Hi, Please encourage and advise me. I'm a bit of a shy gal, and have been feeling bored and lonely since moving to a new town (New Hampshire to Utah).

I live in a shared house with a bunch of roommates. One roommate is deeply fascinated with religion and Mormonism (in an anti-way). Somehow the morbid curiosity that formed in my head after listening to her rants led me to meet with missionaries. I think I was depressed, not seeing the wood for the trees, and just searching for something to do.

Mishies came once and I didn't have the gall to ask them not to return. Second time, they asked me to be baptized and I again lacked the heart to refuse. The date is set for a couple of weeks from now, which is ridiculous. We have barely talked about the Book of Mormon (read a few paragraphs together). Joseph Smith hasn't even been discussed yet. No one has mentioned coffee, chastity, paying money... I have only been to church once, too. Trifling concerns perhaps, given that the whole thing is a farce, but anyway..

Today they turned up uninvited with another Mormon couple (4 people total) just to "see how I was doing". What? Like I said, I am kind of timid, and have been a bit blue. Though admittedly it's my own fault, getting sucked into this stuff only makes me feel more, which makes my will power dwindle further. Please help me get the courage to get rid of the missionaries in a way that would be comfortable to me. I HAVE THEIR PHONE NUMBER. CAN I CALL AND ASK THEM NOT TO RETURN, AND HAVE THAT BE RESPECTED?

I cannot believe I have a scheduled baptism. I don't believe in god; never have (yes, I lied about it to avoid conflict). Don't know anyone in whatever ward I'd supposedly be going to. I feel bad that I wasted the poor missionary's time. They were such nice kids, even seemed a bit embarrassed to "teach" that Thomas Monsoon is a "profit". My self esteem is at an all time low, and I know I'm at risk of going through with the baptism just to avoid tackling how not to. Ugh.

Do you really want mormons to guilt you for the rest of your life? Wear ugly underwear? Give your hard-earned money to a church you don't believe in?

In the words of Nancy Reagan, "Just say no."

Don't do it. Call the mishies and cancel the baptism date.

After you take that step, you'll have to deal with the love-bombing that will most assuredly come your way. I know you are shy. But remember . . . "no" is a full sentence. Practice saying it.

Good luck darlin'.

;o)

You need a lot more than encouragement, NE. Of course, we all encourage you to think for yourself, and assert your rights and wishes. Groups like the Mormons prey on weak-minded people who are depressed, in low self esteem, and other-directed.

Do you want to be their "catch of the day"?

You need to tell them to leave you alone and that you are not ready to be baptized and you DO NOT want to be contacted in the future. If you do not believe in god, then you need to tell them that as well. Tell them that you were just trying to avoid conflict, but that you need to be honest with yourself and them and cancel everything. Whatever you do, DO NOT go through with it. They will expect so much from you if you do...money, teaching jobs, confessions, following all of their conformity, it is a destructive cult in my opinion after having been raised in it for 30 years myself.

Just tell them the truth and stop it in its tracks.

They'll keep coming back. They'll tell you how they're worried about you, they'll ask if there's anything they can do to help. Even just as an experiment hold your ground and see what happens to their offers of help after a while. If they get the idea you're really backing out that help will evaporate.

I grew up in Utah Valley as a Mormon and when I left I was utterly alone. I went to elementary school, Boy Scouts, camping, birthday parties, school dances, church with those guys but once I had announced I was gone so were they. It's sad and hard to come to grips with but that's the way it is.

There are many other ways to go. Anybody having a tough time like you say you are should put off making major life decisions anyway. Take some time to catch your breath. Get a job or go to school or both. Make some new friends. See how you feel in 6 months to a year.

Confront them on wearing magic underwear, confront them on no R rated movies, confront them on your Bishopric being able to call you in a "court of love" anytime they want to for any reason and the "verdict" being decided before you have even said your piece, confront them on asking children as young as 10 if they "Self abuse"(masterbation) and shaming and guilting them for it and even recommending kids sleep with their hand tied to the bed in some cases.

Confront them on Joseph Smith being a convicted conman before he started the "church" and "translated" the book of mormon from gold plates that magically disappeared after.

Its your life, control it.

We'll know what this poster's real agenda is if they go through with it...

Dang, I see dr5 beat me to the Nancy Reagan quote...

How about a Cabbie modification, "Just say 'Hell no!'"

would you give it to them just because you can't say 'no'?

If so, these missionaries have given you a golden opportunity to feel your own power. It is vital that you develop the skill of turning people down when they want something from you.

It takes practice, and most of us don't get enough.

Write up a short response for them and practice it a few times.

Then just get it over with. No matter who calls or comes by, repeat the same thing, word for word and hang up or close the door.

"I wish I hadn't started this thing with you. I am not at all interested. Don't call me back or contact me. I feel very strongly about this. Let's don't waste any more time."

Moving to a new place can be hard. You don't know anyone and you're lonely. You're ripe for people who would impose their will on you.

You have to learn to be assertive. This is an incredibly useful life skill that you learn by being brave and practicing it.

The first step is to figure out what you want. What you want is important. If you don't know what you want, who will?

It sounds like you don't want to be baptised. Call the missionaries and tell them that. Be direct and firm. Think of it as acting if you have to. Say it as many times as you need to get your message through.

The missionaries, and those associated with them, are among the most high-presssure salesmen that you will ever deal with. They are highly trained in this regard. So you can think of your dealings with them as being practice for the wider world. Or you can defer and simply tell them that you have no further interest in their church.

If you want to meet non-Mormons, get out and about on a Sunday. Go skiing, snowboarding, or hiking (tons of guys up in the hills! :-) Or take up golfing, sign up for some classes, etc. Keep an eye out for exmo gatherings in Utah -- I'm sure they'd be glad to have you!

2. make agreements you don't agree with
3. allow others to tell you what you need to do.

You need to figure out how to be in charge of YOU and not be afraid to be firm in your convictions.

You have a couple of choices.
These have been done.
1. don't show up for the baptism
2. don't answer the phone or the door.
3. be assertive and clear: call, tell the missionaries that you thought about it and decided not to join the LDS Church. Make sure you tell them NOT to come back, or contact you again.

Now get busy taking your life back and owning it. :-) You'll like it!

Of course you can do it. What's the down side? It goes against your nature.

What's the upside? You'll grow as a person and know that it will be easier next time you have to take a firm stand on something.

Women have been taken for everything they own, or raped, mutilated, and murdered just because they think they have to please whomever happens to want something from them. Better to learn this lesson with wimpy little mormon boys than with sharks or physical abusers.

Will they respect your "no?" Yes, somewhat, but you might have to repeat it a few times. It's crazy to sign up for a lifelong cult term of harassment and bullying just because it's hard to say one word and repeat it a couple of times. The word is powerful and decisive. It's a simple "no."

I'd do this for you if I could. I can't. It's up to you. Good luck.

...the missionaries will probably express disappointment that you have cancelled your baptism. Let them be disappointed. You don't owe them anything at all. As a very wise (female) boss of mine once said, "(They'll) get over it."

When you say a well-deserved, "No" to someone, you might feel afraid. But instead, you should allow yourself to feel strong, empowered, and proud of yourself. By saying "No," you are standing up for yourself. You are maintaining your personal dignity. You are making a statement that your thoughts, feelings and desires are important.

It's perfectly okay when someone is pressing you to make a decision to say, "I'm not ready to do that right now. I have to think about it, and I don't want to be rushed or pressured in any way whatsoever. If you do pressure me, my answer will be a definite "no" and you will never hear from me again."

When you get the hang of it, being assertive is highly enjoyable. This is coming from a woman who used to be much like you. :-)

Thank you, everyone. You've given me good phrases and ideas already. I'm sure my situation/quandary sounds stupid, but... well... I'm really, really struggling. (Perhaps I need a therapist, but first I need to get rid of the missionaries.)

I actually called several times with the intent of asking them not to come the second time, but their phone always dumps straight to voice mail. Somehow being unsure of what would happen if I left a message made me not do it.

What is the love bombing thing??? I hope if I say "no further contact," there won't be.

This happens all of the time here. Misssionaries are specifically trained to go after people exactly in your situation. They are trained and practiced pros.

"Lovebombing" is a term that describes what predatory cults do to recruit new members. It means they lavish their targeted victim with loving attention and sometimes with little gifts, notes, phone calls, offers to help, rides to church, sudden friendship, praise, and pressure to commit.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/02/2010 11:12PM by Cheryl.

...that church members might try their hardest to convert you. They might bring cookies, invite you to dances where you can meet other young people, etc. But these are not real attempts at friendship, they are simply trying to get you to join their church. Decline firmly, and your new "friends" will soon disappear.

Go ahead and leave the voicemail. "I've decided not to be baptised, and I don't want you to come to my home anymore." It may take more than one attempt to get them to back off.

What brought you to Utah, if I may ask?

Repeated unwanted contact from the missionaries and members of the ward, expressing their "love" and concern for you. Comes in the form of unannounced drop-in visits, phone calls, cards/letters, emails, gifts at the doorstep (cookies, craft items etc.)

Love Bombing can be pretty relentless. Say no. Be firm. Repeat. Mormons don't always hear your "no contact" message the first time.

;o)

Just curious. Good luck with your missionaries and the just say hell no thing. I know it's tough and I'm sorry to hear you are lonely out there.

"Why did you move to Utah?"

Lost two family members in brief succession and decided I needed a fresh start. My employer offered me a transfer, and I figured what the heck. I do not completely dislike Utah. The state itself is beautiful (but too full of ugly and weird goings on).

Be prepared to be blunt. Normal people try to remain polite while dropping hints hoping that the mormons will "get it" and go away. But many mormons don't understand or observe appropriate social boundaries. They will take advantage of your unwillingness to be rude by continuing to contact you and hopefully manipulate into getting baptized.

You may eventually have to be rude. Yes, they will be disappointed but that is their problem NOT yours.

Needs E,

Sounds to me like with your problems asserting yourself you will quickly find a single man who would marry you and then use his "priesthood authority" to control you.

Stay away from the mormons

To them you're Golden, an easy mark. Use your free will to say "sorry, no sale" or you'll be giving up any free will that you may have left....

By the way, if per chance anyone reading here cancelled his/her own baptism, I'd love to here how it went.

Or if you were a missionary, what went down when someone cancelled their baptism?

It sounds like your roommate is just the person to drive them away.

Here is something I want you to do. Tell them that you want to learn more and to experience the church for a while before you commit to baptism.

Then come back and tell us what they say. Their answer might surprise you.


Think about it-
Why are they so desperate to get you baptized?
Isn't a little surprising that they would want you to commit when you haven't even shown yourself to be committed through regular attendance, and willingness to learn and participate?

If you try to join the RLDS, it could take several months.
If you try to join the Catholic church it takes a year.
If you try to join many of the churches, they will usually make you study and learn before you make such a commitment to the faith.

By making you make a commitment so early, they have your honor to hold over your head, so that you will not want to sully your good name by breaking a commitment/promise.

Could it be that they really just want you to join and begin paying time and money into the outfit? If so, what about you? Where will your spiritual nourishment come from?

I had trouble telling people "No" just all by itself. I found it much easier to say the magic words,

"You may be right, but No, Thank you."

because the next thing they always do is ask for an explanation...

"Why not?"

"It's not for me, but thanks for the thought (offer or whatever)."

and they will argue and press and then you just loop:

"As I said, you may very well be right, but it's not for me."

"Thanks, but No, Thanks"

"Again, you may be right, but No Thanks"

until they give up.

It is very hard to disappoint those fresh eager young mishies who look so sincere, however, you are the only one in the room who is putting you first. Keep that in mind--SOMEONE has to watch out for you and that is your number one job and no one else is going to save you. That poster 666--he's absolutely right. Where will you draw the line if not saving your own life for yourself?

Woman UP! You can do this-- and good luck sweetie.

Just have coffee brewing and be drinking some beer next time they come over.

When they tell you to give it up, just tell them no. There is no way you are getting baptize drinking coffee much less beer.

No fuss, no muss

You mentioned that you transferred to Utah for a job. Do you work for a large company with a good benefit package?

If you do, they probably offer 8 to 12 counseling sessions with a qualified licensed psychologist or licensed counselor for a low affordable co-pay just for situations like yours.

Contact your Human Resources Rep at work, tomorrow, and ask about it. You can say that you just need a little help adjusting to your relocating experience, although you really do not need to explain anything at all if you do not want to. Your employer is not allowed to know what your counseling was about.

If you do seek therapy without going through your employer, be absolutely certain this person is a board certified or licensed counselor or psycologist. There are lots of folk out there right now that call themselves things like "Life Coaches", that have no professional training and are not licensed-in fact they don't even have to have a High School Diploma & they can have an agenda of their own.

And, it goes without saying, to stay away from LDS Family Services.

You need professional guidance to learn how to tap into your own inner strength and power. It's there, inside you, but it appears that when you were growing up, no one helped you learn how to use it. You will not get very far in this adult world, if you do not let yourself use the phrase "No, I do not want to do that".

And, right now, Get a pad and pencil and write down what you want to say to them and read the words into their answering machine-

then, call that phone number those missionaries gave you and tell them that you have changed your mind and that they are to quit bothering you.-and do not try to "explain" why to them...EVER...just keep saying, "I have changed my mind, stop bothering me"...when they ask "Why" do not address the "Why" and repeat "I have changed my mind, stop bothering me"..over and over and over...broken record....do not change that "chant"


Don't answer the door or phone until you can met with a therapist who can help you practice what to do after that.

You Can Do This. I know you can! How do I know this...well, in reading your first post, you come across as someone well-educated and brave enough to pack up all her things and move to a new town... That took courage...so you know how to be brave!

Then treat yourself to a great movie this week, maybe eat out at a nice restaurant first... Look in the local newspapers for activities that interest you...pick something and go to it... Invite a co-worker to go to Happy Hour with you Friday after work....get creative...what do you want to learn?... Does your new community have a "Parks and Recreation"department, or does the local library offer activities...stop and think what is there to do around that town that has nothing to do with churches, but does throw you in with some smart and interesting people... and then go for it....

And that's that your new friends will suddenly move on to try to get other people to join.

Missionaries get transferred or move on to new contacts. You'll basically have to start over making friends in the ward you'll be in. Not so easy.

If you're thinking that joining mormonism will help you feel less lonely then I think you're wrong.

JoD3:360, wow... you have got to be exactly right. I am getting more and more angry just thinking about it. I was blindsided by the baptism request. I had no idea it would be asked of me a couple of hours into my "relationship" with the church.

And yes, the 666 guy is right, personal sovereignty is a weak point of mine, sadly. I always find myself in the grey areas, lacking black and white convictions. Guess what missionaries? A gal my age who's been talked into baptism has been talked into alcohol, sex, and caffeine... Now I wonder why they have never mentioned any of it.

say "no" than I am about you joining the Mormon church. And that's SAYING something.

Just keep in mind:

It's YOUR life, not the missionaries'.

It doesn't matter if they are sad, disappointed, concerned, or whatever about your decision. You hardly KNOW these people. And THEY hardly know you. So any attachment/concern they show towards you is either a show or just plain ODD. It takes TIME for true friendships to form, and true friends don't pressure people to make big commitments right away. (BTW, Controlling and abusive men, also tend to form attachments quickly . . . so watch out for the leachy type of people . . . they WANT something). You own them NOTHING, not even an explanation-- they just tried to sell you on a fraudulent religion!

Please learn to pay attention to your own discomfort around controlling people and use that to alert you that something is NOT right. BTW, I have learned that many people who have trouble saying "no" have been conditioned to accept the control of others in their lives. And sometimes it isn't all that obvious--no beatings or verbal abuse, but more subtle manipulation and control. Actually, the Mormon church is all about guilt and control . . . not a good place for you.

I'm thinking you might benefit from therapy or reading up on Emotional control and emotional manipulation/abuse. When I read some books on it, I realized that I had accepted all sorts of manipulation as NORMAL my whole life, both at church and in other relationships. Now I can recognize it and defend against it. There are also some excellent books out there on learning to say "no". You'll be SO much happier when you learn to take charge of your own life.

imaworkinonit Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> say "no" than I am about you joining the Mormon
> church. And that's SAYING something.
>
> Just keep in mind:
>
> It's YOUR life, not the missionaries'.
>
> It doesn't matter if they are sad, disappointed,
> concerned, or whatever about your decision. You
> hardly KNOW these people. And THEY hardly know
> you. So any attachment/concern they show towards
> you is either a show or just plain ODD. It takes
> TIME for true friendships to form, and true
> friends don't pressure people to make big
> commitments right away. (BTW, Controlling and
> abusive men, also tend to form attachments quickly
> . . . so watch out for the leachy type of people .
> . . they WANT something). You own them NOTHING,
> not even an explanation-- they just tried to
> sell you on a fraudulent religion!
>
> Please learn to pay attention to your own
> discomfort around controlling people and use that
> to alert you that something is NOT right. BTW, I
> have learned that many people who have trouble
> saying "no" have been conditioned to accept the
> control of others in their lives. And sometimes
> it isn't all that obvious--no beatings or verbal
> abuse, but more subtle manipulation and control.
> Actually, the Mormon church is all about guilt and
> control . . . not a good place for you.
>
> I'm thinking you might benefit from therapy or
> reading up on Emotional control and emotional
> manipulation/abuse. When I read some books on
> it, I realized that I had accepted all sorts of
> manipulation as NORMAL my whole life, both at
> church and in other relationships. Now I can
> recognize it and defend against it. There are
> also some excellent books out there on learning to
> say "no". You'll be SO much happier when you
> learn to take charge of your own life.

Practice what you are going to say in advance. Do not even consider joining a church you don't believe in and know next to nothing about just because you don't want to disappoint someone. They will survive.You don't owe them an explanation unless you want to give them one. If you do, plan what you want to say in advance. If you don't want to confront them, you can write them or leave a message on their voicemail. Whatever you decide, do it and don't back down. You do not have to see them, take their calls or have any contact with them. If you don't want it, say so and stand by your guns. I agree with the poster who mentioned other churches. I took some classes with a friend who joined the Catholic church. The course lasted almost a year, nobody pressured those who decided it wasn't for them and they discussed everything. Contrast that with being asked to commit before you know anything about the Mormon church