RIP father. Rest from the wife who didn't want to care for you. Rest from your prodigious posterity many of whom you didn't really know. Rest from a religion that taught you to value it over family while claim the opposite. Rest from the shadows of your father and grandfather. Rest from reading scriptures that taught you your god would influence people's attractions based on skin color. Rest from all this and more. And thank you for the little kindnesses you gave me when I was most vunerable in my youth.
I don't expect to meet you again like all of our family does. You join the past permantly and I'm grateful for it.

No matter what our feelings are towards someone, their deaths seem to impact our lives in some fashion especially if it is a family member.

I'm sorry for your pain EB. Losing a parent, no matter how they treated you is difficult. I know.

Both my parents and my wife are gone. I miss them. They had their time on earth and died.
My perception is this When you are here you are here When you are gone you are gone. so enjoy life while you have it. It is TEMPORARY!!!

I'm sorry for your loss. It's an odd thing when a parent dies. My mom died 18 years ago, and even now I think of questions that I want to ask her, but can't.

I have mixed emotions about this news. I hope somehow only the good memories will persist over time. What a tragic cult legacy. Sending best thoughts to you and your entire family.

Condolences all the same, EB.

My condolences to your family. I imagine this one brings many mixed emotions. My Mom is about to turn 93 and we've always had a difficult relationship. I think she may be a narcissist and unfortunately, I've always been her chosen target.

But I realized the other day that when I lose her, I'll have still lost my Mom. She's the only one I've got. So yeah, a day of mixed emotions, I'm sure.

Be good to yourself and let yourself process all of those emotions. Take time to reflect. *HUGS* EB.

Ditto to all the above, EB. Take care.

EB, you know how much I love you; how much we all love you.

You are a fine man.

I love you too! You are a fine person. May our days continue with the darkness of Mormons and Mormonism furrowing our brows less and less.

Very sorry, EB.

I'm unsure of whom it is that died? Can someone please fillme in.

I believe it is Elderberry's father. EB's extended family is Mormonism in epitome: it spans the range from First Presidency to Rulon Jeffs, from honorable people to Gary Gilmore.

EB's relationships with them are complex.

All true. We are nobodies with somebodies from Mormon history with a little infamy from my mother's side. But many people have this they just probably aren't exMormon. I'm one of less than a handful of former Mormons in an extended family running into dozens upon dozens of people and if you count Rulon then hundreds.

My own little family are all Mormon.

Thanks for clarifying for me.

Elder Berry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We are nobodies with somebodies from
> Mormon history with a little infamy from my
> mother's side.

Well now that's irony. Your grandfather is Rulon Jeffs and yet the infamy is on your MOTHER'S side of the family.

Only in Mormonism. . .

That is ironic!

Also see first thread re this, called "...father signing off". Sorry, can't do link on this phone but it was just a couple of days ago.

So sorry for your loss, EB.

Sorry for your loss EB, losing a parent is hard no matter the circumstances.

I second britintexas' request, EB has the choice to tell us the name or not;

telling the name could help us understand the totality of the situation.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/24/2021 09:35PM by GNPE.

You want the name of father? Sins of the Father. Here it is in all of its infamy.

https://www.deseret.com/1990/5/16/18861968/orem-man-jailed-fined-on-abuse-charge

And here is his obit. Strange to find your own father's name on a page like this on the Internet.

https://memorials.walkersanderson.com/richard-hodson/4508148/index.php

I know you know this, EB, but you don't have to give IRL names. Just saying.

The grieving process is excruciating for many people, even in the best of circumstances (if such are even present at times of mourning). I have found this out the hard way myself several times over. Even more so, obviously, when complications exist (and that's an understatement with your family history).

When relationships are strained (another understatement in your case) complex emotions arise even more so and it can be overwhelming. I hope it helps you to talk about it, knowing that here at least some fellow posters can understand the competing emotions in view of your history and relationship realities. Nobody can ever completely understand one's private feelings and at times that can feel intensely lonely. My family history is decidedly dull and uneventful, compared to yours, for sure, but I can somewhat imagine part of your process. My father and I were close as I was growing up, although he was stern and had high expectations that could be tough to meet and my tender feelings were often hurt. Then in my 30s stuff happened and to my great sorrow we became estranged for a number of years. We were just in the process of repairing that situation but I had only seen him again a few times after a long interval when he suddenly became ill and died without me having a chance to say a proper good-bye the way I would have wished. The grief lingers yet, years later.

I know that is nothing like your story but reading your threads about this has brought up the emotions in me again. I used to think you grieved and then gradually moved on so things felt "better" but it seems that the emotions can arise over and over again even though time passes.

It seems counterintuitive that even with a person who makes a relationship challenging, one can feel connected enough, with an array of emotions, that their death causes pain, sorrow and regret. Easy for others to say good riddance but that's not necessarily how a close family member ends up feeling no matter the circumstances.

And it hurts. In myriad ways, hard to explain. I've always seen grieving as a decidedly lonely road as nobody else knows *exactly* how you feel and I, for one, always feel I need that level of understanding but it's not there, unsurprisingly, as our circumstances and feelings are unique to ourselves. Others can guess or relate but not *feel* how we feel and yes, I've never grown out of that intense need to know someone else really gets it.

As I was recently grieving mightily still for my mother, who died a year ago, and feeling so lonely with it, my sister, who was also close to Mom, said she is better off as it would have been hard for her to handle the isolation of the pandemic. That did not give me solace as of course I would have made sure Mom was looked after and not lonely and it would be far preferable to have her alive with that issue that I could have handled than to be gone from us too soon, again with no time to say good-bye.

Sorry. I'm not meaning to make this all about me. I basically just wanted to say you don't have to explain, or give names, or answer questions, although I know you're upfront and will likely say you don't mind. You're more open than I am. Privacy is my god.

So. Yeah. That's it...



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/25/2021 03:02PM by Nightingale.

Nightingale Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sorry. I'm not meaning to make this all about me.
> I basically just wanted to say you don't have to
> explain, or give names, or answer questions,
> although I know you're upfront and will likely say
> you don't mind. You're more open than I am.
> Privacy is my god.

I appreciate the sharing so I don't feel so alone. And I don't mind.

Sometimes I wish I were a more private person. But it is terribly difficult for me. My psychology in my philosophy of self lead me to egoism like smoking leads to injecting oneself with hard drugs! ;)

"For example, a cigarette smoker acts on his desire to smoke; smoking causes health problems that are not in one's best interest. Oftentimes, one's desires can lead to behaviors and consequences that are not in one's best interest, though the initial action may have provided pleasure or avoided pain."
https://www.learningtogive.org/resources/egoism

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-01-dies-magic-mushroom-tea-vein.html

> So. Yeah. That's it...

That's appreciated. I have felt like an orphan most of my life. It is nice to hear from other orphans.

Elder Berry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I appreciate the sharing so I don't feel so alone.

I wanted to send some musical solace. Looking up "you are never alone", I came across various versions of the following song. You can ignore the (few) references to angels and heaven and otherwise maybe it will fill a little space, if only momentarily. The video contains some heartwarming images:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1Fz7SMS-mI


(And don't worry: I'm not calling you Baby!)

But know that at least on this board you aren't alone, EB.

Beautiful expressions of hope in a dark hour. Thank you.

As usual, lots of wisdom in Nightingale's post.

Strained relationships can exacerbate grief quite a bit.

Sincere condolences, EB.

Take care EB, I’m so sorry for your loss.

Can't imagine how you must feel at the end of that complicated history, although some of it may linger a while.

All the best to you.

Thank you all for your condolences. You never think that they can die.

They never die.

In Requiem for a Nun, William Faulkner observed that "the past is never dead. It isn't even past."

That is surely true for our parents and for the Mormonism that shaped our childhoods.

Wise words.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/26/2021 12:19AM by kathleen.

EB:

My condolences also go out to you.

Difficult parents can be difficult in death too.

Condolences EB.

Thanks. Hope you are holding up as well!

I'm doing ok friend. Thank you.

Good to hear. Here's to another year at RfM.

Indeed. It and friends like you are important in my life

A lot of people say it’s important to stay very busy at a time like this. But it’s been my experience and my advice to people is that getting lots of rest will help you more than anything right now.

Too late. I've spiraled into getting NetFlix and binge watching late into the night to keep the memories at bay.

Family is complicated. Some more than others. I am glad that you have some good memories. Hold on to them and don't dwell on the rest. No matter your background you are our Elder Berry and every time I see your name it makes me smile and think of the movie I love so much :). You just keep on being you, you are doing a great job.

I'm trying to "keep sweet" so people will like my whine.

Ugh! I hate that phrase. I keep imagining kids being asked that by their fundy bishop. It's creepy.

Happy binge watching!

What a phrase. It is so apropos for my family and a cult. Never mention the negative. Always keep positive no matter what. That was my dad's balm.

I agree with Susan I/S, that family can be complicated, and glad that you have also have good memories. This is something that surprised me in my own situation. Toxic family. Parents gone. But even after deciding to estrange myself completely, I realize that I do have some good memories, but in the net (for me) they aren't enough to lower my guard or change boundaries that I've established. Protecting one's self and immediate family come first (IMO).

Why was his surname Hodson instead of Jeffs?

He changed his name from Rulon Jeffs Jr because he considered his stepfather more his father. He probably hated the name Rulon but I don't know for sure. My grandfather didn't adopt my father until he was 30 but my father changed his name at 18.

A little backstory.

https://culteducation.com/group/1099-polygamist-groups/17294-rulon-jeffs-patriarch-president-prophet-for-polygamy.html

As you may recall, my long estranged brother and semi-estranged mother both passed away a little over a year ago. Then my father remarried some black widow he met at the temple less than 4 months later and told his kids to suck it (even the TBM one) because he was going to be 'fully immersed in a Christ-filled life'.

I admit that the pain and lonely stress of it all still lingers. It lingers so hard in fact, that my body can now no longer produce cortisol and I am in the first stage of adrenal failure at 37 years old.

So do whatever it is you love everyday if you can. Get a punching bag and utilize it. Watch things that make you laugh. Read a good book and go for a walk everyday. Make art and then destroy it. Call your friends. Let those tears flow. Or screams- in my case.

My condolences and a vast embrace held for you EB. You are not alone. Much much love to you from this fellow orphan.

Wow.

I don't have much to say except that your story sounds really unfortunate. I'm sorry you are going through those things and wish you the very best.

And to the extent that you resemble EB, you must be a fine human being.

You will never know how much I appreciate your reply. I'm in tears. My brother is shaking in his cortisol failure and it was hard to watch last night. Your advice was a comfort. I'm hiding you in my heart as I prepare to see them again today.

Yea, though I walk through the Utah valley of the shadow of my father, I will fear no evil: for my rfm friends are with me; you are all a comfort me and example to me.

I got your back EB! I'm sure everyone here can agree.

I hope you made it through all the visitations and rituals mostly unscathed; I know how terrifying, crazed, and surreal it can all be.
My thoughts are with you.

I don't know if you have come back to Utah for the funeral. I didn't know how I'd feel at my mom's viewing (she didn't want one), but I went in the room and saw her and knew she wasn't there anymore. That was actually good for me as I always think I'm burying my dogs alive and I have to keep asking my "husband" if they were actually dead and I thought I'd feel like that about my mom.

My dad died 2 months later (February 1st 12 years ago). He was inconsolable after my mom died and he and she argued endlessly, but I knew they loved each other. It was tough to lose them both so close, but I had a lot of reasons to find some peace with the whole situation.

BUT there are many times since that I have mourned them more than I did then. I've said before that my old boss asked me if it ever gets better (after her father died) and I said, "No, it just gets different." I still mourn them. I always will. I have the opportunity to visit their home since disabled brother lives there and there are good things and bad things about that. I could never handle the house being sold. We had to sell his beloved farm (was in the family from homesteading times). I hated farming as a child, but now I love farms and farming. So many wonderful memories of my siblings and my parents on the farm, and my grandparents. My grandfather was named Romeo. He was an amazing man. None of them were ever THAT mormon.

The funeral, the viewing, TOUGH TIMES. It is surreal. I know that I will die with the pain still present. I tend to believe in an afterlife and I take some comfort in feeling they are together.

Yes. I'm going to be thinking of you when I sing with all 10 siblings that cheesy rewrite of I'll walk with God my father was so proud of. I'll sing his Mormon words of the song he loved. I'll listen to how many people they estimated he processed in their temple. I'll be the good son in deed but not spirit.

Elder Berry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'll be the good son in deed but not spirit.

At times, this is the noble option.

If you want you can watch

https://player.vimeo.com/video/505775795

I liked my youngest sister's comments. She didn't know the father I knew. He was more of a father to her than most of us. The father I knew could be mean, angry, and violent. I was the only one to see this side I believe. In his positive and service and social outside his family world he couldn't handle rebellion and angst and a child victim of lifelong abuse.

Didn't fit as anyone could see watching this funeral.

On a funny note. As a young teenager I slept over in this chapel and streaked through this building and at one point was buck naked at that podium.

Family relationships can be complex. Losing someone can be heart wrenching, and dredge up old memories and rip open old wounds. It tends to be a time at which a lot of things resurface, even if only in our thoughts.

As a neverMo, I tend to read more than I post. For what it's worth, let me say that I always appreciate your posts and wisdom. For me, if there's a silver lining to mine own struggles in life, it's when I can help someone else who faces similar issues. I'm certain that you've faced a lot more than I have, so please know that you've helped me face mine. Thanks.

My sincerest condolences to you.

Thank you. Never mind about never Mormon. It is only the subject and doesn't matter. The object is recovery and I'm glad I've had a tiny part in yours.

People who understand are rare and precious.