After having come out as an atheist to my wife last summer, our discussions and time in counseling has led to her moving out this morning. I know it's probably for the best, and we didn't part ways angry towards one another--just very sad.

MIL called my parents this morning with the news, and my father called me soon after (my wife told MIL that I was going to call my parents today, but she apparently took matters into her own hands). I told him I'd call him back at 1PM. So in a half an hour, I'm going to come out to my TBM parents, and I'm not extremely hopeful for the reaction. Luckily I have some distance between us, and I'm independent, but I have no idea how they will take it. They have been pretty much in the dark throughout my marital difficulties, and I think their son not believing anymore is going to be a shock.

I'm going to try to be as inoffensive as possible, but TBMs are able to take offense at so much... "Wife and I are separating because our expectations for life are irreconcilable. I've had doubts about the Church for many years, and last summer I tried an experiment where I didn't believe the Church was true. Altering my faith made me much happier, peaceful, and optimistic. It makes more sense to me that the Church isn't true, than that it is. I am much happier and at peace believing this way. I have no problem with those who find happiness and peace in the Church, but I personally don't find those things in it."

Wish me luck everyone! You have been a great support these past few months!

Good luck! Keep us posted!

Good luck! Hope your parents understand.

Just let your inner strength show. Good luck.

Good luck to you. This will come as a big shock--it's too bad your relatives didn't respect your privacy enough to let you choose the time/place, but so it is.

It's hard for parents to believe you can be happier without the church--I'm sure you were kind of surprised yourself--but someone who loves you will be glad you are happy (in time).

Best

Anagrammy

Best wishes, muucavwon. Every once in a while, we hear a story about these kinds of conversations going better than expected. I'm holding good thoughts that your conversation falls in that category.

What a day you're having, muucavwon. :-/

I hope your outing goes ok, good luck.

Thanks everyone. The conversation went as well as I could have hoped.

I only spoke with my dad, who is the less volatile of the two parents. He was floored that we were separating and probably getting a divorce. Then he was even more floored that the reason was because my faith had changed and I didn't believe the Church was true anymore. He was very hurt, confused, and generally shell-shocked. I gave him a short summation about how my faith transitioned from literal belief to mixed belief to non-LDS-belief, and while he understood what I was saying, he didn't seem to understand how it was possible. He said that he can't say "Do what makes you feel happy, because for me, it feels like my son's salvation is at stake" and I said, "I can understand your perspective." He also started guilting himself and my mom saying, "I just feel like we've had so many missed opportunities to help you." I told him that he and my mom had done a wonderful job teaching me, that they were devout examples of their faith, and that there wasn't one thing or a hundred things they could have done differently to prevent me from coming to the conclusions that I have. Again, my dad seemed to understand what I was saying, but was unable to really accept it.

Also, apparently MIL said, or dad misheard from MIL, that the reason for the divorce is because "I wanted to look at porn, and have my coffee and alcohol." These are issues that my wife and I have discussed and that I have said I couldn't commit to abstain from for my entire life (I have never tried alcohol or coffee because I didn't want to offend my wife.) Luckily, I was prepared for this possibility, and I was quickly able to say, "No dad, those are not the reasons. I have never drank coffee or alcohol, and porn is not an issue. The issue is that we have different life expectations now that I do not believe in the Church."

Also of note in my experiences the past few months: In dealing with wardies, I haven't had that bad of a time. EQP awkwardly fellowshipped me in the hall one day after sacrament meeting, and although I was awkward in my reply, the exchange was painless when I told him, "No, for personal reasons I won't be coming to elders quorum meeting anytime soon. I am flattered that you have missed me, and thank you for the invitation."

Declining interviews with priesthood leadership has been as easy as saying, "No thank you. I really don't feel comfortable with that right now." And when my wife and I did schedule a meeting with the bishop in our home, the bishop didn't use any tactics to lure me back, but just asked some questions to understand where I was, expressed that he and everyone he knows has their doubts that they grapple with, and then said, "Forgive me for saying this because I understand how incredibly difficult this is for you two right now, but in a sense, I find this very interesting seeing someone go out of the Church because I came into the Church as a convert."

In conclusion (seems appropriate given this essay I'm writing), the advice I've gleaned from this and other exmormon support sites has been invaluable.
*Don't apologize for where you are or the pain you've caused, but acknowledge it and empathize with those who are affected.
*Be firm but polite in dealing with others.
*Being honest does not mean you have to tell everyone, everything, anytime they ask. You have a right to privacy.
*Having a support system outside of Mormonism is essential (this board being one example).
*Softening your explanations to believers goes a long way: e.g. "I know that many people find happiness in the LDS faith. For me, I am much happier, fulfilled, and at peace with my new beliefs."
*Ignore the crazies--you don't owe them an explanation or proof or a conversation. You don't have to engage with anyone you don't want to.
*Empower yourself: you are in charge of yourself, so give yourself permission to make your own decisions.

Thanks again guys for the support! Today has been a bit of a surreal rollercoaster, but this painful situation is for the best, long-term.

muucavwon Wrote:
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> *Don't apologize for where you are or the
> pain you've caused, but acknowledge it and
> empathize with those who are affected.

You should apologize for any pain YOU have caused. But the pain mentioned in this post is all caused by THEM. All are victims of THEM, not of YOU.

You handled it very well and I congratulate you for being true to yourself. Good luck and may your new life be fulfilling. It is sad your wife loves that organzation more than you. Better to know it now than later.

muucavwon Wrote:
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>
> Declining interviews with priesthood leadership
> has been as easy as saying, "No thank you. I
> really don't feel comfortable with that right
> now." And when my wife and I did schedule a
> meeting with the bishop in our home, the bishop
> didn't use any tactics to lure me back, but just
> asked some questions to understand where I was,
> expressed that he and everyone he knows has their
> doubts that they grapple with, and then said,
> "Forgive me for saying this because I understand
> how incredibly difficult this is for you two right
> now, but in a sense, I find this very interesting
> seeing someone go out of the Church because I came
> into the Church as a convert."
>






It's good to see the leaders getting the message about not being pushy. That's a lot of progress from back when I left. I'm sure the pressure to change their tactics has helped due to such websites as this one.

Sadly the convert did not go into mormonism knowing the same details as you have left with.

I now see everyone's experience as a valid life experience for them. for example, I recently came out to my tbm friend and she can't grasp any of my issues. It boils down to our life goals - I have a goal of living in truth and she has a goal of escaping in a community. She has a different interpretation of ethics and values. The beautiful thing about the difference is that I love my friend very much and this love is allowing me to embrace the place where I was in the reflection of her. It sounds rather weird I know, but it's helping me release some anger toward being duped in the name of Truth and God. By viewing her experience as valid for her life lessons I am able to see that without her I wouldn't have a reflected mirror to embrace as I see the person I used to be in her every word. It's hard to describe but it's changing my view of what is valid for one persons life journey as opposed to another person and how I have needed hers to help me. As a result I'm glad she didn't leave or I wouldn't have her help to love or understand the person who is caught in it as a reflection of how I was caught in it.
I'm not explaining it well.
good luck to you muucavwon.

You handled that with pure dignity. My utter respect to you!

Good luck in the future! We're all here to support you & wish the best for you.

I'm so glad my parents came out before I did about atheism. Though in their case they are only agnostics.

Heroic. I am relieved you have such a healthy attitude. Let us know if we can help.

You did a superb job handling it. Breaking the news to my family caused me to really change my perspective towards dogmatic religion. I had one friend who wished me well finding my own happiness. All the others couldn't bring themselves to say it, and instead expressed concern about my salvation with warnings, etc... Dogmatic religion by nature is not accepting of contrary points of view.

At one point I told my dad "I will raise my children in such a way that they are free to investigate and believe anything, including mormonism, and I will not condemn them for not seeing things the exact same way I do." It probably wasn't the right thing to say at the time. Even as I was saying it I realized I might have been expressing intolerance at his intolerant world-view. Intolerance is still a characteristic that I have a hard time being tolerant towards, though I'm pretty tolerant about almost everything else.

I hope you are feeling a little better every day.

Just to let everyone know, this is my little brother. He is an amazing human being and I love him.

This board got me through my own transition out 15 years ago, and now you are doing the same for him.

I am so impressed by the grace and poise you have handled all the different actors in your coming out.

We do become enlightened by escaping mormon dogma. Life gets better and better.

Congrats to you and welcome to the rest of your life. There will be days and events that will be difficult, but today, you took steps for you.

muucavwon Wrote:
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> I've had doubts about the Church for many years, and last
> summer I tried an experiment where I didn't
> believe the Church was true.



For some reason I have a disposition to get lured into belief systems. I like to research other people's belief systems so am occassionally faced with unique systems. Each time I'm faced with a set of beliefs that I find strangely enticing I recognize a mind programming of sorts take place within me. It's almost like a moth to a flame and it is very alarming when I experience it happen. I don't act on it or anything, but it is very odd when I recognize a lure and enticement. I simultaneously recognize the errors in the system I'm researching and any time I am lured in I repeat the sentence over again, "this is not true. It is false. What parts are more false than others?" The odd thing that happens is that within days the program drops entirely and the lure disappears. It is the most bizarre thing I've ever experienced. Your story made me think of it and I thought I'd share. It really does work as a quick program buster.
I recommend anyone and everyone to try it. If their belief system is really true then what have they got to fear? But, if it's not true why do they want to cling to it?