I might feel sorry for the pig, or roll my eyes and walk away, but I would not consider the pig to have the necessary elements to judge my mental or emotional status. I would think that the pig has never smelled fresh air, or rooted in grassy fields.

If mormons want to dwell in a smelly crap hole and breathe those vapors, testify to how good they smell, while eating the slop that is thrown into their troughs, I place little value on any opinion of me that they might have. I can love them, and have no requirement that they love me back. I put up with the smell because I love them, I gag watching them eat their slop, but those are choices I make.

No believing mormon can define or address the dignity of a non-believer. They would claim that the reverse statement is the only "truth." I will not argue with them on this; I can only hope they will eventually see me in fresh air and grassy fields, and wonder what it's like.

" . . .never smelled fresh air, or rooted in grassy fields."

Best analogy ever. You wrote one phrase that gave me some peace as I wrestle constantly about why I even bother with the TBM family--which I do:

"I put up with the smell because I love them, I gag watching them eat their slop, but those are choices I make."

That really hit home. I don't like being around them much and it is hard to constantly be looked down on because they think I have "lost my way," but for some reason I still care deeply about my family. Still, it's hard to have a pig in a poke look at you like your are the one who smells.

What bothers me the most though, is that some of my family have smelled the fresh air, walked through the grassy fields and still can't get back in the slop fast enough.

But continue the analogy of the pig. Why is the pig in a sh*thole? Because the pig's penned in there. It didn't choose it. If the fence had a gap, all the pigs would leave. If slop were the only food, they'd have to come back to eat.

What keeps Mormons in the pen? What's the slop? Erroneous beliefs.

Here's another analogy. Say you had six kids. Two of them always folded their socks, made their beds, and ate their vegetables. Say because of this, these two kids were really proud of themselves and formed a club where they excluded, shunned, looked down on, and behaved like a-holes to your other four kids just because they did these three "good" things and the other kids didn't. As a parent of all six kids, would you join with the two against the four, or would you concern yourself that the two had lost all perspective on their "goodness?" You'd try to get the two kids to follow the greater good of humble behavior toward all of their brothers and sisters, who are all equally your kids. You wouldn't support your two kids' "club" at all. Even though, of course, you want all your kids to eat their vegetables. But in the grand scheme of things, it's not that important compared with other more important stuff.

The penned pigs are like these two kids. They're so imbued with their self-love, they can't see that their Heavenly Father is very concerned. It's sad to be the other four kids, getting kicked around by the two. And that's what's bothering dad--the suffering of the four. The arrogance of the two is it's own reward--dad doesn't love them more for it. That's the whole message of the prodigal son story.

The brainwashing and indoctrination is as strong or stronger than any pen. I like your point. Reminds me of another story someone posted here about how Baby Elephants are chained up to a stake to keep them in place. As they become adults they could easily pull the stake up, but they don't, because they have accepted that they can't.

I guess there are so many instance like that to relate the indoctrination of Mormonism to. Makes me feel so happy for all of us that somehow we not only saw the lie, but found the strength to "get the hell out of Dodge."

I like your analogy of the six kids very much. Another great slant!

That’s why it’s called a club. It’s what they beat you with.

You have often comforted me, Done & Done. :)


"What bothers me the most though, is that some of my family have smelled the fresh air, walked through the grassy fields and still can't get back in the slop fast enough."


You bring up a very good point. Maybe it's in the difference of the words "rooting," and "walking."

A pig with a ring its snout will not root, because it is too painful, one of the main purposes of the ring.

Digging for and feasting on truth - the mormon snout ring would need to removed, and that is very painful for both pigs and mormons. Even after the ring is removed, some pigs experience enough pain that they are too afraid to root, very protective and defensive about their snouts. Most will eventually root, but some never will, even though it is what pigs are born to do. They have been altered and damaged in their most sensitive part.

For humans, the most sensitive part would be their spirits (souls).

Heartbreaking, but the fresh air and walking grassy fields might be a greater source of fear and pain, to be there, and too afraid to root. They don't need to root in a sty; they are fed, and will eat what they are fed.

Those of us who have removed the ring bear the scars, and rooted in the fields, I think we would fight to the death to prevent another ring. We are rooting this very moment.

Warm loving hugs, thinking of you.

My gosh you know a lot about pigs, Non-believer! Hahaha. Love your further analogy. I was raised on a farm. We didn't have pigs but our neighbors did and never saw them out of the pen. So they didn't need the rings I guess and I never knew that about them. Love this bit to add to the analogy.

The rings, the indoctrination and brainwashing run deep. So many I read here are indeed struggling with fear that the ring in the nose left them with even though it has been removed. What I love is reading their stories month after month and being happy for the ones who are ready to explore--scars, bad memories, and all and we can "root" for them!

Your post made me very happy today. Thank you.

Quote - "I would like to point out that "dignity" is not a mormon possession.

If a group of scoundrels, say the Joe Smith gang, came along today, and tried to trash your good name because you didn't believe he could "read" a rock in a hat, would you be concerned that their claim that you have emotional or mental problems carried any weight?

You are shedding deluded people. You may love them, but most of them have also been deluded into agreeing with the current Joe Smith gang that to be "worthy" of their love, one must believe that Joe Smith could read a rock in a hat."

Personally I carry a lot of guilt and self-doubt because I could not discriminate between what was resonable or not. I just wanted to belong so I said Yes, yes, yes time after time. I could not use my brain and I felt a deep urge to lie to myself infront of others so that they would not shun me. My best years in life gone to waste.

This really is a great post, thank you for it. Especially good for the OP was your analogy:

"If a pig came along, and told me that I was crazy to think that a sty was a smelly crap hole, and that any pig who didn't want to dwell in his crap hole must be out of his or her mind, I wouldn't argue with the pig. I might feel sorry for the pig, or roll my eyes and walk away, but I would not consider the pig to have the necessary elements to judge my mental or emotional status. I would think that the pig has never smelled fresh air, or rooted in grassy fields."

The longer you are out (getting close to 2 decades for me), the more pathetic it is that these people try to judge you by the belief that their smelly pig sty is wonderful. They don't realize that they seem no different to us than a fundamentalist mormon would look to them. And the thing I hate the most is the pathetic part of me that once fell for it too and hated people trying to point out to me how ridiculous and stupid it was. That was before the vast amount of facts that are available to anyone now.

There are plenty who believe it and are fine with it and don't want to look at any info that is not sanctioned by their thought police. Fine. There are plenty who know it's not what it claims to be but want to stay in for family and social reasons. Even finer. But finding out who your real friends are is a gift you've been given (they're the ones willing to let you live in a clean sty if it makes you happy). When you are being told there is something wrong with YOU, just consider the source. They do NOT have the necessary elements to judge your mental or emotional status. They do not know what fresh air smells like and you can't convince them that it's wonderful.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/07/2018 02:11PM by NormaRae.

That's why those who leave need a place like RfM to talk about it.

I asked the Uppidy-Upper Super PH holders to use their (claimed) powers to help heal a family torn apart by Greed, Hate, & Lies of a (again, claimed) TBM; NOTHING DOING !!!!

At the core it is just a question about solipsism. The people force you to choose the "right" choice everytime because there is only one choice.

It is like a waterleak.

Drip

drip

drip

KRASCH! All the small drips of "right" choices have finally caused a water damage.

You react and they go completely nuts over your reaction and you are shunned.

They have a bad relation to reality.