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Posted by: Thread Killer ( )
Date: October 29, 2010 08:48PM

OK, no farting in church or drinking stories, just wondering (mostly rhetorically) what the pundits think:

Has any evidence for the "second Spaulding manuscript" ever been found? How much contemporary stuff still exists re: 'View of the Hebrews', etc.

Why did the 3 and 8 witnesses have to be out in the forest, when JS could have simply pulled the plates out of the secret squirrel hiding place in his house in front of a nice toasty fire?

How plausible are the deathbed Rigdon and Cowdery testimonies to the BoM? That's the last thing I'd think of if it was the last thing I was going to think of on MY deathbed....

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Posted by: JBryan ( )
Date: October 29, 2010 09:53PM

1. There are always seconds in Mormonism. A second Spaulding Manuscript, a second Cumorah, a second Book of Abraham scroll. I wouldn't put too much stock in it.

2.Three were out in the woods because it was as good a place as any to dupe them:

Martin Harris: Was known for being very unstable religiously. Over his whole life he changed his affiliation over 13 times.He said he saw the plates with "the eyes of faith and not with the natural eyes".

David Whitmer: Changed his story about seeing the plates and later told of finding them lying in a field and later still, told Orson Pratt that they were on a table with all sorts of brass plates, gold plates, the Sword of Laban, the ‘Director' and the Urim and Thumim. (Millennial Star, vol. XL, pp. 771-772)

Denounced by Joseph Smith as a "dumb beast to ride" and "an ass to bray out cursings instead of blessings." (History of the Church, vol. 3, p 228)

Oliver Cowdery: In 1841 the Mormons published a poem which stated "Or Book of Mormon not his word, because denied by Oliver". (Seasons and Times, Vol 2, p482)

While the Mormon church claims he rejoined them in the fall of 1848, (Historical Record, 1886, vol. 5, p. 201) they also accused him later that year, with trying to "raise up the Kingdom again" with the Apostate, William E. McLellin.(The Mormon frontier, Diary of Hosea Stout, vol. 2, p. 336)

3. Given their tract record, I'd say they were simply not believeable.

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Posted by: Heresy ( )
Date: October 30, 2010 12:18AM

is affidavits from people who claim they heard him read it and it contained 'came to pass', Nephi and Lehi. The manuscript itself is lost, or possibly in the hands of the church.

There is evidence that Spaulding and Rigdon crossed paths. A document was discovered showing their names on the same post office list if I remember correctly.

The intriguing part of the whole theory is that a couple of new pieces of evidence like that have come to light that strengthen it. Contrast that with the bits of evidence that turn up strengthening Mormonism. Right.

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Posted by: AmIDarkNow? ( )
Date: October 30, 2010 01:23AM

before the publishing of the BOM.

As far as I'm concerned Rigdon was proven a liar when he said he had "never" been in the town where Spaulding lived. Folks there recognized Rigdon. Post office records were found and verify the fact that Rigdon and Spaulding shared the same damn post office.

How do you do that Mr. Rigdon? You were there Mr. Rigdon. You f ing lied! Everything now makes sense. Rigdon was the liar and everyone else was telling the truth.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2010 01:25AM by AmIDarkNow?.

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Posted by: Thread Killer ( )
Date: October 30, 2010 02:39AM

She recalled that both Spaulding & Rigdon came and went for a short period of time in the same post office, and therefore would have probably run into each other. The apologists would scoff at that, while at the same time, if it SUPPORTED the BoM in some way, it would be a "bullseye"!

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