If you don't go on a mission at a young age, you do not lose your salvation, according to Mormon teachings. But if you don't get married, you DO lose your salvation. At least you lose your highest possible salvation, which is being in the highest degree of the Celestial Kingdom.

If you are a young Mormon with Mormon girlfriend who is just perfect for you, and if you want the best chance of salvation, the smartest thing is to get married to her right away, without going on a mission.

If you go on a mission, your girlfriend might marry someone else. You may never find another woman who was as good for you as she was. Since getting married and never getting divorced is critical for salvation, you should always be on the lookout for an ideal spouse from the very first day you are legally allowed to marry. It is a better use of your time than spending two years or a year and a half not dating at all. You should only go on a mission if it increases your chances of having a successful marriage. Missions should definitely not be a priority.

Why do young people go on missions if it is not a requirement for salvation? That's a good question.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/07/2024 05:27PM by behindcurtain.

Did Tommy Monson go on a mission ?

Like many of his generation he served in the navy during WW2.

Monson joined the "Naval Reserves" late in 1945 and served about 8 months most of that time in San Diego. He did not go on a mission, but got married and then got out of doing active duty in the Navy.

Many young men during WWII served in the armed forces and then served a mission, or were drafted while on a mission. My uncle Lee spent two years on a mission, which was cut short and then 3 years fighting in the pacific. My dad and my other uncle who were both in the army air corp did not go on missions.

Out of seventeen family members, including myself that served in the military, only one went on to serve a mission.

On my case the stake president, who was also a veteran, told me a mission wasn't required of me because of my military service.

I'm not sure how the corporation has handled the mission calls for veterans, especially combat veterans, the last 20 years.

There was a point not too long ago when about half of the Q15 didn't go on missions. It was not only military service. I think it wasn't as expected back then.

True. Spencer Kimball changed that in the 1970s.

He basically eliminated any tolerance for individuality. Henceforth there would be a single path--seminary, institute, mission, temple marriage, full commitment for the rest of your life--and everyone must fit the mold. In Miracle of Forgiveness he went so far as to say that, contrary to scriptural promises of forgiveness, each and every mistake would result in a permanent reduction in one's spiritual trajectory.

He was a bitter little man, bitter as one might expect of an unusual man who had forced himself to live a life for which he was not suited. If he could do it, so could everyone else.

SWK admitted that he was quite an ass in his irrigation job in Arizona. I think he was ill prepared to assume the role of a visionary CEO of LDS Corp.

While I think he did a great snow job on the members, SWK could not fool his cohorts (apostles and church managers) and I think it led to much of his angst and stupidity.

You mean because he was gay?

Several years ago after the defeat of prop 8, I got to attend a dinner sponsored by several Californians who help defeat prop 8, and some of the founders of Affirmation. A big topic of discussion was SWK and whether his personality was a result of struggling with being gay, the gay members at my table were all convinced that he was gay, and very unhappy.

I met SWK when I was 17 and he dedicated my ward house, I served as an usher to keep the members back from him when he entered and exited the ward house. He shook my hand and told me to go on a mission. He did not seem like a special "prophet", just an old guy like my grandfather, and not as obnoxious as other GAs I have met.

I of course never met the man, but I am aware of a few indications that he may well have been a repressed homosexual.

1) In Miracle of Forgiveness, he states that masturbation makes a man gay. I suspect that is only true for people who were gay in the first place. He also discusses group masturbation, a subject I have never heard of anywhere else and which may have been extraordinarily problematic for someone who found other men attractive.

2) His biography states that he and Camilla spent lengthy periods of time living separately. Both were apparently comfortable with that arrangement.

3) He taught that any two faithful Mormons could make a marriage work together, which struck me as possibly autobiographical. I do not think I have ever heard any other LDS leaders say the same thing, perhaps because the thought never entered their minds.

Do those points add up to proof of his sexual orientation? Certainly not. But at the very least they suggest to me a man who was deeply uncomfortable with human sexuality both generally and personally. My intuition, which is worth very little in this regard, is that he was indeed gay.

In either case hundreds of thousands of single people and married couples paid the price for his tortured soul.

I wonder if he was simultaneously trying to live up to Heber C Kimball's legacy and live down J Golden Kimball's legacy.

J. Golden Kimball was one of the few positive things to come out of the hiccup in history that was Mormonism.

Two points:
You are confusing salvation with exaltation. Common error, even among TBMs. Exaltation is the brass ring Mormons are trying to grab.

Wouldn't arranging the death of children before age 8 be even smarter? Marriages sometimes fail.

As bizarre and sarcastic as that sounds, there have been a few people who have come to exactly that conclusion (killing the kids is their ticket to heaven) because the parents/perps were unwilling to tell themselves "but that's crazy."

According to the BOM, kids who die before being baptized automatically go to heaven. I don't know how they reach the highest degree of the Celestial Kingdom, though, since they never got married in this life. Logically, it makes sense that if you want to be an altruistic, selfless Mormon, you might want to kill kids under the age of 8. You would sacrifice your own salvation, but you would be sacrificing it for the good of others. This may be logical, but it is also inhumane. It's another reason why Mormonism is a very dangerous religion.

The way we were told the story regarding children who died before the Age of Accountability...

Their ADULT citizen of the Pre-Existence spirits go to Paradise where they hang around all day playing pinball.

When the good ship Millennium (Falcon) is launched, when their faithful parents are resurrected, their kids also get reunited with their 'kiddie car' bodies and they grow up!

These lucky bastards aren't tempted like we were, what with Jesus reigning and such.  They don't have to go on missions, they get full-ride scholarships to the Y of their choice, and there will be, literally, thousands of them!  BYU-Boise, BYU-Fresno, BYU-Topeka, BYU-Cuautla, etc.

Trying to cheat the system by 'offing' your kids does do them something of a favor, but it dooms the killer(s) no matter their motivation.

We also speculated that it cheats the kids about the right to brag about finding salvation when it was hard to do so, like we were forced to do, what with having the Laurels be all alluring and stuff...



Back in the day, if you ignored all the bad parts about mormonism, including that JoJu lied his ass off, it wasn't a bad gig!

A mission is just a side trail along the "covenant path" which might be a short cut or might get you lost!

The FLDS have their problems, but, to their credit, they better understand what is really necessary to salvation, from a Mormon standpoint. They know that marriage is the number one priority, and they try to get all their women married at very young ages. Of course, polygamy makes it harder for many men to get married, but FLDS can't be perfect in everything, right?

The FLDS don't do much missionary work. One reason may be that they hold marriage to be a much, much higher priority, and not just marriage, but plural marriage. It's more important to snag your 8th wife than it is to go out and start knocking on doors.

Spencer Kimball phrased it as a commandment from the lord for every young man to serve a mission.

It's in their manual for teaching priesthood kids that it's a commandment.

This is right.

During the Kimball years a mission was a prerequisite to celestialization at least for men. There was no question about it.

The Mormon church throws doctrines under the bus even more frequently than prophets.

Yup for my age group SWK declared that "every young man, except Donny Tithe Paying Osmond, must serve a mission."

Not just Donny.

I have an uncle who was an exceptional high school football player in the late 1970s. The church had a general authority speak to him and others similarly situated. My uncle, who was a committed believer at the time (and may be still) told me that the GA said "perhaps your mission is to play football at BYU." If he had attended the Lord's University and redshirted, he might well have been on the national championship team.

There were other athletically talented people in that family, and they were not offered the same option. I guess the Lord valued service as a running back more than on the cross-country or badminton teams.

That reminds me of Steve Young. His "mission" was to be vocal Mormon football celebrity. Eye roll.

Nelson has renewed the call for every young man to serve a mission.

Thank heaven I'm still taking my vitamins.

It is a de facto requirement for getting married in the temple.

I know perfectly well that the official rules never say that. But Mormon girls have been indoctrinated/brainwashed to the point that they will never get married outside the temple (in spite of the rules having recently changed), and the only acceptable marriage partner is a returned missionary. Added to the mix is the horrendous ostracism she would encounter from her family and friends. So the guys are stuck. No "real" Mormon girl would ever consider marrying anything but an RM,and hence non-RMs are effectively barred from the consequential exaltation.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/07/2024 08:57PM by slskipper.

I wonder if that still works to the same extent. There are increasing numbers of missionaries who cut their missions short. There were never enough RMs for the women as it was. The problem has got to be worse nowadays.

But they will never get a second date from a Mormon girl.

Some of the Mormon girls might not have much choice about it if they want to marry a Mormon young man.

in this ward who didn't go on missions. The neighbor on the north just moved. He was in the SP and had been the bishop before that.

In that same house some years ago at the time my ex left, the guy was the bishop.

The guy who lives 2 doors down on the north was bishop two bishops ago.

The guy 2 doors down on the south side was the bishop and he is the whatever they call them now over the singles ward. My daughter called him branch president or something.

In all the years I've lived here, only 2 of the bishops had been on missions.

I guess they did it the right way?!? I'm sure most of you remember the 1970s and the push for missionaries!!! A guy I dated back then who was nonmormon said he wouldn't serve a mission just to marry me. I didn't marry him of course, just started seeing him again in 2005.

You lose exaltation not salvation.

I didn't have any bishops who had served a mission.

I had young men leaders who went during the diversion day of Mormon tourism. They really had no idea how corporate, stringent and unforgiving a mission had become by those mission presidents trying to climb the Mormon leadership ranks.

It never was any kind of condition for salvation and "exaltation". But there have been several church leaders who framed it as such.

I have mixed emotions about having served a mission. I could have retired two years earlier, I could have graduated earlier without going into the military, and I could have married the girl who I was so in love with. While the mission did me absolutely no favors on the one hand, far into the future I got a State Dept posting to Rome because I had learnt Italian on my mission. That led to a mini-career of 11 years that was all about travel. Still... Mission. Bad time in my life. It still affects me and my marriage.

cludgie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It never was any kind of condition for salvation
> and "exaltation". But there have been several
> church leaders who framed it as such.

"By the way it isn't important."
"But I spent two years of my life on one."
"Sorry, buddy."

I've known many good people who were driven out of the church on a mission.

Black/White MoMism!

Except, that is, for Honesty, Kindness, Repentance & Forgiving, etc.


their Claims are enough to make any reasonable individual PUKE.

Back only two decades ago "Raise The Bar" became the mantra for the youth to arise two hours before school started so that you could get in seminary lessons over at 5he church.

Going on a (forced) LDS mission and arising at 5AM meant that double checking things on the Internet was probably an inevitable outcome.

Those are people that they're never getting back.

they Certainly DIDN'T RAISE THE BAR regarding Honesty; In Fact, they Lowered it:

Instead of (TRI) 'Are you honest with your fellow (men)'?


It's NOW: "Do You STRIVE to be honest in all that you do"?


cultism, that's what it started as, what it currently remains.

Yet many GAs have never served missions.