Badassadam started a thread asking, "Who am I? Who is the real Badassadam?" and I was going to post this in response on that thread.

I found this article so interesting and touches on many of the topics that are discussed on RfM that I thought it deserved its own thread.

Could Multiple Personality Disorder Explain Life, the Universe and Everything?

"There is also compelling clinical data showing that different alters can be concurrently conscious and see themselves as distinct identities. One of us has written an extensive treatment of evidence for this distinctness of identity and the complex forms of interactive memory that accompany it, particularly in those extreme cases of DID that are usually referred to as multiple personality disorder.

The history of this condition dates back to the early 19th century, with a flurry of cases in the 1880s through the 1920s, and again from the 1960s to the late 1990s. The massive literature on the subject confirms the consistent and uncompromising sense of separateness experienced by the alter personalities. It also displays compelling evidence that the human psyche is constantly active in producing personal units of perception and action that might be needed to deal with the challenges of life.

Although we may be at a loss to explain precisely how this creative process occurs (because it unfolds almost totally beyond the reach of self-reflective introspection) the clinical evidence nevertheless forces us to acknowledge something is happening that has important implications for our views about what is and is not possible in nature.

Now, a newly published paper by one of us posits that dissociation can offer a solution to a critical problem in our current understanding of the nature of reality. This requires some background, so bear with us."

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/could-multiple-personality-disorder-explain-life-the-universe-and-everything/

The uncertainty of what is human consciousness (really, the question of, "Who am I?") gives pause to nearly every other field of study or effort to understand the universe around us.

The prophet Doug Adams wrote that it is impossible to know both the Ultimate Question and the Ultimate Answer at the same time. If anyone ever does learn them both, then the Universe disappears and is immediately replaced by one that is even more confusing.

It is possible that this has already happened.

Great. God is a 7 billion person Sybil.

I thought it was an interesting read. Maybe I am one of God’s hallucinations. I suppose “I am a hallucination of God” wouldn’t sound right in Primary.

The question of “where is mind” is far from settled. The evidence surely doesn’t settle it because it’s evaluated by subjective beings. Maybe being objective is beside the point. If you take objectivity out of the picture, Mormonism can work. However, then it becomes a degenerate game because there are no checks against wolves in sheeps clothing. Look at the Q15. My, what sharp teeth you have.

The secular world is coming around. The subjective does have an important role to play in science. And it must, if science is to have real meaning beyond its philosophical beauty.

I mean, it wasn’t science that prevented the world from blowing itself up. That came from subjective beings saying “fuck you” to orders to push all the buttons. If it’s coming down to that, science can do better, and I think it is. The old guard is fortunately dying and life extension tech hasn’t ruined it all.

I know "nothing" about multiple personalities other than watching "Sybil" and reading some of the subject-related magazine articles and books which came out at that time...

...but I do think we are often influenced by more than we imagine is "real."

In some cases which happen fairly often to "just regular people," I think that vivid (whether positive OR negative), spontaneous, feelings can be the result of "lessons" learned in past incarnations--although we may (either "back then," or in the present), have misinterpreted the "lesson"--which can, seemingly "unconsciously," lead us to make unwise decisions in present circumstances.

Could these feelings come from "other personalities" rather than from our own past experiences?

Possibly.

In the next hundred years or so, I foresee further scientific discoveries about the nature of time, and also the psychological and emotional nature of what we perceive as "individuality"...and both of these subjects will be critical in more accurately understanding these kinds of issues.

An interesting aside is the experience of organ transplant recipients. They often develop the same interests as their anonymous donors. It’s like the new organ brings something new to the party, personally wise.

Babyloncansuckit Wrote:
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> An interesting aside is the experience of organ
> transplant recipients. They often develop the same
> interests as their anonymous donors. It’s like
> the new organ brings something new to the party,
> personally wise.

Absolutely true.

Thank you for picking up on this!

Interesting.
Except it's *not* "absolutely true."
In fact, it's a fanciful myth, with no verifiable evidence of any kind to back it up.

Oh, well, it makes a nice "faith-affirming" story, though.

Subjective experiences are intrinsically unverifiable. It’s only when enough people have them that they are generally accepted, in spite of their inability to be repeated on demand. For example, most people dream when they sleep. But you can’t prove it.

You can prove that people dream during sleep. You can also measure when, for various reasons, they fail to dream.

The science is long established.

Right, I also forgot about the latest fMRI stuff. Although the brain scans of subjects on psilocybin are less conclusive.

I think that if you put enough science on it, the soul is scientifically discoverable. When that happens, there will be a huge land rush. Science will do what it’s always done, adapt.

Science and religion are both mellowing together. They only conflict because they want to. I work on the boundary between the two, so I see the psychodynamics at play. All of the ugly parts of human nature come out, as well as the good parts. Mostly ugly. It’s like mixing oil and water. What we should be after is a stable emulsion.

Lot's Wife Wrote:
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> You can prove that people dream during sleep. You
> can also measure when, for various reasons, they
> fail to dream.
>
> The science is long established.

Yep they can tell on a sleep study.

Not sure what the dream sidetrack had to do with the claim that people who have organ transplants start to develop the same interests as their donors, but...ok.

You'll find a few "out there" medical people (and a great many more non-medical people) who think some kind of "cell memory"* goes along with organs and can change people who get the organs. They like to relate faith-affirming (but completely unconfirmed) anecdotes, and *one* "study" (which had 10 subjects, and got 2 "hits" that were entirely subjective) done in Hawaii as "proof."

None of which is, of course, "proof." Or even evidence.

Simply put, like claims of magical crystals healing people by completely unknown and unspecified means, there is no verified evidence of any kind that organ donor recipients take on anything of the personality or interests of their donors.

So, like I said, the claim is not "absolutely true." It's not even sort of true. It's not even a little bit true. It has zero supporting evidence. That's about as far from "absolutely true" as you can get.


* one often-referred to article refers to "cell memory" as "not 100% scientifically validated, but there are some scientists who accept it!"

It's not 1% scientifically validated (not in the sense they're claiming for it). And yes, there are some scientists who accept it, but science doesn't go by who believes something, it goes by what evidence shows.

I don't know where to place this comment in this thread but under Hie seems comfortable. I always pay attention to his comments and always learn a lot when reading them.

I had a lung transplant almost 3 years ago. I received a lot of preparation before and lots of follow up after. Your maintenance Meds, diet and exercise regimens after are lifetime commitments if you want to live. I have been told lots of things by my docs and read a lot about post transplant do's and don'ts but never heard anything about this. For what it's worth...one man's experience...there's nothing to support such an idea in my experience. I'm still the same old guy...except for the experience itself.

If anyone can cite a definitive study...id like to read it. Thanks Hie for letting me piggyback on your comment.

The crystal test is still under way, I have not discounted it totally yet. My room mate says there is a definite difference in my attitude and overall I am more positive than before. As far as anything else like pain reduction I am really not sure. Maybe it's the power of belief and not the object doing it. Sometimes you have to believe in stuff hie, maybe.

Badassadam1 Wrote:
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> The crystal test is still under way, I have not
> discounted it totally yet. My room mate says
> there is a definite difference in my attitude and
> overall I am more positive than before.

But are you having someone substitute fake crystals, without your knowledge, to see if there's any difference?
If not, it's not a "test." :)

> As far as
> anything else like pain reduction I am really not
> sure. Maybe it's the power of belief and not the
> object doing it. Sometimes you have to believe in
> stuff hie, maybe.

No, actually, I don't.
Look, if it works for you, great. You certainly deserve less pain, that's for sure.
But, see, if it is "belief" (placebo effect), then the crystals are irrelevant. It's your brain doing the work. You can work with your brain directly -- doing health-assisting actions like regular exercise (even very light), stretching, quiet time to relax and think and concentrate on pain reduction -- and get at least as much brain-induced pain relief, if not more, than the placebo effect from do-nothing crystals. And no "belief" is involved whatsoever.

Maybe you could test *that* next? :)

Even if transplanted cells had some sort of “memory”, their contribution to the whole would be minimal (it’s a simple matter of ratios). To suggest a new kidney could cause a personality change, or be responsible for suddenly acquired skills or interests seems dubious at best. All other valid arguments against it aside, this would suggest the donor tissue had “superhuman” strength to overcome the vast majority of resident tissues.

Babyloncansuckit Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> An interesting aside is the experience of organ
> transplant recipients. They often develop the same
> interests as their anonymous donors. It’s like
> the new organ brings something new to the party,
> personally wise.


I don't like this either It reminds me of the plot in at least a couple of sitcoms, where a racist is getting a blood transfusion from an African American person, and he objects because he thinks blood from the donar will make him like a stereotypical black person. But, it's in a comedy show as a joke. Hard to believe anyone would really think that way.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/25/2018 10:43AM by Aquarius123.

Douglas Adams, were he alive, would cringe at being called a "prophet."

Always was afraid i had Multiple Personality Disorder because i have never felt like one whole person in a very long time or like my real self. They did say i disassociated a lot back in the day. But it's pretty worrisome if you found out you had multiple personalities that's why i don't want to know. Having more than one person controlling the ship would suck to acknowledge.