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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 11:58AM

In a disaster as a Mormon is it acceptable to have your thoughts and prayers be for the prophets' thoughts and prayers be for the victims of the disaster?

I mean like the saints in Catholicism petitioning more important people to God makes sense.

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Posted by: angela ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 12:09PM

Never heard of that kind of thought about the GA's when I was LDS

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 12:16PM

Me neither. I was just wondering. I have Catholic friends who like take great pains to point out that they don't pray to their saints. They pray in some way where they are talking to the saint but it is for the saint to pray for them or others.

Just curious if you could get away with this with living "saints."



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2018 12:17PM by Elder Berry.

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Posted by: angela ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 03:28PM

Elder Berry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Me neither. I was just wondering. I have Catholic
> friends who like take great pains to point out
> that they don't pray to their saints. They pray in
> some way where they are talking to the saint but
> it is for the saint to pray for them or others.
>
> Just curious if you could get away with this with
> living "saints."


For Catholics, the idea of of asking the saints to intercede (pray for any particular intention) is no different than the idea of asking your living friends, family, etc. to pray for them.

Exact same principle, whether the person is living or the person is dead.

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Posted by: cl2 ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 12:31PM

Obviously blessings can be seen that way or when they ask for higher leaders to pray for them. When my cousin was dying of cancer, her father was a SP and they had the GAs fasting and praying for her. She died.

I can't remember the exact situations and I'm sure someone else can, but my HTs used to think that if they prayed at my house, that the spirit would be in my house. I'm like, "What the F?" I never felt that I had to petition God through someone else. I felt that my petition should be as good as anyone else's. I only bought into blessings ONCE in my life and that was after I found out he was gay. I've talked about it before. I asked the bishop 3 times for blessings. I'd fast and pray, starve to death, and finally ask again and I'd get NOTHING. STUPOR OF THOUGHT. I walked away EMPTY, feeling totally empty.

My dad didn't put any what into blessings for his kids. Somehow we all survived including our disabled brother, who had many accidents in his life. He got hit by a truck on his bike when he was 5. He actually just posted on fb the other day that he ran into one of the older boys he was riding bikes with that night and the guy came up and talked to him. My brother is 52 and this kid still remembers him.

I was raised to believe that I could petition God for anything I chose to. Just like if I want to pray for the victims of this shooting, I can do it myself. I don't have to think the GAs have any more power than I do or the saints. My mom is a saint. I'm sure she has it covered.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2018 12:32PM by cl2.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 12:49PM

cl2 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I was raised to believe that I could petition God
> for anything I chose to. Just like if I want to
> pray for the victims of this shooting, I can do it
> myself.

So what is the point of a prophet? Maybe if the prophet prayed and thought about gun violence he could convince God to soften the hearts of those out to hurt others for Mormons?

The whole idea of The Priesthood I thought was to have some kind of more ability to call upon God's power? Why not send "thoughts and prayers" to Mormon leaders every time something bad happens?

Oh, wait, they are only praying as men when they think and pray for the victims of disasters, right?

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Posted by: cl2 ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 12:52PM

And Catholics. Oh my. I just saw another show about a catholic priest who raped and killed a young woman 57 years ago. She went to confession and he took her to the rectory and raped her. They finally got justice and put him prison.

There is something on Netflix and I can't remember what it is--The Keepers. I think that is it. Wow!

We put faith in these damn people. Look where it got us.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 01:21PM

cl2 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We put faith in these damn people. Look where it
> got us.

It is a problem of scale. We are all humans with differing abilities and inclinations, emotions and aggressiveness, hopes and dreams and yet we assume that positions in society mean anything. If a person will affect my life in the mass of millions of other people, we are all at the mercy of a single personality.

It doesn't feel right, but modernity is built on something like political policing and moral policing by individuals. We put our faith in their offices and suffer the consequences of their personalities and individuality.

In my opinion, humans seem to be intrinsic opportunists. I read about that poor woman in the 60s and her rape and murder. It is such and abuse of a position that it is monstrous. But it is the position which provided the opportunity. I think we humans ought to audit the authoritarians in our societies and place major checks and balances on them. This includes religion because it has always been tied to power over people. To guarantee individuals religious freedom is good in my opinion. To guarantee fake corporate entities the same right is a monstrous idea. Let alone allowing their human individual representatives free reign to abuse other people.

Tax religion. Audit all powers of one person over another. See coercion for what it is and stop blaming victims so much.

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Posted by: Jonny the Smoke ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 03:00PM

>> Why not send "thoughts and prayers" to Mormon leaders every time something bad happens? <<

Well, since the church has a policy of non-disclosure and a complete lack of transparency, you could send all the thoughts and prayers you have, but you'll never know what they actually did with them.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 06:13PM

I guess you could look for names in the articles you read about the tragedy and put those names in the temple prayer box?

My mother has put my name in for years and since my brother confessed his unbelief to her his name too. Just found that out Sunday.

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Posted by: cl2 ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 06:23PM


Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/27/2018 06:23PM by cl2.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: March 01, 2018 12:34PM

I'm sorry.

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Posted by: Hockeyrat ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 04:11PM

Does anyone know about the true voodoo and Santeria religions?
( Not the Hollywood versions)
They suppose to be related to Catholicism. Can’t remember if they pray to the saints directly or not. They have those spirits called Orishas or something,don’t know if they’re separated from the saints or just aspects of saints. It’s fascinating too, because I never heard of it in a good light before and related to the saints if the Catholic Church

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Posted by: moremany ( )
Date: February 27, 2018 09:54PM

I have my own thoughts, and prayers, disaster or not, religion or not.

M@t

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: February 28, 2018 10:42AM

My thoughts and prayers are many times for the victims of religion.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-42328428

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