Just seen this article

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6368601/Mormon-sacred-site-Independence-Missouri-key-place-Jesus-Christs-Second-Coming.html

Loved it. Thanks. Really explains things here.

Yep, it's a weird place to visit. The three denominations all own land on each corner of the intersection in front of the RLDS temple and Auditorium, with the Hedrickites owning the lot itself. As you can imagine, the SLC Mormons all seem to have a chip on their shoulder there. I don't think they get many visitors either--as soon as I walked in the visitor's center, no fewer than 3 pairs of missionaries beelined right at me.

When I was a kid, Mormons were still talking about having to leave Utah in order to gather in Missouri for the Second Coming, you know, when the time came to do that...based on Joseph Smith's "prophecy." Of course Joseph Smith prophesied a lot of stuff that didn't happen.

Even though the second-coming-in-Missouri prophecy, when considered alone, would still seem to be somewhat open-ended and therefore subject to possible fulfillment, I think Mormons are also vaguely aware of other prophecies that indicated that the Second Coming was supposed to have happened about 100 years ago. So most of them seem quite ambivalent about that Missouri prophecy these days. I know none of my Mormon relatives ever talk about gathering in Missouri anymore.

Wally Prince Wrote:
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> When I was a kid, Mormons were still talking about
> having to leave Utah in order to gather in
> Missouri for the Second Coming, you know, when the
> time came to do that...based on Joseph Smith's
> "prophecy." Of course Joseph Smith prophesied a
> lot of stuff that didn't happen.
>
> Even though the second-coming-in-Missouri
> prophecy, when considered alone, would still seem
> to be somewhat open-ended and therefore subject to
> possible fulfillment, I think Mormons are also
> vaguely aware of other prophecies that indicated
> that the Second Coming was supposed to have
> happened about 100 years ago. So most of them seem
> quite ambivalent about that Missouri prophecy
> these days. I know none of my Mormon relatives
> ever talk about gathering in Missouri anymore.

Now the church says zion is where you live. Talk of heading back to Missouri faded out in the 1990's The church even built a temple in the Kansas City area. It's a tad west of Liberty. They didn't wait until The Church of Christ folded and The Community of Christ needed the money. Plus, ever been to Independence? It's a ran down, has been hole compared to the greater Wasatch area in Utah. I can't see my TBM sister giving up her very nice home with the beautiful view of the mountains out of her huge wall of picture windows for Independence. Dream on. The LDS church is staying in Utah.

...in the long run, the descendants of the Pioneers got a better deal. At the time, I'm sure the LSD pioneers thought they had left relatively fertile, arable land to go struggle in a harsh, arid wilderness.

But, as you indicated, I don't think many of their descendants would want to give up living in places like Utah/Idaho/Arizona to go live in a place like Independence or Nauvoo.

I've spent most of my life living far away from the Rockies, but that's where I usually feel most at home.

Yah uhhhhhhhhh where is MORmON Zion really located at ?????

( what is the latest MORmON revelation /LIE on that ????)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8aNf-lNh-g

I've visited many times.

Hedrickites = dusty dying caretakers of a plot of land. Not trying to get you to join. Just want to spend time with anyone who will listen.

CoC(RLDS) = Similar to Hedrickites except they have more passion for their beliefs and like to talk Joseph Smith a lot in their museum/gift shop. Obviously better surroundings and a feeling of something going on like a well organized group.

LDS = I've walked into the lobby of a cult. Surrounded by missionaries wanting to take me to movies, walk me around the place, excited to talk to me. Wanting we to either join up or think that this is the place!

...I would be interested in what type mower is used for grounds keeping on the sacred parcel. Do you know ?...push mower?....Toro?...Cub Cadet?...Grasshopper? Or maybe just threshed as in olden days.....and was it properly blessed and set aside as a dedicated device?

Nope. They hire an old Negro to cut the grass. Doin' it for 67 years now, with a machette. The same machette.

Concerned Citizen 2.0 Wrote:
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> ...I would be interested in what type mower is
> used for grounds keeping on the sacred parcel. Do
> you know ?...push mower?....Toro?...Cub
> Cadet?...Grasshopper? Or maybe just threshed as
> in olden days.....and was it properly blessed and
> set aside as a dedicated device?

The same machete indeed, 2 new blades and 3 new handles.

I found the temple site in Independence an incredible bore. Harry Truman's home is a short walk from the temple site. That was more interesting. Also they have some cool underground warehouse facilities in Independence.

https://youtu.be/t9L437Gwco8

I visited the site while I was still a believer. I was struck with how small the Temple would have to be to fit on that spot. Very small. And it certainly wouldn't have room for the ceremonies that take place in a Mormon Temple of the 20th to 21st Century. Smith chose the site in 1831 before he decided to steal the ceremonies from the Masons.

The fact the Reorganized Church (now Community of Christ) had the original "revelations from God" published in the Book of Commandments in the original form made an impression on me. Especially the fact all those revelations had been changed to fit with the newly created and changed beliefs Joseph Smith had devised and then published in The Doctrine and Covenants made an even bigger impression.

LeftTheMorg Wrote:
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> I visited the site while I was still a believer. I
> was struck with how small the Temple would have to
> be to fit on that spot. Very small. And it
> certainly wouldn't have room for the ceremonies
> that take place in a Mormon Temple of the 20th to
> 21st Century. Smith chose the site in 1831 before
> he decided to steal the ceremonies from the
> Masons.

The plans are definitely for something bigger.

http://urbanplanning.library.cornell.edu/DOCS/smith.htm