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Posted by: Lowpriest ( )
Date: January 09, 2019 06:23PM

Ok, I am not suicidal and I am not trolling. This is kind of a rant, but I also think I may have a growing problem. I am just completely stuck.

If I did not wake up tomorrow I would not care. Not one bit. Again, I am not trying to check out prematurely but I really don't care. I recently found out about an inlaw who probably has less than a year to live. I was a little jealous.

I am just so completely worn out with this nonstop nonsense. The only way I can stay away from this Mormon BS is to stay away from home, but I miss my family when I am away. Pretty much everyone I know is hip deep in this church crap. Most of them seem ok with it. A few are all-in.

I have talked to counselors without any positive effect. What's left to say except GTFO? But I cannot leave. And I cannot stay. Even when I try to talk about it I have to be careful not to say too much. I used to think I was a decisive person, but I am just frozen. I am absolutely frickin frozen and not just about church.

I totally told off a telemarketer today. Ok, he was a obviously a little scammy but it is not like me to cuss out a total stranger or actually anyone for that matter. I feel like I was lashing out. It was not rational.

I am not sure if I am going to be fired, bankrupt or divorced first. I cannot concentrate. I cannot keep track of simple projects. I hate to answer the phone or check the mail. I wish I could just sleep, but I only get about four hours a night. I have dozens of projects that are 40% done.

The only thing I do consistently is exercise, mostly walking. According to Garmin I have walked over 1000 miles in the last six months. That cannot be normal. I did it "to lose weight", and it worked. It still seems a little disproportionate.

It all seems to be tied to the LDS church, but that is as far as I can imagine now.

Is there a name for this?

Could this be related to my feelings about the church or do I need treatment for some other problem and am I just scapegoating the church because it is such a convenient target? Why has counseling been so useless?

Thanks for listening...

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Posted by: Tevai ( )
Date: January 09, 2019 06:55PM

I am not any sort of medical professional, but what I think you are describing is depression.

The depression (it seems to me), is being made a WHOLE lot worse by the church--and may have been caused by the church (at minimum: in part).

I understand the loneliness, but a high percentage of adults go through lonely periods in their lives. (I have, for sure.)

On the other side of your present loneliness, and a present lifestyle which is making you ill, is a better and more satisfying life with enjoyment and happiness (and the usual life problems, too)--but it may take you awhile, and some seemingly false starts, before you get to that point.

My advice, for your consideration, is to start immediately cutting down on your church interactions. Get another job, or better yet begin to volunteer someplace where you think you can do some good, and then prioritize this new part of your life: you can't clean toilets, or do "whatever," because you have other obligations, etc., etc.

If you volunteer someplace, you will make new friends and new contacts. Those friends and contacts will lead you to other, new to you, possibilities that you probably don't know exist right now.

If you can't resign outright, then begin "fading away." YOU know where the "slack" is in your life, so take advantage of those "weak spots" and then begin enlarging them by filling in other "Must Do" activities.

Begin immediately to create "a" new life (you may have to create several "new lives" to get to the place you finally feel is totally "right" for you).

Find a place to volunteer, or take a course you've always wanted to take at your local community college (or whatever other options you have available in your area), begin researching something you've 'always' been interested in, start fulfilling whichever of your childhood and adolescent dreams you find most appealing now. You are not being graded, and this is not a pass/fail situation. Instead, you are 'scientifically' learning what is right for YOU--and what is not.

This may take a few years. (Took me a few decades!)

At some point, you will wake up some morning feeling "whole" and "alive" in ways you never before thought possible for yourself.

At that point, you can come back here and tell those who need this same advice just how this is done! :)

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Posted by: PollyDee ( )
Date: January 09, 2019 10:37PM

Yeah...I agree with Tevai, it sounds like depression which can be a serious medical condition. See a real doctor/psychiatrist - not a counselor, therapist, or psychologist as they are not medical doctors.

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Posted by: nogirlpower ( )
Date: January 09, 2019 10:42PM

Depression (coming from someone who has been clinically diagnosed as being depressed.) Those are the exact symptoms I suffered. Get some help because what you described is not how most people live day to day. And you don't have to either!

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Posted by: mom anon ( )
Date: January 09, 2019 10:42PM

Lowpriest Wrote:

> The only thing I do consistently is exercise,
> mostly walking. According to Garmin I have walked
> over 1000 miles in the last six months. That
> cannot be normal. I did it "to lose weight", and
> it worked. It still seems a little
> disproportionate.

Walking by itself didn't help depression for me, no matter how many miles I logged in. *Exercise that ramped up my heart rate a couple of times a day is what worked. I still have lousy stuff to deal with, but when I keep up with those short bursts, depression vanishes. Try that, even if it's just to run to the mailbox if you can.

*if your heart is strong and all that.

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Posted by: caffiend ( )
Date: January 09, 2019 11:09PM

It may be your counselor(s) is (are) not doing right by you--missing the depression. Ask for a referral to a psychotherapist and/or a psychiatrist with recommendations for depression. A friend of mine, dealing with bipolar issues, uses both: the psychotherapist for weekly visits and monitoring of his situation, and the psychiatrist a few times a year to review his meds. He's very diligent with his treatment, which is rare.

In addition to the depression (if such be the case), consider that you are also dealing with grief and fear. Grief, in that something that was an important part of your life (TSCC) is dying away (as it should be), like a close but dysfunctional relationship--and that's what TSCC is. You're happy to see them go, but still, it's disconcerting, and calls for major adjustments.

And fear: you have family in it, which is cause of great uncertainty. You'll cope better as you come to terms with these painful, stress-inducing realities.

Look for positive things to involve yourself, however small. Read a book or binge watch a show you've been meaning to get to. Add (in increments) more activity to your fitness program. Minimize your involvement with LDS as much as you can: turn down all callings because of your situation. If you MUST go to SM, bring a tablet and read something you like--half the other men are, too!

And most of all, if you have thoughts of self-harm, even to "scare" people, PLEASE call 911 or somebody you trust--PLEASE!

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Posted by: Lowpriest ( )
Date: January 10, 2019 08:57AM

Thank you for your thoughts.

You mentioned reading a tablet during SM. I used to do that. About six months ago, There were talks in Stake Conference and at the ward level about leaving our devices out of meetings, turning them off, or keeping them in a bag, etc.

I remember thinking at the time, "You are killing me. Trust me, bishop, everyone will be much better off if I do not pay attention to what is being said."

Lately I have started bringing a pad of paper so I can "make notes". The notes usually involve anything but church topics.

This whole scenario of SM is like so many other parts of my life. I am there but I am somewhere else mentally. I feel like I am a prisoner in my own life.

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Posted by: siobhan ( )
Date: January 09, 2019 11:46PM

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Posted by: GregS ( )
Date: January 10, 2019 09:15AM

My wife and I have both dealt with depression over the years, her much more than me, and we've learned to recognize, mitigate, and allow for it.

Your current situation reminds me of my SIL, who is one of those chronically upbeat people who never experienced depression. She recently had taken medication which had side-effects that included "may cause depression". She was describing to my wife feelings similar to yours. When my wife told her that it sounded like depression, she asked, "Is this what you feel all the time?"

My wife responded, "Welcome to my world."

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Posted by: Done & Done ( )
Date: January 10, 2019 10:11AM

People can do things they hate, that are repugnant, that actually cause pain--physical or emotional-- in order to achieve something they consider necessary. But, only for so long. There comes a point where you just can't do it one more minute no matter what the consequence. You try. But the momentum is gone. The reserve is depleted.

If you keep trying to sacrifice yourself like that you eventually end up in no man's land which is where you are. It's all Luke-warm. Nothing feels good. Because it isn't good. Got to find something scorching for a change. Endless cycle of trying to "to do the perceived right thing but not even caring anymore if you succeed. Like being Mormon just for family?

Do what is right--for you--and let the consequence follow. Perhaps? Some see being who you really are no matter what as being selfish. I call it healthy. Disappoint a few people. But that's just my own odd point of view on it all to give you some expansion, something else to consider. I have no idea really, so, Good luck.

Or maybe the others are right about the depression. But more important to me is where did it come from?

I've seen serious depression. Had a lady at work who was so fun and always laughing and kidding. After her husband died she went into a depression for about eight years. She got really skinny but not on purpose. She swore at everyone who walked by and wadded up paper and threw it at them. We're like family here so everyone just loved her anyway. We were told by her kin that at home she just sat in a chair and stared. One day it was gone and she was her old self again. Gained weight. Started kidding everyone. Smiling. Laughing. Dancing. I don't understand all that. I wish I knew why she suddenly went right back to her old self. I don't think she knew. She never took anything for it or saw a counselor or anything. True depression is mysterious.

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Posted by: slskipper ( )
Date: January 10, 2019 11:51AM

Dear Lowpriest: I am reminded of a quote from Sigmund Freud who never actually said it. It is this: before you diagnose yourself with depression, make sure that you are not in fact surrounded by assholes.

You may be going through a midlife crisis, whcih is shorthand for wondering what to do with the rest of your life to give it any meaning. You may be feeling the effects of the crushing capitalist system that values individuality not one whit. Or something.

For examples, watch Chaplin's "Modern Times" or any number of dystopian novels or movies. For confirmation, try Albert Camus.

I would specifically caution you against seeking any answers from Mormonism. That is such a classic case of a capitalist institution commandeering religion for its own materialistic purposes. Its only goal is to tell you that you are indeed defective.

Thank you.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: January 10, 2019 01:48PM

slskipper Wrote:
> For
> confirmation, try Albert Camus.

Great advice for me. I'm a stranger to my people.

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Posted by: miriamegress ( )
Date: January 10, 2019 02:10PM

As someone who has suffered from both depression and anxiety I definitely feel that what you are describing is depression. To be honest the fact that you are not living YOUR life, but the facsimile of what others think your life should be is probably contributing to it.
It is nearly impossible to make decisions when in the grips of depression and nothing seems to matter.
My advice would be to try different therapists until you find one that works for you, AND talk to a psychiatrist that can get you on medication to help. Odds are if this is a completely new development for you then the medication will be temporary, but can help you push forward.
In the end I can also tell you from experience that living a life that isn't the one you want will never let you escape that feeling of hopelessness. I don't know how accepting or not your family is and I know that can play a role in people's decision making process with the religion, but if it is not for you pretending will just dig you deeper.
Good luck.

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Posted by: sbg ( )
Date: January 10, 2019 02:31PM

I agree this sounds like depression, I have had a lot of the same symptoms from time to time. Usually adjusting my medication will work. Lack of sleep for me is the biggest issue. The less I sleep the less I can sleep and I just cycle down. Once I can start sleeping I start moving towards more normal.

On the 1000 miles in 6 months, I am not sure that is excessive. If you walk the recommended 10K steps a day (which is roughly 5 miles) you would walk about 900 miles in 6 months. Not excessively over that.

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Posted by: Lowpriest ( )
Date: January 10, 2019 07:20PM

I had not done the math. I actually enjoy walking, so it is nice to think that it may not be out of control.

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Posted by: Elder Berry ( )
Date: January 10, 2019 03:01PM

"Could this be related to my feelings about the church or do I need treatment for some other problem and am I just scapegoating the church because it is such a convenient target?"

I've felt deep depression twice in my life. I'm still struggling with the second time.

The first was realizing I was in a cult and trying to deal with the fallout of coming out.

The second was my current midlife crisis with regards to my sexual orientation. I had spent all my life suppressing my homosexuality. Once all the kids were raised it becomes hard to suppress.

I believe you might be suffering from something similar to my first bout. I have all sorts of coping behaviors for the second which are failing me but I had nothing for losing my beliefs. I was either all in or not. I still suffer from the grief of not being able to fully participate with my loved ones. Tolerance is a cruel cross to bear and I understand non-believers who don't tolerate Joseph's Fraud in any form.

Ironically, "the brethren" often have preached against the evils of tolerance. They deserve everything they get in their myopic governance of a fraud perpetuated on humanity.

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: January 10, 2019 07:46PM

Burnout and depression. You love your family, but do they love you?...enough to let you take an extended break from church?

I think you are long overdue for a frank talk with those closest to you. They need to know the degree of your distress, and the cause of it. I don't think you need to necessarily share your lack of belief, but you do need to share that attending church is literally killing you. If you want, "blame" it on your therapist, i.e. "My counselor has strongly advised me to take a long break from church. Church attendance is simply causing me too much distress and emotional upheaval. I am going to follow his advice."

You might also consider having a conversation with your loved ones about having a balanced life. In my Catholic family, church was just a small part of our lives. We went to church on Sunday, came home, and lived our lives. There was not much discussion about church otherwise. It sounds to me that you need to take back your family. Maybe have a rule, no church talk during dinner. Something like that. Carve out a peaceful space for yourself. Teach your family that there are many other things to talk about.

These are just some ideas, but if you think about it, certain things in your life desperately need to change. Your mind and body are telling you that. They are screaming to you. Choose life! Make the changes that you need to make. Your life and your happiness are precious, indeed.

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Posted by: exminion ( )
Date: January 11, 2019 05:39AM

I agree that you should see a psychiatrist. I did.

Like you, I knew something was wrong. I had been through some horrific experiences in my life, but those were over. I was 40, and the sole financial support for my children. I didn't want my "depression or whatever it was" to interfere with my career, or my good relationship with my children. Unhappiness rubs off onto others, and I didn't want it in our life. What I mean is, life has its bumps-in-the-road, and the family home should be a safe haven, a source of love and affirmation and support. I wanted to bring 100% of my self to my children. My career mattered, because it paid for our house and everything else. Like you, I felt I had no intrinsic value as "just me."

I went to a great psychiatrist, and told him I thought I was depressed. I was still able to work, though. I loved my children, and had great joy and fun with them. I cared enough to ask advice--like you are doing here. After work, I hiked with my dog for an hour or so, to keep myself sane. It turned out that I wasn't depressed at all!

Get a diagnosis! I took all the tests. The doctor tried various antidepressants on me, and they didn't do anything at all, except give me side-effects. My diagnosis was PTSD. That's a different animal. 10 years later, I'm about 80% cured!

(Did you have trauma growing up? Were you raised in the cult? Are you being abused now? Does the MOrmon cult seem abusive to you? There is such a thing as Mormon abuse. I lived with extreme physical and mental abuse, from birth. My abusive older brother was 6 years old, was the school bully, and already had our family held hostage, and he ruled the household, when I was born. He didn't like not being the youngest anymore, and wanted me out of the picture. My TBM parents were in denial that my brother was a psychopath, and they did nothing to help me. The torture and physical beatings and the threats were constant, and I had stomach aches almost every night. I left home the day after graduating high school, never to return.

Anxiety was more of a problem than depression. Anxiety can often drain your energy. It takes stamina to be constantly hyper-vigilant, and to be constantly overcoming fear. You think of anxious people as jittery, but often they are exhausted! Lack of sleep is a symptom of anxiety. Get a diagnosis, because if you are anxious some antidepressants can send you through the roof. I have a tranquilizer (similar to valium) to take before surgery, or if I have severe flashbacks or trauma. I need it only 2 or 3 times a year, now.

I started questioning the Mormon lies, years before I saw a psychiatrist. When I resigned, with the children, I had a wonderful feeling of peace and joy. My children were happier. Our relationship was already good, but it got better and better. I didn't dread Sundays anymore. Weekends were more fun. Life was more fun. I realized that my "depression" had disappeared, from the day I walked out of that ward house for the last time! I mean, it was GONE!

It took a few more years to get the PTSD under control, but it certainly helped to avoid the "triggers" to the anxiety attacks. church was a huge trigger, and it still is. The sound of the Mormon coir at the Mormon tabernacle at the Mormon temple square, made me want to cry hysterically. My granddaughter brought over a Mormon hymn book, and started playing the hymns, and I could not bear it. I hide my PTSD flashback attacks from others, but that Mormon hymn book mysteriously disappeared, and I taught her other music that is more upbeat. For years, I could not be alone in a car with a man, or alone with a man in an office (awkward at work, but I kept the doors open, and had a colleague with me). I can fly without fear.

If you want to get rid of at least SOME of your "depression" follow the suggestion of some of the posters of taking a break from church! Lie to them (they have lied to you for years, so why not?) and tell them you need to take sick leave from church. You owe them no explanation. Church callings are supposed to be VOLUNTEER, and you have a right to not volunteer for a while. You will feel that dark cloud of dread and despair lift from your life! For me, it was like the sun came out, and it is here to stay. This happiness in freedom will keep you going, if your Mormon friends and family shun you, gossip about you, harass you, and threaten you--and they will.

My worst day of Mormon harassment after I left was better than my best day in the abusive Mormon cult. Mormons are meanest to their own--and you will no longer be one of them. Learn to say "No", without explaining.

This, along with psychiatcric therapy, will put you on the road to recovery. It takes more than a pill. It takes work, and patience, and time--but what a great adventure it is to discover who you are, and to be fulfilled in life! Try it! (They will always want you (and your tithing money) back, so don't worry about burning any bridges.

I always enjoy your posts, and your good advice! (((hugs)))

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Posted by: Gone4good ( )
Date: January 17, 2019 01:49AM

Yes there is a name for religious trauma syndrome. I am in counseling after realizing it is all false and at 70 I wasted half of my life being lied physically sick now....thanks all you creepy Mormon leaders...thanks for nothing...I want a refund on all those years of tithing and mileage for all the trips to go get scammed!

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Posted by: Lowpriest ( )
Date: January 17, 2019 03:34PM

I was unaware of this term. A quick search identified a couple of interesting articles.

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Posted by: Gone4good ( )
Date: January 17, 2019 10:29PM

Yep...that is what we got! Besides robbed and screwed

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