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Posted by: glenlassan ( )
Date: April 30, 2021 04:50PM

As many/most here probably know already the temple names are procedurally generated, and really easy to look up.
https://www.fullerconsideration.com/TempleNameOracle/

For the past few days I've been wondering. Does anyone have stories of their new name being used to target them either for bullying, or a scam?

I ask because despite the fact that it's easy to look up; many active Mormons don't know that they are procedurally generated, and given the fact that Utah is the "white collar crime/scam capital" of the USA I have a hard time imagining that the new name hasn't been used as part of an affinity scam at some point. Think "How did he know my new name? He must have been inspired by the holy spirit just like he said! This deal he's offering me can't possibly be a scam/pyramid scheme!"

Likewise, I can easily imagine some unscrupulous person using knowledge of someone's new name to bully/harass them.

I also can't imagine that the Mormon-controlled press in Utah would do much to publicize this kind of thing either. If anything; I would imagine if either of those kinds of events occurred; it would be intentionally hushed up.

so, story time! Does anyone here have a story of their new name/temple name being used against them as one kind of leverage or the other?

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Posted by: Tyson Dunn ( )
Date: April 30, 2021 05:19PM

Figuring you learn it once and you only use it once, anyone coming up to you and purporting to know your new name and wanting to use for something would seem highly unlikely at best.

I suspect most people in that situation would just clam up or tell the person that they were violating sacred covenants.


Moreover, while it's easy to look up the new name for a given day, the scammer would need to know what day their target actually took out their endowment, which frankly is just a shot in the dark.

Note, it's NOT based on the target's birthday or something else the scammer could easily look up.

So, I'm guessing this basically never happens.


EDIT

That said, I suppose I could imagine a con artist playing the odds, and trying for that 1/31 hit for either Mosiah or Amulek for men or Ruth or Lucy for women who look like they might have gone through the temple after 1982.

You wouldn't need to hit a lot, just that 1 in 31. A little skulduggery, the scammer might be able to manipulate the mark even more with some mentalism feints.

Tyson



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/30/2021 05:35PM by Tyson Dunn.

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Posted by: subeamnotlogedin ( )
Date: May 02, 2021 08:17PM

One of my cousins posted on facebook that her son got endowed on Saturday April 17.
Lol now I can look up his name.

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Posted by: glenlassan ( )
Date: May 02, 2021 11:04PM

Yup! Try not to be a dick about it though!

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: May 06, 2021 07:57PM

What would likely happen if you just posted the link to the temple names website?

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Posted by: cl2notloggedin ( )
Date: May 04, 2021 04:31PM

special name that I waited all my life for. The other name you picked is my sister's actual name.

I went through the temple on an odd day. Not any day that anyone could figure out unless they had access to temple records. I don't see how anyone could scam you with your temple name especially since you aren't given a last name.

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Posted by: blackcoatsdaughter ( )
Date: May 01, 2021 06:02AM

Yeah it only happens once. I'D have to look mine up to know what it is.

If a scammer called me and used it, I wouldn't think they have special knowledge about me. I'd be like, "You have the wrong number."

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: May 01, 2021 10:57AM

I consider it being bullied that I was told to believe my secret name was special. I walked out of the temple that first time wondering why I got the name that I did.

As a Lamanite, was there was some special message in being given the name Mormon? Why, of ALLLLL the people on the Earth, had I been chosen to share that name with the guy blowing the horn on the top of many temple? (But not 'my' temple, the St. George franchise.)

It was actually disturbing to find out the truth of the matter.



If you read the articles at the bottom of the temple names website, there are some pretty funny stories...

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Posted by: glenlassan ( )
Date: May 01, 2021 11:09AM

Got a link? I don't see any articles at the bottom of the website I linked to.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: May 01, 2021 05:51PM

Okay, so they weren't "articles" but more like footnotes, which I've copied and pasted. They're at the bottom of http://www.fullerconsideration.com/TempleNameOracle/


        August 31, 1880 to December 31, 1964

New names were chosen at the discretion of the temple worker.

In a meeting with the workers in the Saint George temple, John D. T. McAllister of the temple presidency said, "With regard to new Names, give easy names to be understood: Scripture names or names not in the Scripture, there are many good names of those who have lived upon the earth which are easy to understand.
"Don't give any fanciful names, [and] be Sure they get the New Name and that they understand it."
    (Minutes, Meeting of Workers in St. George Temple, August 31, 1880, typed excerpt, Buerger Papers)


    In 1970 a letter was sent from the First Presidency to all temple presidents regarding procedures in transmitting a patron's new name, which included the following text:

"Because of its sacred and confidential nature, this information should not be transmitted by mail or by telephone; therefore, the First Presidency recommends that you use a simple code system which will be made known to each temple president who will keep it in a special file. The information requested may then be transmitted by letter or if necessary by telephone using combinations of numbers. The information will be given only by a temple president to another temple president - never to the patron directly.

Of course, the need for this applies only to those sisters who were endowed prior to January 1, 1965, when the present new name system was adopted.

The method is this: Instead of spelling out the new name, the numbers corresponding to the letters in the new name should be transmitted along with a person's name and date of the endowment.

example:
A B C D E F G H I J K L M N O P Q R S T U V W X Y Z
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26

If the name given were Martha, the numbers transmitted would be: "The information you seek on behalf of ________ is 13-1-18-20-8-1."

We ask that after January 1, 1971, all temple presidents use the simple code system herein outlined when transmitting the new name on behalf of patrons who need such information."
    (Joseph Fielding Smith, Harold B. Lee, and N. Eldon Tanner to temple presidents, Dec. 21, 1970, copy in Buerger Papers, quoted in Development of LDS Temple Worship, Anderson, p 389)

-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
We have received 41 submissions of new names given prior to 1965, and consistent with this information no coherent pattern has yet been identified.
-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-

        From 1844 to October 24, 1878

    Female Name          Male Name
     Sarah                Abraham


    In 1846, a writer calling herself "Emeline" wrote to the Warsaw Signal that sometime in the previous two years she had received her endowment at Nauvoo, and while her new name was redacted by the editor of the paper, she wrote that"

"from all that I can gather, all the females had the same name given them, but we are not allowed to reveal it to each other."     (Communications, Warsaw Signal, April 15, 1846, Vol 3, No 3)
Fanny Stenhouse wrote that in 1860...


    "A new name was then whispered into my ear, which I was told I must never mention to any living soul except my husband in the Endowment House...

    There was among our number a deaf woman; Mrs. Whitney had to tell her her name once or twice over, loud enough for me to hear, and thus I found that her new name, as well as mine, was Sarah. To make the matter worse, another sister whispered: 'Why that is my name too.'

    This entirely dispelled any enthusiasm which otherwise I might have felt. I could well understand that I might yet become a Sarah in Israel, but if we all were Sarahs, there would not be much distinction or honor in being called by that name. As a matter of course I supposed that the men would all become Abrahams."
    (Tell It All, The Story of a Life's Experience in Mormonism, pgs 360-361)



    Ann Eliza Young, wife of Brigham Young, reported that in 1860 or 1861 she received her new name, and wrote...

"If the Mormon doctrine were true, there would be a mighty shouting for 'Sarah' at that time, as every person whose name I have heard was always called the same. It was the name that was given me, and I have known many others who received it."
    (Wife Number 19, pg 361)


    Hans P. Freece wrote to his son...

    "Yes, I have been in the Endowment House more than once. In 1865 my first wife and I, with others of the faithful, went through ...we had received new names, and we had lost our identities. My new name was a secret until I heard someone yell into the ear of a deaf brother, 'Your new name is Abraham.' I gave a sudden start, for I thought that name was for me alone.
    Forty years have rolled by, and every man with whom I have had conversation has told me that his name was Abraham."
    (The Letters of an Apostate Mormon to his son, 1908)


    Caroline Owens Miles discussed her endowment and marriage, which occurred on October 24, 1878, saying that the woman who performed her washings and anointings, "...whispered my new and celestial name in my ear. I believe I am to be called up on the morning of the resurrection by it. It was Sarah. I felt disappointed. I thought I should have received a more distinguished name. She told me that my name must never be spoken, but often thought of, to keep away evil spirits. I should be required to speak it once that day, but she would tell me in what part of the ceremony, and that I should never again have to speak it."
    (The Boston Daily Globe, Monday, April 18, 1881)


    From the above, it appears that the new name originated with the story of Abram and Sarai in the Old Testament, who received the new names Abraham and Sarah respectively, and that everyone until at least October 24, 1878, received these two names regardless of the day of the month.

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Posted by: glenlassan ( )
Date: May 01, 2021 07:43PM

Gotcha. I did see those on the website. Great stuff. Thanks for clarifying!!

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Posted by: Heartless ( )
Date: May 01, 2021 03:26PM

When I was young I was beaten in an attempt to get temple secrets.

Now they're everywhere and...... Some are done away with!

Guess they weren't really necessary for salvation.

Guess I really didn't need to conceal and never reveal or even rather than do so suffer my life to be taken.

So can anyone now pass by the angels and guardians and obtain exhalation if they watched the video and memorized the signs, tokens and penalties?

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Posted by: glenlassan ( )
Date: May 01, 2021 03:50PM

Wow; that's awful! Seriously they've never been THAT secret. :( I'm sure there are no shortage of LDS members who would insist that you "keeping your promise" was sooo valuable even if the information you were protecting wasn't. :(

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Posted by: azsteve ( )
Date: May 01, 2021 04:36PM

I have heard of vicious divorces where the man discloses his wife's temple name to others in attempts to harm or shame her.

This is one of the worst things I can imagine a guy doing, which is why I remembered it as I was shocked when I read it somewhere here in this forum. I was never married in the temple. But it is my understanding that at least in the past, the man always knew his wife's temple name but that the woman would never know his temple name. Whether the church is true or not, mis-using that information that way is pretty low.

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Posted by: glenlassan ( )
Date: May 01, 2021 05:21PM

Wow! That one is pretty awful! What a creep!

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Posted by: kathleen ( )
Date: May 02, 2021 08:44PM

I wonder how many people got a repeat of their own name.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: May 02, 2021 09:01PM

Such an individual becomes Adam or Eve...all part of the big plan!

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: May 04, 2021 09:44PM

What happens to me if, when I die, (still "officially" a member of the church), and as I'm approaching a guarded gate, I paste on a Sunday School smile, nod at the guards, and calmly announce, "I'm EOD, code-name Mormon. I believe I have reservations...?"

I have no problem with them being able to check the omni-computer and to learn that I need to be 'about-faced' and pointed in a downward direction. Obviously, ghawd can give ghawd-like (or ghawd-lite) powers to his servants.

But the thing is, if they can spot a liar, surely they can spot someone deserving of a CK suite, just as easily. In other words, the signs and tokens are simply not necessary. Not to a ghawd who knows EVERYTHING!

So what is the purpose of the temple ceremony? ...The now quite altered temple ceremony.

The whole history of the mormon church, along with the whole temple thing, has ghawd coming across as someone who is making it up as he goes along.

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Posted by: Lethbridge Reprobate ( )
Date: May 06, 2021 02:57PM

Having not gone through a temple, temple names are a WTF deal for me. My temple attending parents never mentioned it. Learned about it here.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: May 06, 2021 03:23PM

Lethbridge Reprobate Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Having not gone through a temple, temple names are
> a WTF deal for me.

No need to worry. It's only a nominal shortcoming.

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Posted by: elderolddog ( )
Date: May 06, 2021 04:31PM

Because my temple name is Mormon, no matter what Rusty says or does, I can still demand to be known as a mormon.

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Posted by: Lot's Wife ( )
Date: May 06, 2021 07:14PM

"Mormon?" They were so close to the truth. . .

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