Seems like you need someone in your corner. I know you are a good dude from what i have seen over the years and mean well. You have made me laugh a lot over the years and i appreciate you very much for this because not many can make me laugh in this world.

Thats right so everyone back off teaming up against Ziller.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/03/2022 08:02PM by Dave the Atheist.

Thats right everyone needs to back off teaming up against Ziller. Seen enough of this sh#t.

thx OPie ~


ziller dang near got his ass handed to him in the great RfM baby-killing debates of 2022 last night ~


lot’s wife an dagney an anybody were using words ~


with great effect ~


that without google™ ~


no exmo would know what the f*ck they was talking about ~


the size of ziller’s pen-is was even called into question ~


contrary to the testimony of ziller’s wives and concubines and rugby mates ~


plz keep the faith OPie ~


we will endeavor to persevere against the evils of mormonism which is the common foe of all exmos ~

Hahaha you're awesome man. I definitely saw what happened in the great debate last night on here. I do know what it feels like to be one guy against everybody and it is a terrible feeling and position to be in. Whether its a group of mormons targeting you or a group of atheists it is all the same in my book. I do respect you man even if no one else does on here. I even bought and read books you recommended to me in the past like "One Nation Under Gods" by Richard Abanes. I don't really resonate with a lot of ex-mormons i noticed pretty quickly after i resigned and i never resonated with mormons either but i do resonate with you on some level with loving the pole dancing videos and watching that art or sport in general. I even was at the bikini bar last night and I thought Ziller would be in paradise if he was here right now probably haha. And then i looked and saw you getting teamed up against in the great debate last night and thought all these people teaming up against just one person Ziller this is some bullsh#t cause Ziller is a good dude.

Adam, ziller used to have a huge fan base here that included me.

But eventually he became more overt in proselytizing for his born-again Christian religion, his anti-vaccination perspective (it doesn't matter if people die, only that they're saved), his generally right-wing politics, and his belief that women should not have control over their own bodies (note in particular how he terms abortion "killing"). He even believes that people who don't share his religious views have no right to discuss the Bible.

Sure, he's pretty funny and he likes sexy women. But his religion bears more than a faint resemblance to Mormonism, including his confidence in his own religious superiority, his denigration of those who don't agree with him on moral and ethical matters, and his implicit misogyny. All that has changed is the faces of the prophets and the name on the collection plate.

It's a pity, really. A lot of us were disappointed to see the reality that lay beneath the veneer of humor, goodwill, and compassion for others.

Ziller, I think the honeymoon is over.

Doesn't matter. Got Jesus?

Well, i guess you have a point as i have only paid attention to the humor side of his posts and have not really paid close attention to the other things you have mentioned as i should have. Proselytizing is very annoying to be on the receiving end of i do know this much from experience. I should not be on a bandwagon juat because someone makes me laugh so you have a point there. You always make good points that make me rethink things.

You definitely know more about ziller than i do that is for sure.

I used to have considerable respect for ziller because of his humor and his apparent concern for others. Over time, though, the anti-vax, anti-choice, anti-separation-of-church-and-state, evangelical nonsense became undeniably salient and my feelings changed. He remains "Mormon" in all but name, seeking a single simplistic answer to the problems of life and a reason to look down on others.

My sentiments towards you, meanwhile, have also changed. When you first came here you were driven by deep-seated insecurities and resentments that, though entirely reasonably given your life experiences, made you and your posts annoying. Over the subsequent years, however, you've made remarkable progress at achieving personal peace and balance and that's evident in what you post.

You are a salient example of the ability of the individual to overcome adversity.

Look, Adam. Ziller goes around damning people he has decided should go to hell. That's annoying enough.

You came here telling us about the trauma you experienced as a child. We get it. Imagine being 10, raped, and then forced to give up your life due to a forced birth that your body isn't even mature enough to handle. Ziller gave ZERO fcks about the girl. He only cared about punishment of the man and her darn fetus. How would you like it if people only cared about your sperm and didn't give a rats rear about what happened in your life?

You and ziller can go get a room and share a pole dance for all I care, but I won't give him a pass on his religious nonsense. It's nothing to respect, and his forced birth views are disgusting.

dagny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> . . . his forced birth views are disgusting.

Disgusting and insulting to almost every woman on the board. ziller represents another patriarchal male committed to the proposition that he and people like him have the right to tell women how to live their lives.

All that based on his assertion that he uses the one true brand of toothpaste.

while the banshees of RfM take a self-awarded victory lap ~


like buzzards circling over the seemingly lifeless body of ziller amidst the wreckage of his deleted threds ~


still ziller asks the question ~


can we exmos not agree that the feminist sexual revolution was invented and encouraged by lecherous male pornographers such as hugh hefner and bob macaroni to lure morally ambiguous young women into an justify an secure they god-less lifestyle of unbridled hedonism which necessitates abortion ? ~


asking for a freind ~

As someone who ranks among the most frequent victims of drive-by deletions, I'm sorry that you find such treatment disrespectful.

I do wonder, though, why you think the board rule against proselytizing doesn't apply to you. Is there "ziller exception?" Does the rule have a footnote saying proselytizing is permissible if yours is the one true religion?

As for your mixed metaphor of Gaelic fairies taking victory laps with vultures around some otherworldly running track, we are just board participants with the same rights and status you enjoy. Is it that equality that bothers you or our uppity criticism of your views?

And no, I think most women on the site would concur that the desire for control over one's own body--including the right to abortion--is not the result of machinations by "lecherous male pornographers." Call me crazy, but women generally think they should have bodily autonomy for exactly the same reasons that you do.

There, incidentally, is a test of your imagination if not your empathy. Can you conceive of others taking umbrage at the implication that women should not enjoy the same bodily autonomy that you unconsciously assume? Or is such temerity unbecoming the gentler sex?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/15/2022 11:06PM by Lot's Wife.

Another question for you, ziller.

You have made it clear that you think those of us who disagree with you are damned. Does that not preclude our having a mutually respectful relationship with you?

I'll put my sentiments clearly. If you think I or anyone else who disagrees with you about religion is damned, I think you are an ass. Period.

Your prejudice is not acceptable.




ETA: Even in my deepest darkest Mormon years, there was never a time when I thought non-Mormons would be damned for their beliefs.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/15/2022 10:53PM by Lot's Wife.

A woman needs to not be pressured either way. I think where society is going to be judged is their casual view of abortion and even the celebration of it. Brooke Shields said her mother was under a huge amount of pressure to get an abortion and she chose to have her baby and Brook Shields got to live and grow up and have a life. I’m a realist. If abortion is made illegal it will just become another business criminals will engage in And it’s not going to solve the problems people think it will.

Anyways it’s controversial and people aren’t going to agree on it. I’ve heard the abortion arguments over and over most my life and I’m tired of hearing about it.

You're tired of hearing about it? You obviously didn't lose any rights. Your apathy might come back to bite you when something you value gets taken away next.

Don't like abortion? Don't have one! That's what choice protects too.

Ok Ok you make a good point.

Me of all people should care about a victim of any kind of abuse and i think i am getting better with caring. I am not a woman that would understand their view on this but i do know what its like to be on the receiving end of violent and unwanted abuse and it is messed up and i try to pretend that it isn't messed up but it is and people should be in jail or prisob right now and they aren't and that kind of makes me a little mad still.

I do need to see this from a view of a man and not of a boy anymore and look past the pole dancing and humor i agree. Maybe Ziller is not who i thought he was.

Adam, I remember you telling us that a man at chuch choked you and broke a bone in your neck. That made me so sad.

When my son was in high school, the band teacher grabbed him by the throat. My husband responded forcefully and police were called.

What really hurts my heart here is that it seems you had no adult male to defend you when you were young.

Good luck to you, Adam, and Happy Birthday in a couple of days.

Nicely put.

I did not have a real father and i will leave it at that. The fact that my 'father' turned against me after the strangulation will tell you enough about the guy i think. I don't want to talk too much about it at the moment because i am having a good night with friends.

I am getting there.

Since i did not have a real father figure in my life there was a time that i was trying to look for a real supportive father in pretty much anybody for example like

Byu Boner
Old dog
Concrete Zipper
Hell, even stillanon

And this does not include the actors in heroic movies i wanted to be my father and my friends in real life that had better fathers than I that i wished were my father. The father i got is one evil dude, like the most evil, and is still my most sensitive issue that remains really. The fear i have of the guy still needs to be worked through and i admit this. Absolutely terrified me for most of my life. My older sister is the first person to figure out that he is a psychopath. And after years of study i have concluded that she is correct and that the entire 'family' that i was born into was under the influence and control of a psychopath the entire time. The crazy thing is the fake perfect christian mormon performance that everyone on the outside saw of him that was not him at all. The guy also would rather sacrifice me then come clean and admit to any bullying or terrorizing or scapegoating of me behind closed doors and treating me as if i was just in the way and some leper and never apologizing for any of it. It felt like he thought he was actually a God like literally and was trying to sacrifice his son like i was some Jesus to be sacrificed for the betterment of the 'family' so they could see themselves as sinless and 'perfect' in their fantasy world.

But anyways, Ziller i never saw as a father figure role model though but more like a boy in a man's body like myself on more of an equal friend level. Like the kid on the other side of the church building that everyone knew if they got together there would be problems and then Concrete Zipper would have to get involved to separate us. Anyways, i got lots of growing up to do for sure haha. One day at a time as they say. Making the jump from broken and crushed boy from a 'family' that never defended or even really liked him from a young age to becoming a strong man is not a quick jump unfortunetely as i had hoped but oh well. All great things in life take time and effort.

You're getting there! Well done!

Meant to say i am getting there to soft machine in paris haha. Birthday is tomorrow and no one is going to ruin it for me not evem ziller's fake persona.

Don't go too far, Adam.

Ziller is still the humorous man he always was. He's just revealed some new information about himself. You can appreciate the one and not the other if that's what feels right to you.

Ok, maybe i made to big of an assumption there of a full fake persona. Maybe its not all a fake front. Probably is a funny dude in actual real life. I always assumed so.

Proselytizing isn't always about religion.

You are right.

Proselytizing is generally about persuading people to ignore facts in the service of a higher mythology. Those facts can include vote counts, electoral integrity, constitutional procedures, the applicability to the elite of the law of commoners--all of which proselytizers may intentionally and fraudulently deny.

Do you know any political proselytizers, PHIL, or any of their acolytes?

I wish we could respect each other's
opinions without condesending diatribes and insults.
Most of the political crud on this
site I've tried to stay out of. A number of posters over the years have
decided that other religions are the
ticket for them. Others see religion in general as an enemy.Both sides deserve respect.

You believe in lies. That is not respectable.

You are a tool. Is that more respectable?

Mythology is of course lies, but the lies are there to reveal a deeper truth.

What are the "deeper truths" conveyed by the lies designed to overthrow a constitutional republic?

What were the "deeper truths" conveyed by Nazi mythology?

What were the "deeper truths" conveyed by Stalinism?

One of the many things you insist on failing to recognize, bradley, is that sometimes lies are meant to achieve the goals of the liars rather than to convey some greater purpose or truth. Those of us who care about democracy, or Jewish survival, or the survival of Ukrainian kulaks, won't follow you down your various rabbit holes as you try to explain why psychopathic murders are not in fact psychopathic murders but rather sages trying to teach us the secrets of the universe.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/17/2022 12:27AM by Lot's Wife.

There’s an old saying. Never discuss politics or religion unless you like to start arguments. Get into either subject and you’ve pulled the lid off of Pandora’s box.

Oh well, so much for world peace Miss America.

Peace is not a good thing if it requires treating lies as truth.

Your lies include some or all of the following demonstrable, and demonstrated, falsehoods.

1) The Dominion voting systems were constructed in order to flip the election against Trump.

2) The 2020 presidential election was fraudulent.

3) The courts were uniformly wrong when every single one of the over 60 that heard the president's challenges rejected them.

4) The president did not insight riots in the Capitol on January 6, 2021.

5) The riots were not intended to overturn the election.

6) The rioters were constitution-loving patriots and tourists.

7) To the extent that the rioters were violent thugs, they were Antifa activists, BLM activists, FBI agents provocateur, and/or CIA operatives.

8) Every single Trump official who has criticized him in the January 6 hearings is a venal liar or an agent of the deep state.

9) All of the 60+ GOP judges and attorneys, including the ones that worked for the GOP and its presidents, who signed the statement the other day rejecting the president's claims about the election are agents of the deep state and the Democratic Party.

Am I off on any of those assertions? Why don't you tell us which you accept and which you reject.

We'll then be able to judge definitively whether you are reasonable or want to use RfM as a mouthpiece for spreading lies.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/16/2022 07:06PM by Lot's Wife.

Ditto !

Well Ziller fooled me once shame on me.

Not my first rodeo being deceived though so i'll be alright.

You have a pretty low bar about whom you will stand behind.

Well, you may have a point. How could i have possibly have known that Ziller was using a fake persona for the majority of the time.

It's not a fake personae if he always wanted it to come out. He's just revealed more of himself, as we all do over time. There's nothing dishonest about that. Life is a process of learning more about oneself and others.

Take EOD, for instance. When I first encountered him on that Board That Shall Not Be Named, he was in every sense a moderator: balanced, deep, intelligent, strong, and gentle. Since then I've learned how incorrect my first impression was.

Yet he still has some redeeming qualities. There is his humor--at least 30% of his jokes work--as well as his fondness for long-deceased middle-aged British authors and their fawning butlers and anachronistic vocabularies ("for the nonce"). He also has considerable skill as a detective who could track down you or me in a heartbeat if only someone would pay his ungodly aspirational retainer.

But where he truly shines is in his fashion sense. No one has a better collection of bolo ties and sombreros, hairbands for his ponytail, flip-flops, and handicapped parking placards. Most importantly, however, you'll never see a finer specimen of a handlebar mustache. Surely those strengths countervail some number of otherwise egregious character deficits and render him an appropriate role model (of sorts).

As for the majestic CZ, stillanon, and BYU Boner, it would be difficult to find better friends and mentors.

I have a fine collection of suspenders and long black socks to wear with sandals.

I do like the boner everyone knows this. I was doing quite terrible when i first talked with the boner and pretty much thought my life was over so i might as well vent somewhere how pissed off i was about the whole d@mn experience in their charade religion and vent towards God if one exists about my disappointment in him about the whole experience. The boner is the reason i first got the guts to start talking on here about what had happened to me in religion and with family for the first time really. The entire town i am in is mormon for the most part and even was the same in the town i grew up in so who the hell am i supposed to feel safe enough to talk to about the abuse i experienced in the religion and be believed and who the hell would even care? I know where there allegiance lies. I know how good the brainwashing or mind control and conditioning, and programming from a young age is. I would get zero people to side with me in this town over the religion and i knew this but i have found people in this town that actually believe me full-heartedly that i went through severe abuse that not just included physical abuse but psychological and emotional and even spiritual abuse. I really was made the scapegoat child so i took a lot of damage because of this fact. I have always felt absolutely outnumbered by them because they do outnumber me. I also know that i am unlikeable and hard to be around as people have told me this so i have that going against me also although my social skills have improved a bit as people outside of the religion and family of origin are teaching me how to act more normal in the real world outside of religious control. I did feel that most professionals would be mormon as well but i have learned that that is not totally the case. The counselors that religion provides or recommends you go to were absolutely terrible because it was obvious they were in favor of the religion that caused me great harm. An abuse victim of religion is totally screwed and can never get help from anything tied to religion although they confuse the victim saying religion and God are the answer but that does not work in my case so what do i do and who the hell can actually help me for real? I knew from a young age the mountain of a powerful and wealthy religion i would be attempting to try to expose and take down if i ever had the guts to talk about the truth of what happened while i was in that nightmare of a religion. Absolute nightmare both at home and at church. School was my only escape and reprive to some normality with real friendships and such. Very terrified to talk against the religion and family of origin who were still close by to intimidate me always. I know i would have to expose the entire religion and my family if i was to have any chance to get better. I would have to escape it all somehow and never look back and i knew this would have to happen if i had a chance at getting better. They definitely put the terror and fear in me starting from a young age i will give my family and that religion that much credit. Definitely know how to keep a victim of abuse silent for most of their lives that is for sure no doubt about it.

Anyways, concrete zipper was always kind and cordial with me when i was clearly out of line but i didn't think anyone really gave a rats ass about me just like in religion and my family so what did it really matter what i said on recovery boards but i know i was out of line.

Stillanon motivated the hell out of me and i still work my butt off to this day as far as work goes. Some people say i am successful and maybe i am i don't know. I am an extremely good delivery driver for sure but i do feel i can do better but not sure what else i can be just as good at at the moment. I am still discovering more of who i really am everyday really. In religion they don't allow you to blossom and be who you really are at least in my case. Controlled on all levels it seemed even down to wearing the same underwear which i thankfully never got to the same underwear point. Phew right? Haha.

Anyways, not sure any of this made sense but its always good to let stuff out sometimes. Felt good to type out at least. Not like i have a counselor that can follow me around to talk to about all this. But counselors do help when i do see them.

Anyways i'll talk to you all later have a good night. Going to chill at a lake tomorrow and visit my best friends gravesite for my b-day. His family was talking about finally getting him an actual headstone finally and i am hoping that he finally was given a headstone on his gravesite after all these years of not having a headstone. Its going to be a very peaceful trip i am anticipating and it should be an awesome day.

Later, i have to wake up early tomorrow.

Have a great birthday, Adam.

Its going to be good.

One last thing haha J.K. Rowling said something that resonated with me also. She said that she was always terrified of her father growing up and the same goes with me in that respect for sure. So she created multiple great father figures for Harry Potter that she wish that she had growing up. Hagrid, Dumbledore, Sirius Black, and Severus Snape. I do resonate with this because i felt like harry potter living with the horrendous dursleys for most of my life with no real father figure so when he leaves he finds many father figures to help fill that gap. I am realizing lately though that i have to be a good father to myself and i know that sounds weird.

Rowling is a horrible person.

Howso? What happened?