OK, for some of you who don't know y I'm on thos board, I am not a member (and never was or will ever be, for sure) and one of my close childhood friends is a convert to the LDS church.

So, my friend is preparing to get her temple recommend. Today she talked to me and our friends (some who r inactive & closeted apostates & a few who have never been Mormons). She learned about garments and dress appearance. So, apparently if she plans on going to the temple, she'll have to wear garments forever after that. I see her love and zealous for her church life, but she shared with us that she would not want to ever wear garments and that it wouldn't allow her to enjoy wearing her strapless maxi and midi dresses or spaghetti tank tops. I don't c anything wrong with her strapless maxi and midi dresses either and she looks nice and presentable in her choice of wardrobes. One of our inactive friends mentioned that she would be required to if she got married, but she just said she'd rather marry someone who wasn't a member and that proxy baptisms and sealings could be done after death anyway.

So my friend is saying she'd rather be a "Jack Mormon" now and have someone do her temple work for her when she's dead because she doesn't want to change her wardrobe. She wants to enjoy the simplest pleasures in life and she gets overheated very easily to the point of near-syncope so her doctors tell her to dress lightly so I suppose garments won't do her any good in hot weather. Anyways, it sounds better than being a full-blown Mormon to me. She's always been a free spirit.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/01/2018 08:59PM by helenm.

Makes sense to me.

I did something similar in my life, and thirty years later, I am still glad I did.

Oh boy. Just wait until she goes for her interviews.
Maybe it is time to tell her what the questions are she will be asked.

She will be required to be interviewed by her bishop and again by a member of the stake presidency. They will ask her these questions. (This is the last list I could find.)


Authorized Church officers conduct worthiness interviews for temple recommends as outlined in the temple recommend book. Church officers make every effort to see that no unworthy person enters the house of the Lord. Temple recommend interviews must be private. They should not be rushed. Interviewers should not add any requirements to those that are outlined in the temple recommend book.

1 Do you have faith in and a testimony of God the Eternal Father, His Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost?

2 Do you have a testimony of the Atonement of Christ and of His role as Savior and Redeemer?

3 Do you have a testimony of the restoration of the gospel in these the latter days?

4 Do you sustain the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as the Prophet, Seer, and Revelator and as the only person on the earth who possesses and is authorized to exercise all priesthood keys? Do you sustain members of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles as prophets, seers, and revelators? Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local authorities of the Church?

5 Do you live the law of chastity?

6 Is there anything in your conduct relating to members of your family that is not in harmony with the teachings of the Church?

7 Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

8 Do you strive to keep the covenants you have made, to attend your sacrament and other meetings, and to keep your life in harmony with the laws and commandments of the gospel?

9 Are you honest in your dealings with your fellowmen?

10 Are you a full-tithe payer?

11 Do your keep the Word of Wisdom?

12 Do you have financial or other obligations to a former spouse or children? If yes, are you current in meeting those obligations?

13 If you have previously received your temple endowment:

Do you keep the covenants that you made in the temple?

Do you wear the garment both night and day as instructed in the endowment and in accordance with the covenant you made in the temple?

14 Have there been any sins or misdeeds in your life that should have been resolved with priesthood authorities but have not been?

15 Do you consider yourself worthy to enter the Lord's house and participate in temple ordinances?

REFERENCE

http://www.mormonthink.com/glossary/templerecommend.htm



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/01/2018 09:57PM by SusieQ#1.

Thanks for the list of questions. I'll send it to her. Honestly, I hope her shelf cracks. She's only been in for a little over a year so I want to believe there is hope that she will figure out the church for what it really is. Some of our mutual friends already have. I'm just glad she's not giving in with the garments and changing her wardrobe.

New members and members alike, do not get full disclosure, ever. You're expected to promise on faith that you will do what they say when you don't have any idea what they are asking, ahead of time. Generally, every member just accepts, on faith whatever they are told.

Then, they are told not to question anything. How can anyone make promises based on blind faith? The implication is that questioning anything is tantamount to questioning Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ.

Thanks to the Internet, it's easy to do our own research and study and find the true facts. Fortunately, the Mormons, typically wrote everything down from the beginning.

*thumbs up* - I have faith her shelf will crack because she knows how to be assertive and she is openly honest. Her move to be a "jack Mormon" clearly depicts that. We have a few common friends who are inactive and are in-the-closet non-believers who have been supportive and gentle in sharing insights about the church without being pushy, so with time, I hope she'll resign.

You guys are amazing. I have trouble understanding some of the Mormon stuff because I have never been a Mormon, so sometimes I get lost when I am hearing Mormon lingo and all around some of my friends who were raised Mormon.

easily and I HATE SWEATING! It is a family thing as my dad would sweat like I do and my brother does. Maybe we all do. Wearing garments was torture even in winter. I didn't own a coat for years and I live in Cache Valley, which gets quite cold in the winters. I went to Hawaii during a drought for my honeymoon. I spent a lot of time finding shade.

It was so wonderful when I quit wearing garments. What a feeling to have that feeling of clothing next to your body and not those fabrics that felt more like thermal underwear.

My daughter has that sweating gene. She went through the temple in February 2017. Of course, she hasn't complained to me about it. She works in Alaska in summer. Just wait until she spends a summer in Utah in those garments.

If your friend decides to go through the temple, she'll want to ditch those garments quickly. I'd also be surprised if she didn't balk at the lds church if she goes through. It is hideous.

Oh, man today was in the 90s so I would imagine she'd be one to ditch garments ASAP.

While the garments are a serious issue and very strange, so is the temple. She will have no preparation for the completely strange rituals inside.

She should prepare herself by watching youtube videos of the temple ceremony, or if not the videos themselves, she should read about it. It's very, very strange. She will also be told that she has a new name. A name only a man who is her husband will know and he is the only one who can save her by calling for her by that name in the afterlife. It's far stranger than garments. but the garments will be an everyday hassle and ugly nuisance.

Come to think of it. I think I realize what my Mormon-raised friends mean when they talk about how the church is with them literally 24/7 even in the bathroom - it's the garments...

The fact that they call it a “worthiness interview” screams CULT. How is someone besides you qualified to decide if you’re “worthy” to enter the temple? You enter if you feel up to it. BTW, there are lockers in the temple, just like the gym. “Are you a thief?” must not be one of the interview questions.

She will be renting temple clothing for a small amount of money. They don’t have to charge, but they do, explicitly so there will be money changing going on in the temple, because Jesus would love that. They also consider the Old Testament by having not one but several golden calves. Moses would love that. Yes, their real God is money. You got a problem with that?

The embroidered marks on the garments used to be in red thread and before that they were actual scars caused by cutting the skin as per the original Masonic ceremony. The washing and anointing used to be done butt naked. Nothing weird there.

Is there something special about the temple? Maybe, but no more special than any other temple. Try visiting a Buddhist temple instead. What kind of temple requires permission slips? Only the Mormon ones, because Mormonism is perpetual Jr High. God is the Principal of the CK. Jesus is the Assistant Principal. Satan teaches gym and runs detention. You see what I mean? The whole thing is a farce.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/04/2018 02:02PM by babyloncansuckit.

I just had lunch with her and she told me it seems that garments are more about modesty than covenants - that was her impression from temple prep last Sunday. They worry more about what you wear than covenants.....



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/05/2018 01:47PM by helenm.

helenm Wrote:
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> I just had lunch with her and she told me it seems
> that garments are more about modesty than
> covenants - that was her impression from temple
> prep last Sunday. They worry more about what you
> wear than covenants.....


Her temple prep class is giving a strange impression if that is what she heard.

Let me be absolutely clear. Members who have been to the temple know, absolutely that The Garment of the Holy Melchizedek Priesthood is 100% about the Covenants they make in the temple.

They are usually given instructions from a female patron who explains their sacredness. We were told they were to be worn against the skin (bra and other underwear on top), never to be disrespected, (left on floor, etc,).

Wearing them results in a level of modesty.

See this post for Full Disclosure. https://www.exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,2132371



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/05/2018 02:53PM by SusieQ#1.

According to the "eyewitness testimony" of Joseph Smith, not one of the many, many heavenly beings including God & Jesus) that visited him were wearing garments, so....


....WTF!?

Two days before my mission ended I was visiting a member who lived in my last area to say goodbye. He was a solid member, had a wife and three teenage kids, all very active in the Church. His wife, while 'active' didn't have as strong of a belief in the Church as he did and really only participated because she knew how happy it seemed to make her family. She refused to be sealed to him in the temple, or to even go through the temple for herself because she didn't want to change her entire wardrobe to accommodate having to wear garments. There were other reasons I'm sure, but that's what she always told anyone that asked.

Because he hadn't been sealed to his wife in the temple he had been unable to 'progress' in the Church (be called as Bishop or any other calling that required temple sealing and ordinances). Male membership in this area was WEAK at best, not many priesthood holders which made him a prime target for all leadership positions.

As I was saying my goodbye's he told me that the Stake President had recently meet with him and told him that the Church NEEDED him in leadership positions and if his wife continued to hold him back by not going to the temple he should divorce her and find a woman who would. I, needless to say was stunned.

His wife was great. Kind, good mother and wife. Everyone knew her and loved her. But because she didn't want to go to the temple with her husband the SP wanted her thrown out with the dirty dishwater.

I told him the SP was a jerk and had no right to ask him to divorce a kind, loving woman just so he could become Bishop. I urged him to not consider it.

That was many many years ago. I never found out whatever became of him and his family. I've always feared that he being as TBM as he was may have followed the SP's mandate.

What I learned that day was that the Church has no bones about tearing good marriages and families apart, even for something as stupid as wearing garments, to get what it wants.

I wouldn't consider being a pick and choose mormon. It seems a better option to simply go to a church with more reasonable expectations. Who would want to be considered second or third rate when they could be fully respected?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/05/2018 03:14PM by Cheryl.

What do you think the typical bishop would say to a good and faithful sister who came to him to tell him of her plan to get the sacred temple Mason signs tattooed on the appropriate parts of her body so that she could ditch her garments and dress as she pleased?

She'd have logic on her side...

elderolddog


I've heard of a few women say they had the marks tattooed on their body. One told me they were on her feet, as I recall.

But did they feel that doing so allowed them to ditch the garments?

The next time we talk, I'll let her know it's better for her to marry a non-Mormon,

Thanks 22547474, elderolddog and SusieQ#1.

elderolddog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But did they feel that doing so allowed them to
> ditch the garments?


I'm not sure. I suspect that.