May 2 marked the 50th anniversary of the day the American Psychiatric Association met nationally and a tall man walked in wearing a Nixon Mask stretched over a large face and made a very eloquent speech that began,

" I am a homosexual. I am a psychiatrist." The incognito man's name was Dr. John Fryer and he risked everything. One year later the APA took Homosexuality off the list of Mental Illnesses.

This was the second of the One-Two Punch. The first being Stonewall riots. This is how gay right began with some gay kids, some even gay hookers (not that they wanted to be), and a lot of Drag Queens having had enough being pawns for the police, and a lone Psychiatrist braving the world in a Nixon mask. Gay rights did not begin with any religious person doing the right thing. Decency began with decency taking a stand.



One year later my friends at BYU were still being forced into Electroshock. And Yes. Oaks did know that was happening and was endorsing the practice.

And fifty years later the Mormon church is still hurting our gay kids. Still causing suicides. All while pretending to do this in God's name as all religions have always claimed their atrocities are done in God's name since time began.

Religion still runs the show. Always will. Because most humans are gutless and can't think for themselves and Americans are leading the pack. And nothing can stop this. Because above all else, we MUST respect people's unfounded idiotic beliefs once the word God is attached.


The engine has been put in reverse and religion is driving straight through splitting the crowd in half.

2022 and we still haven't learned to be good for goodness sake.

As much as my husband has hurt me over the years, I still see his pain and I see the good person he is. He has issues, but being raised by his parents and by mormons, it isn't surprising. He is the most normal of his whole family. My therapist said, "I know" as he has had his sister for a patient.

I'm in shock, but then not in shock, that things haven't changed much, if not for the worst, in the LDS church where gays are concerned. People thought they were making progress, but they've shown a lot recently that they haven't. I see gay kids all over who are members of the church. One is the old bishop's son that lives 2 doors down. He is about 30 and not married. Was going to BYU. Now works for a therapy place in Utah Valley somewhere. he used to come and talk to us a lot and never told us he is gay, but we knew. We worry about him.

I don’t know what the rest of the world is like but in the UK - at least within large organisations and especially in the public sector- it is illegal to discriminate against LGBTQ; they can also marry in the Church of England. In my observations (but disclaimer: I am straight), no one bats an eyelid over sexual orientation anymore except maybe some of pension age. People in the closet perhaps get less respect.
It’s most of all evil to me, the Mormon standpoint. But also, in comparison to other progress, it is absurd and embarrassing.

Are they God people or Pod people?

Done & Done, I feel for you. Women are under attack, and gays are under attack as well. I remember the Stonewall riots. Sometimes I think we are losing our collective memory of when people's rights were being trampled upon. The younger generation has no idea.

And yet the younger generations, the people in their teens and twenties, are perhaps the most comfortable with LGTBQ of any age cohort. My children bring gay kids home to socialize all the time.

The paradox is that it is the generation of people who were alive and sentient when Stonewall occurred that comprise the core of modern homophobia. It's as if they feel that Stonewall and all the other civil rights events represented defeats for themselves, defeats that must be redressed.

Your last sentence. This.

That is what the Roe overturn is about and why the Gays are most likely next on the list. I get the feeling its not about the women or the same sex or babies. It's about winning back what they feel they lost, when, their lives weren't impacted at all by the earlier decisions. In fact, their lives were many ways enriched but they were too proud to accept that.

I know. I know so many young gay kids who don't know what Stonewall was which is one thing, but, worse, show no interest when they hear about the riot. So much taken for granted today. So much entitlement. That is what bothers me the most.

And, why I have some envy for those groups who continually pass their history down. Never to be forgotten. History matters.

I worry about a longtime gay friend who married his partner of more than 30 years a while back. We sent them a card congratulating them on their wedding, and he sent me some pictures of it. They looked so happy! I teased my friend about what an effort it had been to find a card that didn't talk about "the bride and groom." I don't want to see their marriage invalidated.

With Roe teetering on the shelf, I'm very much afraid that other protections such as the availability of Planned Parenthood will be on the line as well. The doggone fundies want to take take back the freedoms the rest of us have fought for since the Fifties.

Exactly. The "doggone fundies" are not going to stop--at anything. They feel like they lost and they can't handle that. And that is why I wrote this on my other thread:


"It is not rocket science to figure out who is going to hand the victory to the other as one will stop at nothing as they put on a show of being the most "together and enviable" of all while the other will stop at nothing to take over and enforce their bigoted ways."


Ww got married the first time it was legal in California but the excitement was short lived as Prop 8 came round the corner. Couldn't believe how fast the Religious Right ratcheted up the game.

What the younger generation is not getting is that it's not over when the fat lady sings, er, curvy lady sings. It's never over. Because that type of person, the Religious Right, are pernicious and know how to adapt and mutate. There is always another round and Rocky doesn't always win.

Not knowing about Stonewall isn't always the kids' fault; I was a senior in college when I first heard about the Stonewall Riot. In my defense, I grew up in Idaho and schools there never taught any LGBTQ history. I'd be in favor of having it taught, but the religious right has mastered the art of getting easily butthurt parents on their side.

I didn't learn about Stonewall, James Baldwin, sea queens (gay and bi sailors) or Baron Friedrich Wilhelm von Steuben growing up and am catching up to this day. If there's another round of the fight against God-bothering control freaks, count me in.

While the half-life of memory becomes shorter and shorter, riots have become so commonplace, they’ve lost certain impact, even where deaths have occurred. It’s hard to site chronology and players in each riot of say, the last ten years.

Riots that actually changed things for the better—-unlike January 6th for instance—-have escaped many people’s memories. Understandable that Stonewall predates probably most of us, but those demonstrators seem to have fallen through the cracks of history.

When women and gays are under attack, we actually are all under attack. What happened to freedom from fear?

Those people who claim to be Christian and are so against our right to live as we see fit, seem to forget something: Jesus never once condemned anyone, except for one person. That was King Herod the Great and He never gave him the time of day.

Done & Done Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Religion still runs the show. Always will.
> Because most humans are gutless and can't think
> for themselves and Americans are leading the pack.
> And nothing can stop this. Because above all
> else, we MUST respect people's unfounded idiotic
> beliefs once the word God is attached.
==============================

Looks pretty grim right now, but forced conformity never pans out in the long run.
I mean -- consider the historical.
Even strong dogmatic authoritarian institutions splinter from within given time sufficient.

We hairless apes may be spring-loaded into the F-up position, but that characteristic also makes us a hard bunch to manage.

Sometimes when we take big steps backwards I hope that it is the last gasp of a dying beast--as they say. You have a point with regard to the "long run". Things have a way of turning around. It' just sad so many have to get hurt in the "short run" ---if that is what this is. Hard to know anymore.

As someone who claims the title Christian it is hard to read some of the comments here, some of which I see as generalizations. For myself, I am not threatened by or discriminatory toward gay people, and though foreign born and educated I think I have a pretty good idea of what is meant by separation of church and state under the US Constitution. At the risk of contravening board rulers with a "testimony" I try to model my life foremost on the first two things of importance...God and neighbor. On the first of those it is pretty hard to honor God whom I cannot see if I cannot be at peace with the neighbor I encounter every day.

Kentish, you are honorable. :)

Kathleen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Kentish, you are honorable. :)

Amen

Kentish, after my initial burst of anger against all things Christian, I am trying to remember that many Christians are on our side.

Yes, Summer. Many Of us believers are on the same side as as you w regard to abortion. I think abortion is sorrowful, yet I know that many women and girls have been rescued by it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/09/2022 06:28PM by Kathleen.

*Island of misfit toys*



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/09/2022 05:37PM by Lot's Wife.

*Curses!*



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/09/2022 05:38PM by Lot's Wife.

kentish Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> . . . I try to model my life
> foremost on the first two things of
> importance...God and neighbor. On the first of
> those it is pretty hard to honor God whom I
> cannot see if I cannot be at peace with the
> neighbor I encounter every day.

That is why many of us respect your religion, Kentish.





ETA: Argh! I was posting in the right place all along.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/09/2022 05:42PM by Lot's Wife.

We all draw our inspiration from varied sources. A belief in God as a reason to be a better person is a very respectable thing and the way you explain the relationship between God and Neighbor that is important to you hits the essence of that which we should all strive for. Very generous view point.

Sad about those who use God as a control tactic for their own agenda as they attempt to act in God's name and usually choose the God of the old testament as their back-up in order shame and judge. Seems to be so many of those types.