Did you have any self perception as to how others saw you?

Did you think you deserved the title of "elder"?

Did you find the mo obsession with statistics to be off putting, as in stats have nothing to do with the "good" you are doing?

How long before you thought you were wasting your time?

I was in Mexico and had little self perception.

Tons of people, mostly girls would pay attention to me just because I'm white.

The title was never that important to me.

I hated stats for the very reason you mention.

I thought I was wasting my time in the MTC and then after being in the mission for 3 months I quit following the program and the rules and pretty much just enjoyed the experience. Didn't do anything bad enough to get sent home but I spent my p-days online on this site or researching the church more fully. I stopped going shortly after I got home.

Yes, I found out how annoying I was when I found my comps journal. Week after week of how he hated me and everything I did.

Up until that time I thought we were pretty good friends.

One more thing you learn to do as a TBM and that is lie so well others believe you.

ablmu65 you reminded me of a sad email one of my grandsons sent.

He had a hard time with one of his companions and mentioned a few times in other emails how annoying he was. How he had to bite his tongue and be nice to him. But one email really made me sad and think about how brainwashed some of these mishies are. He said one day it got so bad with his companion he took the comps shoes in the bathroom and locked the door and proceeded to polish the guys shoes! So no matter what an asshole someone is you are supposed to serve and love them? !! Or I misread it and my grandson was a jerk and was doing penance. But I don't think so.

And in my experience some of the mishies I know think it's a badge of honor to be treated badly. They don't see themselves as annoying.

Are you kidding? I was the most charismatic missionary The Netherlands ever saw.

Just sayin'...

Ron

Ron, you can baptize me any day man.

B.S. I was very charismatic myself. I baptized four people! One of them might even still be active.

I realized it the first time I sat in on a discussion...it was clear the Mongolians didn't need me as a missionary. Maybe I could offer something else of value but my culture and my religon were irritating to many people.

...which is why I tried really hard NOT to annoy people. I tried spacing out contact with investigators, active and inactive ward members, etc. I also basically gave up on tracting and street contacting. I tried to be as real and personable with people as possible, but after getting a little mentally f*cked up in the MTC, it was hard to just be real and do my job at the same time. Worst two years of my life.

I wish there was a way to thank all those Peruvians who invited me in, put up with my Spanish, gave me a place to sit down out of the weather, offered a soft drink and invited me to eat and otherwise put up with an arogant young man who thought he was better than they were because I was white and had God's own truth.

Viva Peru!

Which is why I spent most of my 5 month mission watching movies and playing video games at a neighbor's house. I also ditched my trainer while he was bible bashing once and was being an insufferable asshole.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/20/2011 05:14PM by dressclothes.

No, I never saw myself as rude. I thought everyone else was rude for rejecting us and not even giving us a chance. Little did I know..

I never liked the "Elder" title. I was glad I was in Japan because you never call yourself by your title there so I didn't have to do it. I always felt bad for the English speaking missionaries who had to use the titles.

I did think that high numbers meant I was doing the right thing. I was always so stressed out as a missionary because I had so little success. Now I'm glad no one listened, because it saves me from feeling guilty that I brought someone into that religion.

I never thought I was wasting my time. I was as TBM as they come as a missionary. Now, though, I realize it was a huge waste of time and the only thing that came from it is learning another language.

70+ baptisms. Yes I feel bad.

I am envious that you had no success. :)

"Did you have any self perception as to how others saw you?"

I think I did. Mexicans have a very interesting cultural respect for those who preach Christianity. They may consider themselves Catholic, and will never really truly convert to any other religion, but most of the time people were happy to see us and would even seek us out to perform things like blessings or to talk about god.

"Did you think you deserved the title of "elder"?"

I think this is a question of semantics. Since the word "elder" is arbitrary, especially under the context of religious titles, there really is no reason to say that one person deserves it while another does not.

I was considered by an organization to be an elder in that organization. Yes, I deserved that title.

"Did you find the mo obsession with statistics to be off putting, as in stats have nothing to do with the "good" you are doing?"

I questioned this a lot. It always seemed to be about numbers, not necessarily about what good I was doing. If I helped an old lady move, or helped a young couple dig a ditch (and I did stuff like this constantly), it never really made my leaders happy. Numbers were the only thing that made them happy. As a missionary, I actually was cognizant of that.

"How long before you thought you were wasting your time?"

I never felt I was wasting my time. I learned another language and I learned how to assimilate myself into another culture. While I do not agree with the Mormon church anymore, honestly, going on an LDS mission defined who I am. Since then, I have lived in three other countries and speak fluently one other language. I would have never been that person had I not felt that god needed me to go to another country and sell religion door to door.

No regrets, right?

"When you were a missionary were you aware how annoying you were?"

I am still unaware of how annoying I am.

Yeah, at the beginning I was pretty gung-ho and during my first week we tracted into these two dudes drinking beer and watching tv with the front door of their apartment open. One dude was in a wheelchair. My trainer (such a tool) told them we had an important message from god to share and would they invite us in.

The dude in the wheelchair literally blew his lid, I mean h.e. l.o.s.t i.t... He started yelling about how he was in a wheelchair because he and his wife were hit by a drunk driver and she was killed on impact and why would any god allow such a thing to happen, etc. etc.

So me, trying to impress my trainer, told the dude with a straight face that it was all part of god's plan and that nobody is given more than they can handle and he just needs to have more faith because ultimately coming to this earth was his choice.

Long story short, what happened next prompted the mission president to call the sister missionaries in that area to tell them to avoid tracting in those apartments in El Cajon until further notice, and I stopped acting like an arrogant asshole when knocking on people's doors.

By the time my first transfer was up, I was very laid back, answered questions honestly, didn't push people, and offered service more than preaching.

kolobian Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Long story short, what happened next prompted the mission president to call the sister missionaries in that area to tell them to avoid tracting in those apartments in El Cajon until further notice, and I stopped acting like an arrogant asshole when knocking on people's doors.
>
You've got me wondering - what happened next?

The dude in the wheelchair basically had his roomate go get his knife (which was more like a machete) and threatened to cut us and any other missionary he saw if we didn't get lost right that moment.

Whether he was sincere about it or not, my trainer almost shit his pants and we went straight back to the apartment so he could call the mission president and ask if we should call the cops because the guy was "threatening our lives."

President Olsen told him to call the sisters that night and tell them that those apartments were now blacked out and not to go there. I think Olsen called the english speaking elders and told them the same.

I was more embarassed than anything because even though I told the guy something that I was taught as "true" I knew it was the wrong thing to say and heartless. It was a lot of cog dis for my 1st transfer.

to brandish at unwanted mormons on my porch.

I served there myself, and remember the area quite well. I'd be interested to know that I might have been at the same apartment complex at some point.

It's been a while but I'm pretty sure it was around Emerald & Lexington.

Oh man, that part of town is ghe-tto! Glad you survived.

I don't think I had much of a self.

No, it always mad me feel weird and old.

Statistics were like football or baseball scores to me!
It kept my math skills in tact, especially as a District/Zone leader.

Having a trunk ed out trainer from day one opened my eye's very soon. Don't consider it a waste of time. I met a lot of amazing people and crazy people. I look at it as growth and being where I am now, out of LDS INC. and happy.

I eventually found out that the "leaders" though I was not strong enough in approaching people. I think the people outside the church though I was "sweet" and my little Canadian flag on my nametag and my little accent was something people seemed to enjoy ;)

I was not called elder but hermana.

I definately didn't like stats. I thought they didn't represent the work we were doing (especially that I was the type to think that the people were more important than "our message".

I didn't know at the time that I was wasting my time. I only know that for the second half it was he** and I kept singing to my self a couple of phrase from a Phill Collins song (Take Take Me Home, Cuz I Don't Remember, Take Take Me Home) over and over again.
The good thing about my mish. is that I learned Spanish and a year after I came back home I found a great job where I've been using it for the past 16 years ;)

Early on, it became obvious that for the next couple years my job was to annoy a lot of people to find those *special* ones. After finding few, if any of those, it became clearer my job defaulted to just annoying people. As far as comps, they were probably more annoyed with me because I wasn't as passionately engaged in the work as they were. (That is, when I had "real comps" instead of ones that needed babysitting.)

Being BIC, I was aware of the duality of the term "Elder," and being accustomed to it, it didn't bother me.... though I certainly noticed it when the strangers we were annoying made fun of it. However.... on a similar note, I didn't like the fact I was part of the big machine, and if someone simply called me "Elder" instead of "Elder JPT," I would ignore them. I'd lost my first name; I insisted on at least the last name.

Stats. Yup... we derisively called them "numbers," meaning the stuff you needed to do to keep the zone leaders and/or mission office happy, without really getting any quality work out of it. After being chastised one month for having low numbers, my comp and I went to a poor side of town, placed a bunch of BofM's, "taught" a bunch of discussions to people to didn't care, or weren't literate, or were just happy to talk. And, lol... we were honored that month on the mission newsletter as the companionship of the month. We were certainly less productive as far as finding people to baptize, but I guess they didn't care about that as much as the numbers. And yes... We had to account for all of our hours, and itemized accordingly.

Wasting my time? Hmm... I don't know if I really got there. It was more of "how much more time before this crappy job is over? Of course, the mindf*** was that all failures were due to our own faults and inadequacies. (Of course, going to well-to-do areas in the day meant both spouses were at work, so knocking on empty houses was a waste... but I didn't mind.)

Yea, I figured I was annoying, but it was what the Lord wanted me to do. I would try to blurt out the entire version of the first vision on the doorstep before the door slammed, so I could count it on our report!

I think it was easier to be rude in a foreign country (Holland) as I did not have any cultural insight as to how I was perceived by the Dutch people.

Geez, I was annoying. I'm reading John William's "Heaven's Up There" memoir about his mission in Bolivia and it is all coming back.

Being horrendously introverted the whole experience was extremely painful. I knew within a few weeks how we appeared to most people.

The experience that really made me feel sick about what we were doing was this. We advertised free English classes and gave them. People showed up very excited. But I will never forget the look on their faces when the first phrase we taught them, was: "Joseph Smith was a prophet of God."

At this point they were supposed to asked about Joseph Smith.

No one ever did, they just looked at us like they had turds in their mouths and were thinking "What the fuck is this shit?" and left. I wanted to die.

I was not annoying I was just outgoing and I was on a mission of love trying to find and save souls...how could anyone have perceived me as annoying? I had my share of doors slammed in my face but I didn't take it personally I just figured I came at an inconvenient time and so sorry no big deal.

As far as having the Title Elder...I never thought of it as a Title...I thought more of it like I had lost my first name and that bothered me some because I never liked being lumped into any group.

Numbers yeah, that bugged me a lot and I made note of that more than once in my editorials when I was the mission mag editor for the Central States mission mag in 1970. I was well aware that you could and many Elders would, baptized people just for the numbers knowing they really weren't that interested but because the Elders had a good way with people they could get them to submit to them. We kept track of who gave the most 1st Discussions for example and awarded someone that Honor each month being the one companionship that gave the most 1st Discussions and put their picture in the mag etc and I thought there was a lot of mis information when it came to what numbers really represented.

As far as when did I realize i was wasting my time...you got to be kidding? I have said it all my life and I will say it here DESPITE THE FACT THAT I HAVE CONCLUDED THE LDS CHURCH IS A CULT: Going on a mission was one of the best things I ever did in life...nothing to do with the lds church but it taught me to sell sell sell, which I was later able to use in my life. It made me a good closer a good salesmen and it taught me to enjoy meeting and talking to strangers and removed any fear I might have had about speaking in public...hell if you can sell religion you can sell Rainbow Vacs door to door no problem, and I did! I have sold Musical instruments, insurance,was a cosmetologist, talk about selling a dream! You can say what you want about the cult and the doctrines of the LDS church and I don't mean to imply that it offsets any of the cult behavior or life destroying shunning etc...but going on a mission gave me the skills to be heads above the competition when it came to becoming a Drywall contractor and running my own business for 20 years. I learned to talk to strangers, look them in the eye and do business with them. I learned how to get my ass out of bed in the morning and do a job, how to set goals and to follow through on things. I learned how to compromise living with companions I was not very compatible with which prepared me for a long 30 year marriage etc....was of time....not in my book brother! If if wasn't for the fact that I was selling LIES, which I didn't know at the time....I would recommend it to this day... Hell I learned to cook, cut hair, talk to girls, you name it I learned it on my mission. I may have wasted a lot of other peoples time, i'm sure I did, but I made some great friendships and it was one of the good things about having been raised in the cult as far as I am concerned! Truth is truth! That's the truth as I know it!

1. Oh, yeah.
2. "Aeltester" as a title in German is ridiculous. I knew that.
3. Did an awful lot of "pencil tracting."
4. One week.

How-did-I-stick-it-out-2 1/2-years-ly yrs,

S

Like my trainer, who never should have extended her mission to train...she was a sweetie who really tried but was so far past burned out that everything annoyed her.

Or my totally depressed companion who wore a "Friends of Bats" ring and just wanted to sit home eating brownie dough - it annoyed her I wanted to leave the apartment.

And one of the sisters I trained was annoyed by the gossip and backstabbing that become part of the sister missionary experience, once you've been there a year. She was new to all the drama and I had unfortunately got sucked into the drama so I know she just wanted me to focus.

But I was too laid back with the investigators. My dad wasn't LDS so I knew the church wasn't necessary to be a good person or live a happy life. My attitude was more "Hey, you looking for something more? No? Cool then, glad you are happy. Hasta Luego." I was having too much fun living in a foreign country and too interested in everything about it to push Mormonism on anyone who wasn't interested. Hopefully, that minimized how annoying I was to the nice people of Spain.

We annoyed the crap out of the German people.

All they wanted to do was run errands, and we were busy pretending we weren't in a cult by singing hymns at them and trying to pass out crappy scriptures.

Loved Germany. Hated the mission.

asshole I was.

According to some, I still am. Opinions may vary.