Not about Nephi killing Laban so people don't dwindle in unbelief - the ultimate result of the Book of Mormon people.

No, this is about knowing wounded people dying are finished off to end the suffering.

https://www.deseret.com/1989/6/11/18810728/2-utah-veterans-of-my-lai-tragedy-have-found-peace-br-didn-t-take-part-in-brutality-ex-gis-say/

Mike wrestled at BYU & was drafted, trained & sent to The Land of Bad Things. Ended up involved in the MiLai massacre.

The DesNews article is kind. Reality was much more messy. But - what do you do on coming upon many in the ditch who are dying - with other Soldiers who took part in the act - nearby?

For some of us the VietNam war is still reality. It never goes away. Mike was a "good Mormon boy" who served & did what he believed was right.

Did he?

According to the Milgram experiment, which has been replicated many times, all you need to get someone to kill (2/3 of the time) is a lab coat and a clipboard.

We are all conditioned to obey authority, so that is the result. It's only by dumb luck that you weren't a concentration camp guard or a participant in My Lai or one of many similar massacres that weren't reported. Not everyone gets to be Bunny from Platoon - "Did you see that head come apart?"

If you mix that with the obedience of Mormonism, what "Mormon Boy" could be a Hugh Thompson? He stopped the massacre and threatened to open fire on anyone who tried to hurt the villagers. It was totally Billy Jack. It ruined his career. You should always try to be that guy.

Using a crown or vestments both seem even more effective when it comes to getting people to kill others.
Once they know who it is OK to hate, humans seem happy to have justification to take lives and resources.

dagny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Using a crown or vestments both seem even more
> effective when it comes to getting people to kill
> others.
> Once they know who it is OK to hate, humans seem
> happy to have justification to take lives and
> resources.

You don't even need that. A smart suit or a white lab coat will do. Marks of authority.

bradley Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> According to the Milgram experiment, which has
> been replicated many times, all you need to get
> someone to kill (2/3 of the time) is a lab coat
> and a clipboard.
>
> We are all conditioned to obey authority, so that
> is the result. It's only by dumb luck that you
> weren't a concentration camp guard or a
> participant in My Lai or one of many similar
> massacres that weren't reported. Not everyone gets
> to be Bunny from Platoon - "Did you see that head
> come apart?"
>
> If you mix that with the obedience of Mormonism,
> what "Mormon Boy" could be a Hugh Thompson? He
> stopped the massacre and threatened to open fire
> on anyone who tried to hurt the villagers. It was
> totally Billy Jack. It ruined his career. You
> should always try to be that guy.

They are always obedient to authority whether it is a priesthood leader or some other figure who has established themselves in power. Anything else is seen as a form of rebellion, and by implication of the Devil.

My Lai " Just something that happened." Hardly.

Interesting you already find the concept justifiable, at least by how you phrased the question.

dogbloggernli Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Interesting you already find the concept
> justifiable, at least by how you phrased the
> question.

While I didn't write the original post, I think the question has to be asked, especially given the Deseret's story: Given the behavior of Brigham Young after the death of Joseph Smith, would it have been justifiable to kill him in order to save lives, including those of the Fancher party.

Baker-Fancher immigrants; history sometimes overlooks that 2 separate groups combined on the westward journey and they were rather well outfitted with cattle & apparently cash & wagons carriages also.

I suspect the MORMONS covetedtheir goods & cattle.

The MMM ain't going away thanks to Juanita Leone Pulsipher Brooks, she fancied Truth ahead of authority, I had the pleasure of visiting the place she wrote most of her book & the massacre site a few yrs back.

U.S. needs single-payor health coverage, adequately funded for medical, dental, vision & mental health wellness.

Let me ask Luigi.

It is spreading

https://www.wweek.com/news/2025/02/24/purported-saif-shooter-emailed-threat-to-insurer-including-employee-names-and-addresses/

"Police and the SAIF Corp. remain close-lipped about an early-morning shooting Feb. 21 at the home of the workers’ compensation insurer’s CEO Chip Terhune.

Nobody was injured in the shooting, which targeted Terhune’s Lake Oswego home at about 4 am Friday, as the Oregon Journalism Project previously reported.

Terhune, who has led the agency since 2021, worked in a variety of high-level political and nonprofit jobs before joining SAIF. The shooting at his home—he described it in a closed neighborhood Facebook post as three shots through the glass of his front door—carries echoes of the December murder of a UnitedHealthcare executive in New York. As the state’s largest workers' compensation insurer, SAIF handles more than 40,000 claims annually and, of course, denies some of them—5,135 in 2023, according to SAIF."

Justification is finding a reason for something you want to do. Luigi was justified in his own mind. Society had other ideas, which happen to be codified in laws. So, he was not legall justified. Yet there is a segment of society who see him as justified.

What if we put it to a vote and he won his freedom through referendum? Would that be democracy?

You kill to survive.

You kill to protect your family.

You kill, not because some authoritarian says so but to protect your comrades in arms.

It's not murder if the person is already dead.

How each of us interpret that is different.

"Why should they ask me to put on a uniform and go ten thousand miles from home and drop bombs and bullets on brown people in Vietnam while so-called Negro people in Louisville are treated like dogs and denied simple human rights?

No, I am not going ten thousand miles from home to help murder and burn another poor nation simply to continue the domination of white slave masters of the darker people the world over."

- Muhammad Ali

bradley Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Why should they ask me to put on a uniform and go
> ten thousand miles from home and drop bombs and
> bullets on brown people in Vietnam while so-called
> Negro people in Louisville are treated like dogs
> and denied simple human rights?
>
> No, I am not going ten thousand miles from home to
> help murder and burn another poor nation simply to
> continue the domination of white slave masters of
> the darker people the world over."
>
> - Muhammad Ali

--------------------

Most of those serving in the Military never saw South Vietnam or South East Asia.

Ali was within his rights and paid dearly for his stand. Biggest problem for me is that those who sent us to war had NO desire to prosecute it and win. Our troops died for a lie and few Politicians kids ever served.

BYU was a hotbead of support for the Viet Nam war but Utah lagged in enlistments. Too many MFMC members chose Missions as a way to get out of being drafted - a number of them would not have gone if not for the Draft.

On the original post. You see people you know will die, lying in a ditch among many already dead & no hope of help - what do you do?

"You see people you know will die, lying in a ditch among many already dead & no hope of help - what do you do?"

Give them a Priesthood blessing!

Just in case a double tap isn't enough, the anointing oil will prevent them from coming back as zombies.

Never, including executions

When you're in the military or police.

Just to try to keep it off of Wikileaks.