https://today.yougov.com/topics/politics/articles-reports/2021/01/20/americans-now-see-other-americans-biggest-threat

54% of Americans believe ‘other’ Americans pose the greatest threat to their lifestyle.
How the hell did we get here, 50yrs after MLK?
I just got a new job and did 2 weeks worth of sensitivity training.Nothing in the training was any more advanced than what I learned in kindergarten, be nice, don’t treat anybody in a way you wouldn’t want to be treated, treat people like human beings worthy of respect, etc. for 2 weeks. I asked my Boss, how the hell we got to this point where we need to relearn what we should have learned in kindergarten?
She said,’The more I work with people, the more I realize they’re just a bunch of spoiled brats.’

There are no ‘others’ just ‘us’, Americans, all in the same boat, capitalism at its zenith.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/27/2021 10:55AM by schrodingerscat.

One word: Racism

Two words: Apocalyptic Christianity

These two work in tandem to produce the hell we are living in.

It has now been about two thousand years since the birth of that Jesus guy. Per the Book of Revelation (and amplified by Cleon Skousen), now is the time when the great battle is to begin. They see themselves as the obvious generation to bring it about, and a fighting force requires absolute uniformity in the ranks. Any dissenters are therefore traitors.

They really want a war, and they think that this time there will be absolutely no ambiguity at the end about who the good guys were, because Jesus himself will just tell everybody.

My thoughts, anyway.

Jesus.
I hope you are wrong but I fear you might be right.
The good news is Biden is doing about as well as Obama, digging out of the shithole his predecessor left us in.
Unfortunately they all work for their puppet masters, the Donor Class.

Sensitivity training... What a double meaning! Now we are so sensitive that we must escape all opposing points of view. Either to a safe space or on the block button. We get horrified that someone votes a different way or that what you accept is mainstream is a political pipedream.

As I have asked my gun owning friends: "Why do you need a gun?" They usually respond: "For protection." "Protection from what?" I ask. Usually there's not real answer to that so my thinking is: 'Why someone with a gun, of course.'

I think fear is a factor in modern life in America. Fear of people, fear of losing "stuff" such that human life is cheap in its defense, and fear of the freely elected government they put into place.

Do any other western nations live with the same fears. I am inclined to think they don't.

You have a gift for understatement.

I would add, however, the minor caveat that there are some real reasons to keep a gun on hand for self protection. As Betsy Devos reminded us, for example, in Wyoming schools need firearms "to protect from potential grizzlies."

You live near potential grizzlies, don't you?

Nothing wrong with understatement especially in the context of the topic. It is perhaps a better response to what I observe as ott reaction in many. There may be grizzlies in Idaho but not any in my part of Idaho. Life is pretty benign here both in terms of reality and on the irrational fear front which I why I can say with certainty that I will never consider the need for a gun.

LV. I rereading your post I realize that my natural irony gauge had malfunctioned.

I will mark this day on my calendar so I can celebrate annually my having slipped a joke past you!

Sometimes my penny drops in farthing.

Are you fine with taking guns away from police too?
The 2nd amendment is for protection against tyranny by the government. If you'll disarm both the government and the people, then your argument is consistent.

Fear is the great American motivator. That’s why the social safety net is almost non-existent. It’s not a money problem. There is plenty of money in America. We could have all of the nice things Europe has. But then who would fear losing their job?

No, if you’re poor you must suffer even if it costs the rest of society extra. It’s like India’s caste system but with better mobility.

The colonizers of America were afflicted by a disease caused by yellow metal. Maybe we’re seeing this disease in its terminal stages.

Those Americans would be absolutely correct, if they only knew that it’s their elected leaders and the Oligarchy those leaders serve and protect that are their greatest enemies.

Agreed. I am MUCH more afraid of being gunned down by the suburban goobers in my state (and I'm not talking about the known criminals) than I am of being bombed by North Korea. The legislature of our great state of Gooberville, passed a bill yesterday that Governor Jethro said he will sign that makes it legal for anyone over 18 to carry a weapon, openly or concealed. No permit, no training, no background check required. It's one reason I'm glad I like driving very small cars. Much less chance of being too close to the line when I pull into a parking lot. We've had shootings, but "model citizens" over such things.

Although I think you’re post was mis-thread and was intended elsewhere, I agree with you:

From a Canadian point of view, this image is bizarre at best:

https://twitter.com/13AgentofChaos/status/1158587741728378880?s=20

“Honey, care for a latte?”

“Yes, let’s; just gotta get my keys & wallet & gun...”

I don't think much of the supervisor's attitude. Maybe she needs a wider scope of experience or a new job. I don't think her opinion makes your premise. Too small a sample.

As for "what we learned in kindergarten", honest question here: What do you think would have added to the sensitivity training to make it more insightful, enlightening and helpful? Clearly, it would be a positive move to know better how to address the apparently widening gulf amongst the various groups.

I don't think it's as simple as implementing a quick fix here or there or even seminars for adults in workplaces.

To me it seems obvious.
Prejudice never should have survived beyond Lincoln, but it did.
It never should have survived MLK, but it did.
It never should have survived the Civil Rights movement, but it did.
It never should have survived mapping the human genome, which proved we're all 99.9% genetically identical. So what we're talking about is a 1/10 of 1% difference between the whitest white guy and the darkest African woman. Meaning, what we have in common is far greater than what gives us genetic diversity. Without that diversity, we'd all be dead from the first virus that killed one of us. So we should really value and celebrate that 1/10th of 1% that amounts to the difference between life and death, literally.
Despite what we've learned from the narrative written on our genome, and every genome we've mapped, humans are still stubbornly committed to the racist narratives and bogus myths they inherited. Why? Because they falsely believe what empowers them is disempowering 'others'. By denying black people the vote, or women equal pay, or gays equal rights to marriage, white people get their way of life, guns, god and easy money, 2 cars in the garage on a 3 bedroom rambler on a cul-de-sac in the burbs, a comfy nest egg and screw everybody else!
Forget about those growing tent cities in the greenbelts and parks in the city, in every city.
Forget the fact that our cities have become sets for the walking dead, with drug addicted homeless zombies laying around everywhere in the middle of the day.
My 401K has never looked better.

I've said it before--farmers need guns. My dad had to shoot things like skunks and raccoons. They would either get under my grandparents' house or bother the dog and sheep.

Ever have to put a horse down? Because it can't get up and the vet isn't going to go all the way to West Corinne? My dad, cousins, brothers hunted geese and ducks on the farm. And one time my dad had to kill an eagle who tried to attack me.

I grew up with guns. We've never had a gun accident in all my almost 64 years amongst the whole family.

I'm sure my brother probably has at least 10 guns. And we were all raised Democrat and my siblings are all Democrat. My dad was VERY DEMOCRAT here in Utah and he always owned guns.

No one is suggesting farmers should be deprived of the weapons they need to manage their farms.

whole lotta skunks in the Big Cities!


Given that everyone else is armed, when a person comes of age, why shouldn't he/she become a one-person militia?

Hopefully we can all agree farmers and ranchers need guns, or dogs. I prefer dogs. But I grew up on a farm and grew up with guns. My Dad had guns and I used them to hunt pests, mainly rats, squirrels, rabbits, crows, coyotes, weasels. Where I grew up we had cougar and bears. We still do. One killed a biker recently. I’ve been a gun owner my whole life.
I’d gladly agree to be regulated, license, register and insure my guns and be licensed to carry in public if I thought it’d make my grandkids safer in school.
But if the problem is mental health, why did we turn our city streets into defacto insane asylums and drug addict shelters and make it legal for any crazy crackhead to buy as many AR15s and ammo as they can carry?



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 03/27/2021 10:07PM by schrodingerscat.

I believe I get what you're trying to say, but many, many jurisdictions are trying to see to it that it is NOT "legal for any crazy crackhead to buy as many AR15s and ammo as they can carry".

Because I do not believe that human life (other than mine) is sacred, I'm a big fan of class warfare, except that everyone stands down from December 15 to December 29 every year. Those caught shooting at someone else during that 14 day period have to wear iron mittens (so, no trigger finger...) for 30 days.

So many people wail and carry on about what a blood bath it'll be if everyone went around armed all the time. And I agree, it WOULD be a blood bath! ...for about a year...

Then Utopia!! Everyone who survived that first year would be polite and honorable, no matter what their base character was like... Because everyone would by that time recognize that no matter how fast you are, there's someone faster.

Prove me wrong!

Any wonder our colleges were glorified crisis clinics with fully armed fascists Proud Boys and Patriot Prayer militias showing up on campuses threatening to gun down Libs/Antifa, while we are brainwashing them into the ‘Wokeness CULT’ and telling them to go fight the Fascists?
Like Bill Maher said,’Any wonder they’d rather snort Xanax and twerk on a squad car on Miami Beach?!”
In the middle of a pandemic.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 03/27/2021 11:58PM by schrodingerscat.

Jesus.
And I thought I was dark.

Looks a lot like Handmaid's Tale at the center of all of those narratives on that Vin Diagram of dystopian futures.

I don't think we'll end up there. I hope not anyways, and I don't think we're there, but we're damn close.
I think that Nature finds a balance and a way for life to continue, or it has for the past 4billion years, the vast majority of the history of the Earth.
If not life, at least genes, DNA, which has a way to replicate, if it has to, nonmetabolically and spontaneously.
There is an underlying organization that's based upon math, fractal math, on the very small scale and the very large scale.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/28/2021 01:37AM by schrodingerscat.

A family friend, Thomas Blatt ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Blatt ), escaped from the infamous Sobibor extermination camp in WWII. One poignant thing he said was that he didn't feel much safer outside the camp than inside. Europe at that time was so fractured by partisanships that it wasn't easy to know who was going to rob you, beat you, or even kill you, and they could do so with impunity.

Sadly, the U.S. seems to be moving in that direction. Some might say it always has been that way, and that the "lines" are simply shifting. Regardless, it's the ugly side of human nature. It takes a certain level of sophistication to rise above our animal instincts (us/them, mine/y̶o̶u̶r̶s̶mine, etc). Some people just can't do it.

There's nothing implicitly wrong with taking the title of this thread at face value.

Are most of us confronted by 'enemy Americans' during our normal day?

Well, obviously it depends. Cops at work and soldiers on the battleground are at one extreme and you can fill in whatever Pollyanna-ish script you'd like at the other end.

It's only logical that as many as are able, push towards the Pollyanna-ish extreme as much as they are can, especially when their children are concerned.

How much has changed in America's 'good v. bad' in your lifetime? Obviously the older you are, the more you may have seen change. I submit that it's really just the labels that have increased, and not so much the danger.

Confrontations seem to have escalated, but what happens when you're not one of the ones doing the confronting or being confronted?

I believe that for the vast majority of us, drunk drivers remain our biggest threat.

Yours Truly,

Pollyanna

The more things change the more they stay the same? Remember when we said cool instead of chill? Thank goodness we have evolved.

I like what you say about those who have lived longer see more change. At this stage of my life, what I have seen is long slow change, some good some not, that the younger generation can't see because they want their Utopia and they want it NOW!

Because of that push to fix everything now though, often we do an over correction which can be good. Shake things up. Then things slowly slide back to just a notch above where they were before. Two steps forward one step back. Not saying that is right or wrong, but just what I've seen in my seven decades. Quick fixes don't seem to last.


But the topic----The one major change I see, which is a double edged sword, is the way technology has made it easy for the like-minded to connect-- which fuels divisiveness. You don't have to ride your mule over to Andy's house any more to kvetch. You just get out your phone and choose to be a Montague or a Capulet.

As long as the weapon of choice is thumbs on an iPhone we may be okay. Except staring at their phones the way they do they won't notice the approach of the drunk driver.

Commerce evens things out sooner or later. The Dollar still determines all cuz Pollyanna needs a new car like the rest of us.

And . . . divisiveness is what allows the survival of the fittest: "Tra I Due Litiganti Il Terzo Gode"(Two argue and a third benefits).

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2013/02/25/172885551/no-more-negro-for-census-bureau-forms-and-surveys

Considering the US Census only took ‘Negroe’ off of the US Census a decade ago, it is about par for the course since they still only have 5 categories and “Mexican” isn’t one of them, neither is Hispanic or Latino.

> and “Mexican” isn’t one of them,
> neither is Hispanic or Latino.


The Census Bureau doesn't agree with you:
https://2020census.gov/en/about-questions/hispanic-origin.html



The category “Hispanic, Latino, or Spanish origin" includes all individuals who identify with one or more nationalities or ethnic groups originating in Mexico, Puerto Rico, Cuba, Central and South America, and other Spanish cultures. Examples of these groups include, but are not limited to, Mexican or Mexican American, Puerto Rican, Cuban, Salvadoran, Dominican, and Colombian. “Hispanic, Latino or Spanish origin” also includes groups such as Guatemalan, Honduran, Spaniard, Ecuadorian, Peruvian, Venezuelan, etc. If a person is not of Hispanic, Latino, or Spanish origin, answer "No, not of Hispanic, Latino, or Spanish origin".

There are individual checkboxes for people who identify as:

Not of Hispanic, Latino, or Spanish origin

Mexican, Mexican Am., Chicano

Puerto Rican

Cuban

Another Hispanic, Latino, or Spanish origin (for example, Salvadoran, Dominican, Colombian, Guatemalan, Spaniard, Ecuadorian, etc.)



The way I read it, you can literally check a box that says you are "Mexican, Mexican Am., Chicano"

https://www.census.gov/topics/population/race/about.html

The U.S. Census Bureau must adhere to the 1997 Office of Management and Budget (OMB) standards on race and ethnicity which guide the Census Bureau in classifying written responses to the race question:

White – A person having origins in any of the original peoples of Europe, the Middle East, or North Africa.

Black or African American – A person having origins in any of the Black racial groups of Africa.

American Indian or Alaska Native – A person having origins in any of the original peoples of North and South America (including Central America) and who maintains tribal affiliation or community attachment.

Asian – A person having origins in any of the original peoples of the Far East, Southeast Asia, or the Indian subcontinent including, for example, Cambodia, China, India, Japan, Korea, Malaysia, Pakistan, the Philippine Islands, Thailand, and Vietnam.

Native Hawaiian or Other Pacific Islander – A person having origins in any of the original peoples of Hawaii, Guam, Samoa, or other Pacific Islands.

So your statement is based on what you've read about adherence to a 1997 standard, which you think trumps (pardon the expression) the language in the actual 2020 Census?

I was quoting the actual census! It says what it says about being able to check a box to ID as "Mexican, Mexican Am., Chicano"!

But they could be wrong...

It's on the US Census website, where I got my information.

Last Revised: October 16, 2020

Okay, so you win, again!

I remember signing the census form, which didn't have a category for "Hispanic".
I don't think it's great. I get into an argument with them every time they conduct a census.
For the 2010 Census I wrote in "Other", and wrote in "Not a racist"
I got a phone call from them, saying, you need to choose a race from one of our five categories.
I said, "Is there a test to tell what race I am?"
The Census worker said, "No sir. You don't know what race you are?"
"Yes. The human race."
That's not a choice sir, you have to pick either "White, Black, Asian, Native American or Pacific Islander."
So I said, "Well, I'm not white, because snow is white and I'm a lot more tan than white. And I'm not black. Coal is black and I'm a lot lighter than coal. I'm not Asian American Indian or Pacific Islander, so how about Beige?"
"No sir, beige is not a race. Look, your name sounds European. I'm going to just put down white."
I said, "Then why'd you bother calling?"
Just doing my job sir.

Last year, same thing, but I checked, "Other" and wrote "Anti-racist"
I get a phone call from the census bureau worker who tells me I need to choose one of the five categories.
I tell him, "Human race"
He tells me that's not a race.
I said, "Well, I took a DNA test that tells me I'm 2.8% Neanderthal so how about Neanderthal?"
He laughed and said, "No, Neanderthal is not a choice."
I said, "Well, we're all 99.9% genetically identical, according to the map of the human genome, so, we're all essentially 99.9% African and I'm part Asia and Native American, according to my DNA test results. So what do you call that?
African mostly I guess, with a little Neanderthal mixed in.
How about mutt, is that an option?
No sir. I'm just going to mark down African.
Fine with me.

Lyndsey Graham today confirming the premise that Americans live in fear by admitting that he owns an AR-15 abnd is ready to "pick off" marauders in the event of a calamity.

I wonder how his pea shooter will do against a military grade laser armed drone swarm? I just hope they get it on video.

People who own AR-15's live in fear? Do people who own hunting rifles live in fear as well?

No. But they use them for target practice and eat what they kill.

I use my AR-15 for target practice. And since my AR-15 has the EXACT characteristics of a hunting rifle, I suppose, if I were a hunter, I could hunt with it as well.

So, since basically an AR-15 is nothing more than a meaner looking hunting rifle, why no calls for bans on hunting rifles? Since knives and blunt instruments kill more people than rifles, why not have to register to purchase cutlery, baseball bats, and hammers?

Statistics for 2019, the latest I was able to find. Total murders in the US 16,425 of which 10,258 were with guns. Clearly most were with guns and not knives or blunt instruments.

Personally I think Graham is angling for the VP slot if Trump runs again in 2024.

I don't agree. I think Graham is aiming directly for the presidency. He has abased himself for years but does not actually like Trump. His hope is that Trump voters remain strong but that Trump loses his direction, leaving Graham to pick up the Trumpites and then begin moving back towards the center.

Lot's Wife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't agree. I think Graham is aiming directly
> for the presidency. He has abased himself for
> years but does not actually like Trump. His hope
> is that Trump voters remain strong but that Trump
> loses his direction, leaving Graham to pick up the
> Trumpites and then begin moving back towards the
> center.

How loyal would the Maga cult be with those male escorts coming forward?

They don't seem to be too upset yet. Those he-man professional victims had no trouble accepting Trump's personal immorality and they haven't assailed Graham yet, so I think Graham is correct to think he can inherit the mantle.

Remember that the GOP is no longer the party of personal ethics and character.

kentish Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Statistics for 2019, the latest I was able to find. Total murders in the US 16,425 of which 10,258 were with guns. Clearly most were with guns and not knives or blunt instruments.

Guns? Nice side-step. Kinda Mormon-ish behavior. Don't worry, old habits die hard..

I thought we were discussing AR-15's and rifles. When compared to them your stat fails MISERABLY. LOL!!

Perhaps a better comparison might by the number of people killed in mass shootings with various rifles as opposed to the number killed in mass murders by knives and blunt instruments. But then as I stated the issue under discussion is not guns per se but the paranoia and fear that motivates many to need them, a fear that is not evident is most other western nations. Hence the topic.

What is the matter with you?

Rhetorical question.

The issue is not so much the gun but the paranoia behind his need for one.

What a scared, closeted gay man that Graham allegedly is who is playing to the worst elements of society to keep his senator title.

Hopefully, one of those male escorts he allegedly hires will rip up the alleged hush contracts he allegedly enters in with each alleged escort.

(He allegedly likes being called "Lady Graham," while being choked and gagged. Search the net. More escorts are coming forward...)

Your first sentence nails it. IMO, that guy is a giant wind sock who appears to have made a few secret deals that he needs to protect.

When people are encouraged to be domestic terrorists, no wonder people perceive fellow Americans as enemies who want to dismantle democracy at any cost.

Graham is an imbecile. What he fails to comprehend is that, in this country, many of the marauders will also have AR-15s. His own isn't going to be of much help when facing a bunch of them.

We seem to have this idea that we can throw people together of different colors, cultures, religions, and beliefs, and everyone is somehow supposed to magically get along because that's what our founding documents and laws say. But in reality, it can be a very difficult thing to accomplish. Sometimes I think we need to give ourselves credit for doing as well as we currently are doing.

I think it can go a long way if you feel that you and your neighbors share the same values in terms of respect for people, property, safety, well-being, the law, etc. As for coworkers, the desire to work together for mutual benefit can also go a long way.

The media has drifted from investigating and reporting events.

Their primary goal these days is to collect clicks. Facts are a nuisance, they get in the way of salacious content.

Unfortunately, the public seems to love what they produce and clamor for more. The anger and hatred that is a result of the media’s new morality will continue for as long as sensationalism replaces facts and consumers continue to base their views and opinions on fabricated facts.

I've said this before.

A good analogy is the "Planet Of The Apes" film series.

You and people like you (humans, "white" people) are no longer dominant in a new world ruled by "others" (apes, "non-whites").

The crux of the problem is the perceived need to be (a) "superior" and (b) "separate."

Think about what abandoning these concepts would mean.

No more need to try and create race based enclaves or control of regions by various subterfuges or schemes — including the use of religion or the expression of religious faith as a tool for hatred or discrimination.

No more need to try and exclude people from neighbourhoods or schools, parks, or other public spaces.

No more need to always keep looking for the next bete noir to keep people living in fear (communists, satanists, child molesters, gays, goths, trans people, etc).

No need need to amass personal arsenals to await the apocalyptic "Ragnarok" style race war that is always supposed to be "just around the corner."

No more need to keep constantly seeking new ways to keep "other" people from voting.

No more fear of loss of identity though race mixing or cultural genocide.

Would things be perfect?

No.

But many of the current "problems" we face would no longer be problems.

The concept that is labelled 'racism' is not really about race per se.

it is about cultural differences.

Most people prefer to exist within their bubble of common culture.

When others impose 'change' or other cultural shifts, many people find that to be uncomfortable and tend to double down on supporting their customary cultural attitudes.

Gradual cultural shifts tend to be accepted more readily than sudden changes. Sudden changes are generally resisted because of the discord and fear of how one will be affected.

What we are experiencing these days (in my opinion) is change that is coming too quickly for people to patch new ideas into the fabric of their cultural beliefs and habits.

I've lived in places right here in the USA where there were few people like me, looked like me, spoke the same language I did, or even ate the food I liked. Even the beer ads and Army recruiting ads were in Spanish.


I did I freak out or complain about how "they" were taking over?

No.

I knew they had lived there long before that part of America was part of the USA.

Guess what? Me, either!

How did we get there?

Yesterday drove by a home and business flying a big FU#* BIDEN and FU#* THOSE WHO VOTED FOR HIM flag. Like the Trump 2020 flags - but crass and flying for all to see on a 25 foot flagpole.

Supposedly conservative "christian" area.

The former President and his tactics of bullying,intimidation and pushing lies as truth have pushed us to this. Those following him seem to love it and will excuse anything as long as he says it is OK. Worst then MoronicPriesthood Central.