High winds (maybe 50 mph) expected tonight.

This is a nightmare. CA always has fire problems, but I don't ever remember stuff like this in November.

We contained the Cedar fire in SoCal on Nov 4, 2003.

Fires aren't uncommon into November in California, 11 other fires were burning at the same time in SoCal.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cedar_Fire_(2003)

I remember the Cedar fire, as well as others. I just don't remember fires of this magnitude and numbers of what's happening this fall.

My good thoughts are with everyone who is, or could be, impacted.

I have always loved the Mother Lode like it was my own, and the Chinese Temple in Oroville is one of the places I always most wanted to visit when I was "up North" during my growing up.

To me, when I was there, it was like I was able to almost physically touch the lives of the 49ers.

I hope the fire is contained very soon, and that everyone (humans and animals) is able to find safety--and that the Chinese Temple survives, too.

Oh my goodness. When will this madness end?

There is a good documentary on the Cedar Fire on Investigation Discovery. The blaze was described as a presence and had a life of its own, like a breathing monster came to devour everything in its path.

These fires are so terrible and terrifying. It used to be that weather would help out the fire fighting with winds calming down at night.

According to the LDS meetinghouse locator, there are two near Oroville. Maybe they will miraculously be spared, proving the church is true.

Edit: Oops, the Paradise meeting houses went up yesterday. https://www.deseretnews.com/article/900041261/church-news-paradise-camp-fire-hits-latter-day-saint-families-hard-destroys-church-meetinghouse.html

Maybe someone was looking at porn.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/10/2018 07:03PM by babyloncansuckit.

One thing you can bet on is that they won’t be used as evacuation centers.

They don’t like people who smoke—-even if their hair is on fire.

Sorry, but I find these pictures of LDS buildings on fire weirdly satisfying. https://www.thechurchnews.com/global/2018-11-09/paradise-camp-fire-hits-latter-day-saint-families-hard-destroys-church-meetinghouse-48411

Just texted those to my friend who lost a good Dad so his mom could marry a worthy priesthood holder who beat the living sh*t out of him.

Ugh. My jack Mormon stepdad would beat my kid brother after he and my mother got hitched.

It made me furious when I found out one year @ Christmas time while visiting Ogden. My stepdad was bragging to me how he had full control over my mom and little brother. I asked my brother if that was true? And he stood trembling in fear in the livingroom nodding his head at me, without saying a word.

I didn't stay with them during that visit, or ever. I'd stay with my non-Mo grandmother in town. She was a gentle soul, who was probably someone my brother could count on when there wasn't anyone else there for him.

Damn bastards who thinks it okay to beat anyone. I hated my stepdad for that. My brother left there as soon as he could, and ended up joining the Navy as soon as he finished high school. That was his ticket out from chaos. He had a harder time than the rest of us did. By the time our parents divorced he was the only one to go live with mom, and paid for it dearly.

He's the one who caused me much grief as an adult. I still haven't been able to forgive him for meddling in my family or trying to steal my children when they were babies during a time he and his wife were infertile. But I understand where he picked up some of his eccentricity and oddities living with my stepdad and mom. They were both a couple of eccentrics, and my brother got the raw end of that deal.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/13/2018 06:53PM by Amyjo.

"According to the LDS meetinghouse locator, there are two near Oroville. Maybe they will miraculously be spared, proving the church is true."

What about the LDS church in Paradise calif which burned down? Does that prove the church is false then?

There is nothing to prove as to what buildings are spared or burned to the ground.

The fire has a pulse and mind of its own, and spares nothing in its path. It's a force of nature to be reckoned with. Nature against man, one of the oldest conflicts on earth where nature more often prevails.

"Wildfires are so powerful they can create their own weather. As these fires burn, they consume huge quantities of oxygen. The intense heat causes the air to rise. ... These flame-throwing tornadoes, called fire whirls, can be 50 feet (15 meters) wide and grow as tall as a 40-story building."

https://kids.nationalgeographic.com/explore/science/ten-freaky-forces-of-nature/

Amyjo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The fire has a pulse and mind of its own, and
> spares nothing in its path.

I find applying human traits to such completely non-human things interesting. And not very useful.

Fires don't have minds. Once one starts, any fuel in the path (usually driven by winds) also combusts. Unless it doesn't -- for a variety of reasons: wind shifts, fire breaks, random chance. You'll often find entire neighborhoods but one house completely gone. That one house standing wasn't "better" than the others. It wasn't magically protected. It usually didn't have any more fire-resistant materials than the others. The wind just shifted around it. No mind is behind what a fire consumes.

But hey, if anthropomorphism does something for you, knock yourself out. Just don't try changing a fire's mind...it won't work.

I get that. The fire doesn't have a mind of its own and can't decide to spare a particular house.

But why does the wind decide to change direction to blow the fire away from the home? I bet you didn't consider that, now did you!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/2018 07:07PM by Lot's Wife.

Lot's Wife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But why does the wind decide to change direction
> to blow the fire away from the home? I bet you
> didn't consider that, now did you!

I did consider that. But then, you knew that already...:)

From the article:

“'Most or all of our members have lost their homes — I know I’ve lost two homes,' said Bishop Harrison, who presides over the Paradise 1st Ward, Chico California Stake.

"Meanwhile, both meetinghouses in Paradise were reportedly destroyed."


So now what's the reason religionists keep the commandments? What do they get out of doing so that people who don't keep the commandments don't get?

I'm waiting for a story featuring a pimp/drug pusher/security systems salesman whose house miraculously did not burn down.

Tithing is only fire insurance for the second coming. TSCC self-insures, but they’ll have no problem providing employment for Utah builders. Just think, the members can dwell in tents during the week and learn about Lehi’s travels on Sunday.

elderolddog Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm waiting for a story featuring a pimp/drug pusher/security systems salesman whose house miraculously did not burn down.

I'll do it later.
Running to a movie.

I can't start a far right now.

A few years ago, I had to check on a facility in the hinterlands of Butte County. I and a coworker drove through what seemed like endless tunnels of dry brush to get there. It would have been too dense to walk through and hard to imagine deer getting through it.

I remembered my dad hacking through such brush to rescue a lost boy. But the time Pop reached him, the boy’s clothes and shoes we completely sheared off him by dense manzanita.

And that’s what I was looking at—-brush that you’d need an ax to get out of. It was scary. I wondered how Butte County got away with that—-where there were homes and even residential-care facilities down dirt roads deep in tinder. How did they get the permits?

I commented to my coworker that if there were a fire, they’d never get out alive. I was never so glad to get back on the main highway.

Very scary indeed.

kathleen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A few years ago, I had to check on a facility in
> the hinterlands of Butte County. I and a coworker
> drove through what seemed like endless tunnels of
> dry brush to get there. It would have been too
> dense to walk through and hard to imagine deer
> getting through it.
>
> I remembered my dad hacking through such brush to
> rescue a lost boy. But the time Pop reached him,
> the boy’s clothes and shoes we completely
> sheared off him by dense manzanita.
>
> And that’s what I was looking at—-brush that
> you’d need an ax to get out of. It was scary.
> I wondered how Butte County got away with
> that—-where there were homes and even
> residential-care facilities down dirt roads deep
> in tinder. How did they get the permits?
>
> I commented to my coworker that if there were a
> fire, they’d never get out alive. I was never
> so glad to get back on the main highway.

Thank you for this Kathleen!!--this is a really good example of chaparral, Northern California (much more rain, plus snow I think!!) style.

Most of the chaparral I am familiar with is not as tall or as thick as you have described here, because it grows in more arid places (which includes the mountains, even though they get snow in the winter--and also the coastal areas of southern California).

The most "complicated" chaparral I have any close-up and personal experience with is that of the San Bernardino Mountains (which was once the home of Camp Yallani, our Camp Fire Girls summer home, RIP)--and the chaparral around Yallani definitely includes manzanita.

(We worked manzanita into a variety of wooden jewelry and other useless stuff we took home, at the end of summer, as gifts to our ever-patient and accepting relatives.)

What you have described here is a wonderful verbal snapshot which illustrates the many differences in California life zones throughout the state.

Thank you!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/2018 10:20PM by Tevai.

I would like to have some sympathy for all the people getting hurt by these fires. But as you know I've been reared by the marvelous Correlation program so my focus is supposed to be 100% on getting everyone assimilated into this wondrous gospel.

I'd like to remind all of you of a glorious fire insurance program that only costs you 10% of your gross income. What you get in return is that our loving Heavenly Father will spare you from an eternal lake of fire and brimstone if you will pay up so the beloved Brethren can have more financial resources to manage on behalf of Heavenly Father.

Every time I visit the Hill Cumorah in upstate New York and think of all the numerous archaeological artifacts that we should expect to be there I'm reminded of how reliable this peculiar fire insurance program is. Same goes for when I look at all the detailed and super transparent Church financial, statistical, and historical records on the Church's websites :)

Today on the news, I saw where entire Paradise subdivisions were burnt/melted, but the plastic garbage cans that had been set out were unharmed.

Does anyone know why?

...probably best we don't ask. I mean, how deep down the rabbit hole are we willing to go? These questions and other hypotheticals have been asked before...DEW?...unknown.

"Those who know, do not speak....those who speak, do not know."

Concerned Citizen 2.0 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...probably best we don't ask. I mean, how deep
> down the rabbit hole are we willing to go?



Every single rabbit hole needs to be gone down.



^ These
> questions and other hypotheticals have been asked
> before...DEW?...unknown.



Garbage cans surviving the fire is not a hypothetical. It's a fact. If I were a fire scientist, I'd research that exhaustively.



> "Those who know, do not speak....those who speak,
> do not know."



That's cutesy, Concerned Citizen, but makes NO SENSE AT ALL!

Butte County Sheriff Kory Honea is speaking a lot, and he knows. Please listen to him or check with Cal Fire for updates on the Camp fire, and local sheriffs and Cal Fire for other counties.

I hear a lot on local news that I want to pass on to you. For fear of giving any misleading info, I'm not going to make any more sweeping statements such as "Oroville appears to be next in Camp Fire's path."

However, I will pass on phone #s issued by Sheriff Honea in a press conference--phone #s for those searching for loved ones that may have been lost in the Camp Fire.

(530) 538-6570
(530) 538-7544
(530) 538-7671



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/2018 10:15PM by kathleen.

...as I posted in a companion thread, my brother is a Battalion Chief with Cal Fire. He has been to virtually all the hot-spot areas in the state for over 20 years. He also does fire and arson investigations. What he said is what you said. Some of these points of origins defy traditional investigative techniques. I agree with you. He said in some residential regions, homes looked like they were literally cut in two, leaving one side of the home devastated, while the other side was totally intact with green lawns, shrubbery and vehicles nearby the burn line, without paint scorching.

...yes, I was being cutesy. That particular phrase was coined during investigations into Nazi high-technology developments at the end of WWII, when German scientists were questioned about what they had developed. But this board is probably not the place to go into this topic..........

cC, I need to apologize for snarking at you.

...no, you're fine. I need to be a jackass from time to time. You were someone who saw it for what it was, and asked a legit question. This is being sorted out as we speak. Additional questions are being looked at. Many anomalies, outside the typical norms............

I understand what you meant now.
And ...


Concerned Citizen 2.0 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ... Many anomalies,
> outside the typical norms............


Yes. Many.

At least 80 people are still missing in the Paradise area blaze. Many are in their 80's and 90's.

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/900042035/n-california-fires-death-toll-now-at-48-many-still-missing.html

Update: over 600 missing

https://www.npr.org/2018/11/16/668552010/more-than-600-people-now-missing-in-californias-deadliest-fire

Many (don't remember the number) cadaver dogs are being brought into Paradise along with a veterinary support team to try and keep the dogs safe.

Photos of the missing people are heart wrenching.