My wife and I left the church ~ 1 year ago but let our teenage children decide whether or not to continue going to LDS church.(They all kept going.) They recently had their annual interview with the bishop. Some of the comments the bishop or counselors made were:
~ How are you dealing with parents not coming to church? Has it been tough?
~ Your parents are still good people.
~ I think your parents will come back. (Um...no.)
~ I really like when I see you here at church.
~ You are such a good example to me and everyone else.

Statements like that make me feel like the kids are being pressured to come to church.

Here's the thing: I like the bishop and counselors. Knowing these guys, I think their intention is probably to be supportive and they might think they are being helpful. I don't think it would click to tell them that saying things like "I like seeing you here," or "You're such a good example," or "Your parents are still good people," is actually undermining parents.

On the surface those things sound good. Is it just me, or do those statements have an undercurrent of parents making poor choices and pressuring kids to go to church?

It's not just you.

And I think you're being a bit too generous (possibly because you like the bishop/counselors). I think they know very well their statements are undermining parents, and they don't care. Because the parents (that would be you) have abdicated their responsibility to raise up proper mormon kids, violated their temple covenants, and (in the bishop's mind) are being influenced by Satan -- so it's perfectly fine to undermine them.

I agree. They don't care about you as long as they can still get to the kids.

You make a great point. Maybe that's why these comments have been eating at me so much for the past few days.

"Your parents are still good people." What the f***? Well, that's mighty big of someone to say a thing like that. Passive aggressive way of saying that your parents suck, but we'll try and look past that.

I can only opine... What if the comment, “they are still good people...” was meant to infer, “They are still good people for now, but it’s only a matter of time before they keep getting further away from the lord... Check their drawers for narcotics!”

When youngest daughter was 14, the bishop pulled her in for the interview, telling her that unless she got her parents back into the church, she would not be with us in the hereafter. DD left in tears and she never darkened the door of the church again. So, in the end the bishop did all of a big favor though my DD didn't tell me of the encounter until several years later.

I was pissed but also amused that his trickery back fired on him.

#TenderMercies

Absolutely, those comments are eating at you for a reason!

Those are typical comments, repeated by Mormons all the time, and, yes, they are definitely passive-aggressive.

The longer you are out of the cult, the more sensitive you will become to the phoniness of the members. Mormons are liars. There's no way of getting around it. From being a member yourself, you know that Mormons are instructed to keep up that friendly, harmless, neighborly, good-guy facade.

That bishop is not on your side. He views you of an enemy, a follower of Satan. If he doesn't believe all the BS, he still believes that you have withdrawn your financial support from the cult, along with your membership. That makes him look bad. If he and your children can force you to return, that will make him look good. The cult wants your children to go on missions, get married in the temple (maybe force you to pay tithing to go, like they forced me to do for my daughter's wedding) and get jobs with good salaries, 10% for the cult, and procreate new members. Newborn BIC babies are the cult's Number One source of new members.

You need to listen to your children! Why are they still going to church? Do they know where that's headed? What are their goals with the rest of life that is out there? Education? Ask them what it is they like, and what it is they dislike about the Mormon church.

Go to them right now, approach them with neutrality and acceptance, and honestly ask them how THEY feel about what the bishopric statements. Then LISTEN to what they have to say.

Children are often more reasonable than adults. They are certainly smart enough to see and understand the Truth. Already, they are confiding in you, and that's to your credit! Don't abandon them under the bus. Bring them into the light of freedom, with you! (((Love your children)))

>>Your parents are still good people.

In your shoes I think I would give the kids a possible response, i.e. "And [bishop,] you are still a good person as well." That might give him some idea that his remarks are not appropriate.

When we were in process of going inactive, one Sunday the priesthood leader and his priests showed up at our door to get my 16 year old son to come to church or to bring church to him.

Our son had been very active, just got his eagle scout, etc. We gave our children the option of continuing in church but all five followed us right out of the Church.

This priesthood leader was a good friend, former bishop, and one of the best men I have ever known. I asked him to leave our son alone and he complied. He said "I was just trying to do my job".

I used to think like this man and I know his motivations were pure. It is just that the indoctrination from the church is so pervasive. I don't share the view of many on this board that Mormons have such nefarious motives. Most are just doing what they think is right.

Motives mean nothing if the words and actions are hurtful and inappropriate.

Agreed!

Mormonism dividing families once again.

...yeah. "Divide and conquer"...the apostate parents, that is.

It seems really risky letting your children stay in...imagine if they continue and go full-on TBM by adulthood. You won't be allowed to see them get married in the temple and you are not going to be seen in a good light (unworthy). They take on a very 'us vs. them' mentality.

And...even though the bishops and counselors seems like really nice men, they ultimately are brainwashed by the church and have their loyalty to the cult first before anything else. Every church member that I thought was really nice and seemed to have decent/innocent intentions has turned out to prove me wrong! It's the nicest ones that are the most deceptive. BEWARE!

This division and lowering of your status is only the beginning. It will get worse until the kids can justify not having you at their wedding (while paying for it). They will fully believe that your lowered status is something you brought on yourself and they are doing right by shunning you.

The kids will be angry at their parents. After all, their parents got them involved all their lives. HOPEFULLY, the kids will figure it out. They might not.

I took my kids out. I didn't really ask them, but they were 8 years old. My daughter went back at age 20 and she is now 32 and as TBM as they come. There is no pat answer for this situation.

I had the primary presidency come by and tell my kids we were bad parents and that they would pick my kids up to go to primary, but I never allowed that to happen. My son said that was the last straw for him. He said he never believed anyway.

The bishop did put pressure on my daughter to get us reactivated when she went back. I called him out on it as she was worrying herself to death over it.

Ask gemini what she did. Her kids are all still in. She left while they were younger. We can't blame the kids for us raising them in a cult.

The social aspects of a teenager's life are bad enough to all of a sudden lose their social network. AND parents are a pain to teenagers. This is not a time to take on this type of battle.

True...tough age for sure. Perhaps it depends on how Mormon of an area the OP lives in. If this is Utah, then I totally understand. If not, the chances are better of getting through the social aspect of it. My high school in CA had a lot of Mormon kids, and while I had a few Mormon friends, most of my friends were nevermos. And I hated Mormonism, so if I had been offered the chance to never go back to church at that age I would've been so happy and relieved.

I just can't believe that your teenagers want to continue to attend church. I hated the time spent at church and wanted to follow my father's example when he started staying home to watch football.

Every message that I received was painfully clear. I was a bad person and needed a weekly chastising to improve. Maybe there was a different message offered at church, but that's all that I ever heard.

Now the church leaders were entirely aware about the problems of my dad's inactivity. They flat out told me to stay clear of him. I was advised that HF would be most happy if I spent more time with Brother Blowhard, my YM prez, than spending time fishing with my Dad.

The church is an evil organization that wants your time, money and family.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/15/2018 03:46AM by messygoop.

FallenShelf Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Statements like that make me feel like the kids
> are being pressured to come to church.

Duh. Mormonism has refined the concept of peer pressure to an
extreme level.

> Here's the thing: I like the bishop and
> counselors. Knowing these guys, I think their
> intention is probably to be supportive and they
> might think they are being helpful. I don't think
> it would click to tell them that saying things
> like "I like seeing you here," or "You're such a
> good example," or "Your parents are still good
> people," is actually undermining parents.

To them, nothing matters except Mormonism. If they have to
undermine parents in order to suck a kid into the cult then so
be it. That would be considered a pure victory for them.

> On the surface those things sound good. Is it just
> me, or do those statements have an undercurrent of
> parents making poor choices and pressuring kids to
> go to church?

It's not just you. That's the whole point of the statements,
not just the "undercurrent."

"Your parents are such good people.... your parents will come back [I can't possibly imagine how such good people don't know the church is tah-wooooo]"

Yes, your kids are getting a double message: 'Your parents are still good people (but not quite good enough- dig, dig)'. And the subtle pressure on them to bring you back as if it's their responsibility.

Have your kids told you how this makes them feel and how it is effecting their relationship with you? I'd want to be sure and tell them that your relationship with TSCC is not their responsibility. Also, be sure they know that your decision to leave is yours alone. They have no business feeling accountable for your actions. Reference the Articles of Faith on that topic to bring it home for them.

An outsider (nevermo) perspective FWIW: I'd see that as pressuring your kids to get you to come back.

Your kids are very fortunate to have a bishop and counselors in their lives who can reassure them that their parents aren't totally beyond the pale...yet.