Posted by:
Horsefeathers
(
)
Date: March 13, 2012 04:58PM
Jekyll,
My former PD is the second largest in Utah, in the SLC Valley.
We enforced the LAW, not civil matters.
I don't particularly care what your opinion of this is, I'm just trying to get across the fact that a civil restraining order IS NOT A SIMPLE MATTER NOR IS IT A POLICE MATTER statewide in Utah.
The idea that it's an easily obtained & simple solution to the problem of unwanted visits by church members is not true in this state.
I believe I said something to the effect that other places may differ.
This was not a matter of my old PD not serving its population, it was a matter of NO LAW BEING BROKEN ON A CIVIL RESTRAINING ORDER, which means there was NOTHING we COULD do about such a violation, beyond making a closed case report which would go straight into the record files with no followup or action.
Unless you've been directly involved for many years with criminal & civil law, in THIS state, you're totally uninformed on how things work in that area.
Which further renders your opinion meaningless.
As you've seen, Cheryl does not live in Utah.
I do.
Filing or not filing for a civil restraining order IN UTAH will achieve the same result as far as police are concerned.
A civil restraining order is exactly that- civil.
We CANNOT enforce a law that does not exist, and violation of a civil order is not in itself a law here.
In those cases where the civil order was obtained in ignorance in domestic abuse situations, we did advise the holder of the proper process, which was to obtain a domestic violence ex parte protective order, which does have teeth, and which police can & do enforce. There's a law that allows police to arrest immediately on violation of such, and I did, many times.
In those relatively rare cases where the complainant waived a restraining order at us and it was a matter that did not involve DV, (contrary to the impression some statements made by Cheryl have given, our courts don't hand 'em out like candy), we advised the civil order holder of the proper process, which was to get back with the issuing judge.
Understand that if the situation was violent, there was a risk of harm, or there was some actual law being broken, we took appropriate action.
If it was a case of "My ex-husband came onto my property and violated this CIVIL restraining order, I want him arrested!", if he was gone by the time we got there, no threats or laws broken, and it was not a DV PROTECTIVE order, we could write it up as a trespass (not an RO violation), the report would filter through to a followup detective who could screen with a prosecutor for prosecution IF the ex had been clearly told not to be on the complainant's property, and at some point down the road he might get a summons to appear on a CRIMINAL charge of trespass. Not an RO violation.
If the ex was still there, we could issue a misdemeanor citation for trespass (if he'd been previously told not to come back) and tell him to leave. Or, if he'd not been advised that visits would result in a trespass situation, we could tell him to leave.
If he was calm & left, with or without a ticket, that was it. If he was drunk, beligerent, uncooperative, he could be arrested on that basis.
If the ex had caused damage, there's a law for that.
If he'd been loud & out of control, there's a law for that.
If he'd made threats, there's a law for that.
If he'd assaulted anybody, there's a law for that.
If he was intoxicated, there's a law for that.
If he'd stolen something, there's a law for that.
If he'd merely violated the civil order, there IS NO LAW for that.
All of which left the complainant with a worthless piece of paper & the time spent to get it totally wasted.
As I also said above, there are other statutes & ordinances on the books that may apply to some forms of harassment. Trespass is a statute that can frequently be applied to repetitive visits by the same person once warned to stay off the property, but not generally against an organization. There can be exceptions.
I'm in no way saying that the police will do nothing if a situation is bad enough, or if actual laws are being broken, but the civil order just isn't enforceable by LE.
Whether you like it or not, police enforce LAW in Utah, not wishes.
And Cheryl may be quite right in saying she knows people who have made police reports in Utah. But, that means nothing.
A report can be turned in Active or Closed. If closed, no further action taken.
Even if Open, if a detective puts in a reasonable amount of effort without being able to locate the suspect, or if the city or county prosecutor declines to prosecute, the case is closed out.
There may be smaller municipalities that enact ordinances that go further, but statewide, no.
I'm offering people on this site information on how the law works here in an effort to avoid somebody getting the idea that a civil RO is a viable and easy solution to unwanted church visits.
The best way to avoid or reduce those is to simply be aggressive with these people when they do show up.
Grow a spine, tell them in no uncertain terms to get the hell away from you and/or your proprty, and not to return.
It's a source of perpetual bewilderment to me in reading some of the stories people post here about allowing such visits to continue by being "nice" or by hiding in their own homes when the doorbell rings.
STAND UP FOR YOURSELF!
If you can't or won't, then YOU are as much of a problem as the corporation is.
In that case, don't figure on obtaining a little piece of paper to do for you something you're not willing to do for yourself.
If your state has a different RO process, try it if you want, but for the benefit of fellow Utah citizens, don't count on it here.