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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: June 15, 2023 09:52AM

To me the two pretty much go together. More enlightened churches have female pastors and do background checks.

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Posted by: kentish ( )
Date: June 15, 2023 11:19AM

The majority of churches do not have women pastors based on a Biblical passage. One exception that comes to mind is the Church of England which has on many other fronts ceased to be effective in the lives of people in England. Another here in the US is the United Methodist Church which is undergoing massive disruption at present.

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Posted by: shortbobgirl ( )
Date: June 15, 2023 07:30PM

The ELCA Lutherans have female Pastors.

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: June 15, 2023 10:08PM

Also the Presbyterian Church (USA). There are others, but those are the major denominations, I think.

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Posted by: [|] ( )
Date: June 15, 2023 10:22PM

Methodists, Lutherans (at least the ELCA), Presbyterians, Episcopalians, Unitarians, even the Assemblies of God.

A chronology of female clergy

https://classroom.synonym.com/which-churches-allow-women-pastors-12082772.html

Some have had female clergy for over a century

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: June 16, 2023 09:23AM

Yes, the Presbyterian Church USA has had female pastors for at least 60 years.

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Posted by: Soft Machine ( )
Date: June 16, 2023 05:40AM

You're right, of course, Kentish, but I would like to point out that the Church of England was already absent from the life of most Brits well before the institution of women priests. It's been irrelevant for most people since the 1970s at least, for many reasons but women priests wasn't one of them.

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: June 16, 2023 09:25AM

It's a shame in a way, because the CoE has lovely music and observances. I admire the culture of it.

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Posted by: Kentish ( )
Date: June 16, 2023 09:28AM

Not suggesting it was the women as priests issue alone. Many issues have contributed but the over riding issue is its desire to be everything to everyone st the cost of foundational beliefs. Standing for everything they stand for nothing, or at least little.

I attended a SBC member church at one time and did not find women treated as second class. I think SBs have become a whipping boy for all things perceived as bad about evangelical churches, especially to Mormons who perhaps see them as the big vocal enemy, such that they are not allowed a sincere belief that their position is Biblical and instead is evidence of their villainy. A Christian church daring to stand for what they believe their foundation document advocates. How dare they!

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Posted by: dagny ( )
Date: June 16, 2023 12:17PM

This is a disturbing view IMO for several reasons.

Mormons don't think the women are treated badly either.
The way we know if it is a problem is by looking to see if there is an equal number of women with leadership power. If there is not, tradition or not, its misogynistic. Justifying it because that's how a bunch of goat herders did it doesn't make it OK.

SBC leaders have made themselves a whipping boy and have done a great deal of harm obstructing civil rights at best and democracy at worst. They only change when they have to due to social pressure. Lately, the most extreme voices drown out the reasonable ones, but the reasonable ones keep supporting them. Even Jimmy Carter had to walk away from them, and that was before they got this bad.

Add the chronic problem of denominational leaders mishandling sex abuse claims. When the inclination is to protect the religion more than protecting children, that's another sign they don't deserve loyalty or respect.

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: June 16, 2023 12:46PM

>> I attended a SBC member church at one time and did not find women treated as second class.

If women do not have access to every leadership position (or the denomination is making progress towards same,) then by definition, they are being treated as second class. And to many of us, that's unacceptable in the year 2023. It was what initially drove me away from the Roman Catholic church.

I didn't realize what had been missing from my religious life until I walked into an Episcopal cathedral, and saw my first female priest. For the first time in my life, I saw a woman in a position of genuine religious authority. It blew my mind. I had never had the ability to see myself (as a female) in that way before.

Yes, there are many women who still are conditioned to believe that they don't deserve better. But we do deserve better. A lot has changed in the past 2,000 years. Putting women in positions of leadership equal to men should be one such change.

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Posted by: blindguy ( )
Date: June 15, 2023 07:44PM

...and, on a more personal note, both sides of my family lineage belong(ed) to religions that didn't allow for female clergy: Roman Catholicism (my mother's side) and Southern Baptist (on my father's side after converting from being Nazarenes). And now I reject both as I consider myself to be an atheist.

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