Seriousness aside, please comment on the significance of this.

?

Recent headlines, I assume, about the potential loss of the lake. I saw the blurb but didn't read all the details. Weather changes (global warming) is the reason or that's the impression I got. Next time I'll have to actually read the article to become more informed.

non-scientist, non-hydrologist me thinks:

water diverted for human use re-enters the environment at some place, I assume after treatment thru sewers & septic systems.



I think the real key to understanding this is measurements of the snow pack (volume & water content) & stream - river flows.

is my thinking flawed? I know they're in a drought cycle now.

Some of the water does flow back into the local aquifers. However, much of it stays trapped in grass leaves and roots, which the homeowners are careful to replenish whenever it starts to evaporate. And the number of households doing this keeps increasing.

The water that evaporates travels into the atmosphere and can then migrate to a place on the planet that's cooler to dump its load. In hot places- like Utah- the water does not want to come back. And so we get droughts in the west and floods in the cooler east.

Does this help?

My daughter sent me a link to the CNN article. "We're on the doorstep of a catastrophe: Great Salt Lake is shrinking rapidly". It was very sobering. I've been thinking about it all day. https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/17/us/great-salt-lake-drought-dying/index.html



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/17/2021 10:47PM by contrarymary.

If the lake dries up and disappears, will they rename the city?

Dust Bowl City
Arsenic City
Toxi-City
Atro-City
This Was the Place

> This Was the Place

Awesome. Simply awesome.

We have a winner!

Salt Lick City

Okay, that’s almost as awesome.

Lot's Wife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Okay, that’s almost as awesome.



:-)


The Great Salt Lick will be a veritable mecca for Cureloms and Cumoms ......... and the equally likely Jackalope.

And all creatures that crave arsenic and other toxic chemicals.

Lot's Wife Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And all creatures that crave arsenic and other
> toxic chemicals.


Which is why they're so difficult to find now--only the ones with the "exceedingly" hardy livers remain.

Lurking In and LW, you two have me laughing so hard, and it’s only 4 in the morning.

For some reason I'm picturing a pillar of salt explaining this.

kathleen Wrote:
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> Lurking In and LW, you two have me laughing so
> hard, and it’s only 4 in the morning.


:-)


4:00 a.m. is the time of day when "some people" peek.
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So be sure to cover the camera lens on your computer--just in case.

;-)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/18/2021 01:47PM by lurking in.

That's great advice, LI. :D

With that advice I fear LI has revealed his true identity: Jeffery Toobin.

Learned the hard way, he did.

;-)

Perhaps this is what the OP was referring to:

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/great-salt-lake-low-birds_n_60f31fc6e4b0b2a04a244682

But our first priority must always be to own the libs! That is the whole point of life!!!! /s

The higher the salt concentration gets, the slower water evaporates, so that’s slightly good news. Very slightly.

On the bad news side, the low snowpack, particularly in the Cottonwood canyons, will suffer even more from reduced lake-effect snow.

The exposed lake bed will also be a source of pretty noxious dust during high wind events.

Medium Salt Lake?
Great Salt Puddle?

Brother Of Jerry Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> On the bad news side, the low snowpack,
> particularly in the Cottonwood canyons, will
> suffer even more from reduced lake-effect snow.

sounds like a self compounding problem

I can remember when they were worried about the the Great Salt Lake flooding. The lake had already flooded the Salt Air resort. Now it’s a third of the size it was then.

Who has seen Carnival Of Souls?

Carnival Of Souls

Who's seen the movie?

My friend's parents used to tell us about Salt Aire amusement park and what it was like there when they were young. The last time I saw it in the 1980's, it was just a flooded castle several feet offshore, only accessible by boat. But it wasn't anything you would want to go to. If the water receded enough, then perhaps it could be revived. So it appears that the water level of the Great Salt Lake may be even higher now than it was roughly 70 to 80 years ago.

Does anyone here know the current status of Salt Aire amusement park with respect to the level of the lake?

The water level/shoreline was under the building in the 1980s. I don’t remember if there was a low coffer dam around the building, or if it is up on pilings.

In any case, now the lake is at its lowest level ever recorded (I.e. since 1847] and the shore is I would guess several hundred yards away from the building.

The building was used for concerts back in the 1990s. It wasn’t in great shape then, and is in sad shape now. I don’t think it is used at all now.

I spoke too soon. The venue is still hosting concerts, and some of the tickets are pretty pricey. Who knew?!

https://thesaltair.com/shows-and-events/



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/18/2021 02:38AM by Brother Of Jerry.

Wow, it looks like they're still milking a venue that should have been put to rest a hundred years ago. I can't even see how people get out there. All I remember of it was that it was a big, unaccessible, unsafe-looking eyesore.

The current Saltair structure is a modern construction. The old amusement complex burned down many decades ago. You can still see remnants if you know where to look. The new one was started around 1977 in hopes of recapturing the old magic. The
Silver brothers had big plans for the area. The floods really killed their hopes and dreams.

In the old days the Salt Lake, Garfield & Western Railroad carried passengers to Saltair. But when the old resort closed because the lake shore was too far away from the resort the railroad stopped passenger service. Now the railroad handles freight service to an industrial park and a coal fired power plant.

Jim

I drive past that location daily, the building is there and tends to host music concerts for the less known bands, but popular to some. They have turned sections along the frontage road into parking, and bus people to the venue, or you can walk. Happens a few times a year as traffic backs up onto I-80 and congests traffic.

Flying out of the airport several times over the last few months has been enlightening, the lake is very low. However, the evaporation ponds are still in full swing. If they really want to save the lake, they have to restrict the evaporation ponds, tear up the residential\business grass, restrict water rights....thus increasing flow into the lake while improving retention.

On the way between Salt Lake and Wendover, you can park your car along side the road and walk out on to the Salt flats for as far as you can see. Those Salt flats are (I hear), the only place on earth where you can see the curvature of the earth drop off, on dry land. The ground on the flat felt pretty solid as I stood on it and stomped on it. So I considered driving out there in my (at the time) high-performance sports car. I pulled forward off of the road on to the flat, an inch at a time, getting out and checking the front tires each time. The tires sunk right in. A few more inches forward and I would have been stranded there. This was in the 1980's. Young adults try stupid things sometimes.

The Sea Monkey

In the weather cycles of the planet lakes come ad lakes go. Yhere is nothing that you or I can do about it so why the big bru ha ha?
Anyway how does this affect recovery from Mormonism?

The Great Salt Lake is in Utah.
Utah has mormons.
Whatever happens to the lake will affect mormons and, by extension, mormonism.
Quite a few people on this board live in Utah/SLC.


This thread is more on point than your endless ravings about prehistoric gold-breathing Annunaki conquistadores.

Bingo!

It shows that their supposed insider connections with God aren't really there. They have been praying and fasting for an end to the drought, but apparently God is out of the office.

Exactly what I thought!

"God is out of the office"

hahahahaha

"I'm so sorry, I'm Eloher, God's secretary and eight-millionth wife. God is vacationing with his 11,000th through 12,000th wives on Kolob this month, and on to Enish-go-on-dosh next month. He won't be back until the end of the year. All crises will have to wait until he returns. Thank you for calling Mortal Services and have a blessed day!"

Yup. The Great Salt Lake is all that remains of Lake Bonneville. During my lifetime the lake has grown in size, gone into flood stage and shrunk to the smallest size yet. The climate is always changing due to many different variables. The lake could get smaller or it could expand out again.

I guess it shows that leaders in Utah aren't any more "inspired" than anyone else, and most of them are LDS.

We "Survived the Floods of '83" as our ancient tee shirts state.
Even had the adventure of being evacuated from our little neighborhood. Water was running down State Street, but it was absolutely nothing in comparison to what is happening in Germany right now.

Bangerter, who was the governor at the time, seemed to feel pretty certain that we would experience that again, so the pumps for the Great Salt Lake were his brilliant idea, to the tune of lots of moola.

The current governor, Cox, said that only divine intervention can help us with the drought. So far, nada.

Great Salt Lake is suffering from lack of water flowing in due to upstream use.
Bear River Migratory Bird Refuge is suffering due to the same thing.

The area is a major stopover for migratory birds and many are hit hard with the lake shrinking and the marshes drying.

Another problem is the dry lakebed blows and toxic metals pollute the air. Add in pure chlorine gas from the magnesium plant on the South end and you have real problems with air quality.

The pumps are still there, run each month so they will be ready during the next wet cycle - to prevent flooding the highway and the Airport areas.

The tracks of the Donner Party are still visible in some areas of the Salt Flats.

A great resource unappreciated by the locals - just as happens in so many other places.

No one seems to consider we normally have so much water. If we keep letting builders keep building houses/apartments/etc. we may run out of resources or have to use less. Same with the nation in general ---- more illegal and legal immigration is a real problem when it comes to our resources.

Too easy to blame 'climate change' when many more things are changing also!!!

spiritist Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Same with the nation in
> general ---- more illegal and legal immigration is
> a real problem when it comes to our resources.
>
> Too easy to blame 'climate change' when many more
> things are changing also!!!

Yes! It's immigration that's causing the water shortages and other climatic crises around the world.

Some people might laugh at the suggestion that the devastating fires in Oregon and Washington and British Columbia are the result of immigrants crossing the southern US border. But that's just because they think immigrants' consumption of water is the problem whereas you and I understand that the causal connection is jalapeno salsa. Is it a coincidence that global warming accelerated when Mexican restaurants proliferated in Vancouver? I think not.

Ban salsa, and salsa dancing, and the polar ice caps will stop melting. Problem solved!

> Same with the nation in general -
> more illegal and legal immigration
> is a real problem when it comes to
> our resources.

OMG!! If only you’d been there at Aztec central to warn my great-great-great-great-etc.-grandpa Montezuma!!

He got his revenge.

Now please pass the salsa.

Glad everyone agrees it is not just climate change that causes us to be short on resources!

Yes, the salsa shortage seems at first glance not to be related to global warming. The true culprit there is EOD and his voracious appetite.

Not only has salsa lowered Lake Meade by 140 feet, but the Jewish space lasers are setting the fires. And what do Jews eat? bagels. And how do they make bagels? By boiling them in, wait for it…., water!

It’s an international plot, I tell you.

>> Same with the nation in general ---- more illegal and legal immigration is a real problem when it comes to our resources.

I thought the problem was that people don't want to work anymore? So which is it? The immigrant families that I know are working extremely hard. They do landscaping, construction, roofing, cleaning, childcare, restaurant work, farm labor, and many other useful jobs. Our economy would grind to a halt without them.

But yeah, the problem must surely be people who want to come here to work for a living. *sigh*

The human-caused global warming chickens are coming home to roost.

The chickens are coming home to roast.

This calls for mormon fasting.

Alright, Professor. Slowly put down the Canadian Royal and take two steps back.

Even though we're in a basin where large amounts of water would run into the lake, the ground is so dry upstream the it is absorbing large amounts of water that normally would enter the lake.

Another side effect of the lake is it used to keep temperatures in a certain range to allow fruit trees to flourish.

This year I've seen a lot of dying trees. I hope the orchards survive this climate adjustment.

Top story on the NBC website today as a "Special Report." Worth a read.

https://www.nbcnews.com/science/environment/salt-lake-citys-efforts-fight-pollution-face-new-challenge-toxic-dust-rcna44508

"Water levels in October fell to the lowest levels on record, exposing much of the lakebed and creating conditions for storms of dust — laden with toxic metals — that now threaten the 2 million people living nearby."

"But even those in wealthy enclaves away from the most visible sources of pollution won’t be spared from the dust. New research suggests arsenic-rich concentrations of dust from any source are the highest in wealthy Salt Lake area communities and that fast-growing suburbs could face the brunt of the dust storms' impact."

"While other metals such as nickel, thallium and lead were more likely to exceed those EPA markers in poorer, less-white communities like Rose Park, arsenic was more concentrated in samples from wealthy communities, possibly because of its past use as a fertilizer on agricultural lands."

Oh no! Rich mormons are going to be affected too, maybe even some Q15 neighborhoods! If that prospect won't open up the church coffers, nothing will.

Maybe this is God’s (nature’s) way of telling the good folks of SLC to find a more fit place to live.

About half of what was under water 40 years ago has already been exposed. I'm not noticing storms of dust laden with arsenic, nor seagulls falling from the sky from breathing toxic dust.

For that matter, the entire west desert from SLC to Wendover is former lakebed. Why isn't that producing storms of dust? A quarter of the state is former lakebed and is now alkali and salt desert.

Just wondering what's hype and what's real.

And 68% of diverted water in the state is used to irrigate alfalfa. About 15% is human consumption. Running the tap when you brush your teeth is not the problem.

Yes, the lake is drying up, and that's a bad thing, but we still need reality checks.

https://www.ksl.com/article/50479944/dust-hot-spots-where-is-great-salt-lakes-toxic-dust-most-likely-to-originate

"Soil with higher amounts of erodible material like silt and clay are more likely to be picked up into the air. Farmington Bay, Bear River Bay and the "extreme" northwest quadrant of the lake have the highest levels of silt and clay of any exposed lakebeds, where the materials make up at least 10% of the soil samples. Most of it arrives from the lake's tributaries like the Jordan, Bear and Weber rivers.

They are the same areas where the lake's surface crust is vulnerable. Perry explains that only about 9% of the lakebed is actively producing dust because three-fourths of the lake is currently protected by a crust, such as the natural salt pan that protects the lakebed from breaking.

The dust coming from the remaining quarter either doesn't have crust or the crust is considered erodible. Human activity from illegal motor vehicle riding on the exposed lakebed is one reason for this crust breaking, and dust can blow freely in the wind once the surface erodes."

Interesting. Thanks for this. Farmington Bay runs from Lagoon to North Salt Lake, And is close to bountiful and surrounding communities, it is somewhat protected from strong winds by Antelope Island to the west and the Wasatch to the east. It is famous for strong canyon winds, but they blow due west.

Bear River Bay is way up by Brigham City, and the NW arm is way up to the NW, not near any population at all, though a strong wind could blow dust from there to anywhere lake-effect snow could go, which is Ogden to Tooele.

Farmington Bay in particular, along the east side of Antelope Island, has been mostly dry land for years now. Antelope Island has not been an island for a long time. I live near there. Have not been noticing dust storms.

Also, if river silts are the erodible soils, wouldn’t those be recent soil additions to the lake, not likely to have toxic chemicals from industries around the lake?

Not saying there isn’t a problem, but seems to me the reporting on the scale and location of the problem has not been very nuanced. This ksl story helps.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/08/2022 09:33PM by Brother Of Jerry.