if it's the church of Jesus Christ? Shouldn't it be called the Church of Heavenly Father, since they give very little relevance to the Anointed One? Quickly muttering his name at the end of a prayer isn't bestowing much in the way of honor or acknowledgement. They could drop Jesus out of the way tomorrow and the church would still be the same. H.F. does all the miracles and is the only one they talk to.

Grant Palmer called church leaders out for not letting Jesus matter in what is supposed to be His own church. What did they do? They ex-communicated Grant. They never came up with a good reason for why they threw him out. His mission was to persuade the church to become more Christ centered.

I know that many people here are nonbelievers, but can you see the irony of Jesus being elbowed out of the way in what is proclaimed as his church?

Speaking about "Father" keeps them in a childlike mentality always running to daddy.

It was always a bit convoluted. You pray to daddy god in the name of the son god but one Godhead.

It's even more convoluted thinking about Trinity style OT Daddy avatar and part of himself human Jesus avatar.

A hodgepodge of morphed myth nonsense.

how come not heavenly mother ?

Which one?

God has to have a harem of heavenly mothers up there.

But the mormons won't admit that.

They don't know that they teach it. They don't know that they emphasize it. They haven't heard it discussed for a long time in public discourse. They don't know.

Poor heavenly mother(s).
Thrown under the bus just like Brigham. Except for naming that university after him, I mean :)

Elohim loves my spiritual mommy the best! I know that may hurt a bit, but hey, it's the truth! Would I lie?

Turns out I was praying to the wrong Heavenly Mother. No wonder I was completely ignored.

I am living proof my heavenly mommy gets a dollup of insemination by my ghost daddy.

However, I am not allowed to acknowledge or talk about my heavenly mommy.

slavishly devote your life to until you drop dead.

Meanwhile, LD$, Inc. keeps going and going and leeching off its victims...

Seems like I always hear: "the savior this" and "the savior that." Isn't that a reference to Christ?

I don't give a rats ass if TBM's say Jesus or Heavenly Father. The whole morg is made up and fake so it doesn't really matter.

How do Mormons typically reference "Heavenly Father?"

A) "Heavenly Father expects you to tithe faithfully."
B) "Our Heavenly Father expects you to tithe faithfully."
C) "Your Heavenly Father expects you to tithe faithfully."

For example, as a Protestant, I'm more likely to say,"Our Father in Heaven..." I do hear "Heavenly Father" in my church, but only occasionally.

I don't sense the LDS "Heavenly Father" as part of a love relationship much.

caffiend Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't sense the LDS "Heavenly Father" as part of
> a love relationship much.

Hmm, I'm not sure.
My TBM stepfather has a habit of saying "Heavenly Father" about 200 times a day. And always using the idea that "Heavenly Father" either told him what to do, or approves of what he's doing. As far as he's concerned, "Heavenly Father" spends all day every day talking to him, letting him know how special and blessed he is, and how everything he does is just what loving "Heavenly Father" wants him to do.

It gets annoying after the first time. Then it goes on ALL DAY LONG. Ugh.

Your father seemed to reference "Heavenly Father" as:

1) More of a taskmaster than a loving Being, and
2) Without personal pronounts, "our," "Dear," "your," etc. Like he failed to notice that the Lord's Prayer begins, "OUR Father..." Attributes of "love," minus the affection.

Stepfather, please. That man is not my father.

Perhaps I didn't explain it well enough. He doesn't consider his imagined "Heavenly Father" a taskmaster. He considers it his own personal, loving father who guides him and gives him approval, which makes him all warm and fuzzy, and increases his love for his imagined "Heavenly Father" even more. Sort of a self-reinforcing delusion.

To him it's all about "love." Heavenly Father loves us so much that he personally guides us and lets us know when we're doing what he wants. Even though what he thinks is what "Heavenly Father" wants turns out to be, quite often, bigoted and discriminatory and authoritative and wacky and irrational and...well...stupid. But it's all about love.

I don't mind getting into a religious dispute with you, Hie, but I do tread cautiously when it involves something so personal as family, but your stepfather's "heavenly father" strikes me as a very bad counterfeit of the God of Love. More like a supernatural validator of what your stepfather wanted to do, anyway.

Crazyhorse (below):

Next time, try chanting "Hare Kirshna, hare Kirshna. hare hare..." Dancing, beating drums and cymbals, and bells on your fingers and toes enhance the effect.

caffiend Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't mind getting into a religious dispute with
> you, Hie, but I do tread cautiously when it
> involves something so personal as family, but your
> stepfather's "heavenly father" strikes me as a
> very bad counterfeit of the God of Love. More like
> a supernatural validator of what your stepfather
> wanted to do, anyway.

Oh, I agree completely. And for him...that's that a "God of Love" is. Lots of other mormons have the same concept.

Then again, I consider all "god" concepts to be pretty much the same thing. I know you don't. We can agree to disagree on that, right? :)

My TBM dad did the same. Regularly, at least when talking to me, his apostate son, he would say things like...."blah, blah, blah, and the lord told me...." or "...and the lord said..."

One day when he said it, I said "OK, so when 'the lord told you' what happened? Did you hear a voice? See an image? how did the lord tell you? Explain that to me."

Usual long pause, deer in headlights look, followed by "I felt an impression...."

OK dad, whatever you say.

Yep.
They've just been taught that their "impressions" come from the holiest of ghosts, acting directly on Heavenly Father's behalf.

Instead of the simple fact: it was all in their head. :)

I've heard a lot about heavenly father helping the Mormon soccer mom find her car keys so the kids can get to practice on time. The little girl down the street who asks heavenly father to save her from the sex abuse she's suffering, not so much.

I prayed the hail Mary full of grace have mercy on us sinners when I was sick of missionaries saying you can't pray this way or that way! After I said it i got no that is not a prayer! Mormons are cowards and Muslims pray five times a day!

Heavenly father is a control mechanism they use to suppress you and make you feel less than you really are. It is a form of controlling you.

As a Christian, this is what I noticed after leaving a short while ago. Christ isn't the main god. Christ is just the tool that Mormons wield as they build themselves up to become their own god. The Christ in the Bible is so different because Christians believe He is God and there is one God.
Since Mormons follow three different gods, they can't give their whole heart/might/mind/strength to EACH god. So they pick Heavenly Father as the main god. It's like he's the "head" of their godhead.
Christ, for them, is just one step in a multi-step process to become a god.
Hope this gives something to consider!

Mayrach, I think you hit the nail on the head. The church I attend now certainly acknowledges "God the Father" and says the "Our Father" a lot, but Jesus is the main focus of worship. He wasn't sent to Earth so that we could ignore Him, yet claim that the Church is His. Mormonism is making less sense all the time. The Trinity is making more sense now. For years as a Mormon, I was taught to believe that the mainstream Christian concept of Trinity is absurd. Now the concept of three separate beings composing one God is working for me. Joseph Smith taught Trinity until the Nauvoo period.

In 1982, Bruce R. McConkie taught that it is wrong to have a relationship with Jesus. He wanted the members to keep their distance from Jesus in what was supposed to be his church! I wish that I had left the LDS back then. I was so brainwashed that I would have worshipped pagan pantheons if they had told us to.

The (original) LDS church didn't even have his name in it.

They probably figured they ought to have his name in there, somewhere, since he was in the (mandatory/ obligatory) prayers, albeit at the end (as if it really was 'in his name').

It's always heavenly farter because people are forgetting mother earth. It's a gas!

M@t

Amazing. The LDS have always critcized and denigrated other churches for not have Jesus Christ in their name. What hypocrits.

Caffiend, it certainly is about the Tithing money. I can't imagine Jesus being portrayed as a figure demanding people's tithing. He was all about helping and giving, not stiffing money from the poor and destitute.

Brigid & Mayrach, very good thoughts and thanks for the feedback.

Back to my question, above, it seems that Mormons tend not to put a personal or possessive pronoun before the term "Heavenly Father," i.e., not "my HF...," "your HF...," or "our HF..." Just plain old "Heavenly Father."

Similarly I don't associate Mormons with saying "God," Lord," or "the Lord" all that much. Confirmation or correction, please?

Personally, I think the missing possessives have to do with the emotional and spiritual disconnect from "Heavenly Father" they have due to the nature of how HF is taught. How HF operates, and how his love and approval needs to be earned. They make him out to be a distant god.
Also, it may have something to do with the authoritarian nature of the church. For example, I noticed that any man in a higher level of leadership would always be regarded to as ONLY his title. A stake or mission president is referred to as "President". Bishops are always referred to as "Bishop". Not to mention "Elder". Could the repetition of referring to male leaders as only their title contribute to the habit of only saying "Heavenly father"? Could they parallel Heavenly Father to just another man ruling over them- except he happens to also be their god?

Using Lord and God, from my experience, is too unclear for them. It begs the question: "Which god?" Mormons have 3 gods. If anyone ever did say God or Lord, suddenly it became confusing because you couldn't be sure which God they were talking about.

What's he doing up there and when's he coming back down?

M@t

For God so loved the world that he sent his only begotten son to be tortured and that is why he begot him just so he could show the world how much he loved them by torturing his son and then we could all be grateful for Heavenly Father not doing to us what he has done to so many others who didn't worship him enough.

Jesus was a Prop to Heavenly Father. He is a "has-been" in the Mormon church. Already served his purpose and now all the focus is back on Big Daddy. The curtain came down on the Passion Play.

Heavenly father is hooked on adulation. He needs to be worshipped constantly, idolized, and thanked for things he didn't even do for you. He needs hymns and praise. Every knee needs to bend. Every head must bow. Every tongue better spit out the most sycophantic butt kissing words of praise perpetually if it knows what is good for it.

You think your TBM MIL is trouble? No. She's a piece of cake compared to "Heavenly" Father.

The thing is when men first started making Gods they were scary Gods and so the first order of business was to placate them. Nothing has changed. Jesus is useless because he doesn't really need to be appeased. He is the good cop in the scenario and so, forgettable.

Why so formal with "Father?"

My kids call me "Pops."

Why can't he be called "Heavenly Pops?"

I know you're being sarcastic, Jonny, but you actually make a valid point. Jesus referred to God the Father as "Abba," the equivalent of "Dad" or "Daddy." A sense of personal closeness to God is missing in a lot of church worship and personal spirituality, Mormonism especially.

OK there you are asking for a MORmON explanation on MORmON doctUrine, not saying that you are not entitled to it , However, guess what you are going to get .... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=chkSWt3KiMY

Most Christians are trinitarians. So for them Heavenly Father is Jesus. So it doesn't really matter which name is used, or which aspect of the god is dealt with when attempting to cast spells or do other kinds of religious things.